Naval Combat can a small ship beat a bigger...

**harryRiedl** · April 17, 2009, 05:41 PM

If all things are equal. i ask this because by 6th Rate got attacked by a Galleon and i was wondering if it was possible to come out on top or is it futile. Any tips appreciated

**caralampio** · April 17, 2009, 06:26 PM

You might pull it off but it is unlikely. Galleons are very hard to sink. A fifth rate or even better a fourth might have a better chance.

**Prof** · April 17, 2009, 06:28 PM

Actually...I'm a little ashamed to say this...an AI controlled light galley has once sunk a second rate.

Also for example the constitution can take on a 3rd rate and sometimes it is even superior to a second rate (that's more luck based though)

**the_mango55** · April 17, 2009, 10:48 PM

Normally larger ships will win. If you have a smaller ship you might try staying infront of them and manuvering to get off a broadside of chainshot when you get far enough ahead of them. This will probably be very effective against galleons, since they are some of the slowest in the game.

Originally Posted by Prof

Actually...I'm a little ashamed to say this...an AI controlled light galley has once sunk a second rate.

Also for example the constitution can take on a 3rd rate and sometimes it is even superior to a second rate (that's more luck based though)

The Constitution is an upgraded 24lb frigate

It's simply more powerful than a 3rd rate, even in a broadside to broadside fight.

**pchalk** · April 17, 2009, 10:50 PM

Originally Posted by Prof

Actually...I'm a little ashamed to say this...an AI controlled light galley has once sunk a second rate.

Also for example the constitution can take on a 3rd rate and sometimes it is even superior to a second rate (that's more luck based though)

hehe i had something close to this, i went 5v4 (Austria v Barbary States); they had 4 damaged Light galleys (one didnt even have guns) , I had 4 4th rates and a galley. Lost one of the 4th rates. pissed me off. Same day took on a pirate fluyt with 3 4th rates and a fluyt. Lost two 4th rates. I wanted to capture that fluyt but it ended up sinking too.

well ive concluded that im pretty noob at naval stuff still

**Nastyvale** · April 18, 2009, 02:22 AM

Basically never leave port with anything lighter than a 4th rate especially when facing galleys. Not due to their gun number but their hull strength to withstand the enormous firepower that the galleys have. I tend to scuttle anything smaller than a 6th rate in the first turn. On the contrary when I'm playing the Ottomans I use massed expendable light galley fleets and it usually works out.

I'd rather not build massed galleys when I'm playing a European faction because it's almost cheating...

**harryRiedl** · April 18, 2009, 08:19 AM

so its very difficult to get astern of the galleon the superiority in guns really kills. Can't go 4th as still early game and the flyths are too far away to intervene. So stay ahead of the prow is the plan

**fluffstalker** · April 18, 2009, 10:56 AM

If your using vanilla, no. If your using darthmod, only if you really know what your doing, and have the wind and luck on your side. Still not a good idea. Large ships still turn and fire with crazy percision so trying to "dance" around a large ship with a frigate is asking to get spanked.

**Seamless** · April 18, 2009, 11:38 AM

Originally Posted by fluffstalker

If your using vanilla, no. If your using darthmod, only if you really know what your doing, and have the wind and luck on your side. Still not a good idea. Large ships still turn and fire with crazy percision so trying to "dance" around a large ship with a frigate is asking to get spanked.

You don't have to "dance" to utilize your smaller ships' mobility advantage. Just think things through, and pick them apart with patience and good timing/planning. Oh and that's with Darthmod. Without, don't even bother. Have the bigger ship or lose, those are your choices with vanilla.

**Silius Saurus** · April 18, 2009, 12:14 PM

In theory, you might be able to keep out of the Galleon's firing arc, and shred her rigging with chain shot. If you're lucky and careful, in theory, you could demast her, and then cross her T, and pound the beJesus out of her until she strikes her colors.

Keep in mind that you probably won't be able to board her, and if she gets a good broadside into you, you're a dead duck.

**green tea** · April 18, 2009, 01:21 PM

Someone once made this "Master and Commander"-mod for the demo. It was a 6-rate against I think a 4 rate. There I used the tactic described here (staying in the wind and slowing the enemy down with chainshot). Then, when the enemy was demasted, I used roundshots to break the hull and this small shots to kill the crew, and attacked from behind. I think with a galleon it will be easier to stay out of the galleons fire, because it is slower.

**Seamless** · April 18, 2009, 08:23 PM

Originally Posted by green tea

Someone once made this "Master and Commander"-mod for the demo. It was a 6-rate against I think a 4 rate. There I used the tactic described here (staying in the wind and slowing the enemy down with chainshot). Then, when the enemy was demasted, I used roundshots to break the hull and this small shots to kill the crew, and attacked from behind. I think with a galleon it will be easier to stay out of the galleons fire, because it is slower.

I JUST watched that movie. Definitely in my top 3 war films just because it's so authentic.

To tie that in with this discussion, immediately after watching it I played a naval battle as a 6th rate vs. a 5th rate. I deployed windward, and made a bee-line towards the enemy frigate. It fired it's broadside while my bow was straight at it, largely reducing it's effectiveness. I then gave it my own at close range and parallel to it. Turned about, gave it the fresh broadside at range and headed into the wind. After a while I was back up windward of it and repeated that maneuver. This time it boarded me but I had been working the same side of it's hull this whole time and it only took a few more broadsides to sink her. Felt good.

**HawkDreams** · April 18, 2009, 07:38 PM

Sigh... I know I am still tryig to learn Navy battles. I had 2 light galleys kick my 4th and 6th rate butts! If I could have managed to get a bead on them they would have been blasted, but they were too fast for me. Now I keep a couple of lighter fast ships with my heavies and use them as bait. Hee! Hee! I am still much better at land battles though!