AI Stealing Sieges.

**Pahoo** · March 22, 2009, 12:21 AM

Apparently, an allied AI can come in and steal towns which you have under siege. I had Bavaria under siege as Austria. After a failed sally by Bavaria Wuttenberg came in and attacked the town and took it even though the city was still under siege by me!!!! Dirty thieving ally!

**J. Fishman** · March 22, 2009, 03:49 AM

There's no clear benefit to sieging in Empire. Defenders don't appear to take any attrition damage, and you don't build or need to build any siege gear to attack any town, so there's basically no reason not to simply attack outright, unless you don't actually have enough men, or simply not attack at all. This isn't Medieval, where you HAD to build siege gear if you didn't bring any and the defenders may soften up a bit if you attack. Unless your plan involves simply waiting them out, there's no reason not to simply outright attack.

**Hebrew_Hero** · March 22, 2009, 05:04 AM

they do take attrition damage. And, they do "sally" and attack you, nromally if they have more troops, I prefer to fight in a field rather then the town, so i want to be the defender in any town battle.

Also the AI stealing a town during a siege, EVEN IF YOUR THE MAIN ATTACKER as in if you initiate the attack they still get the town. Im thinking if the allie is smaller, then they get it, or maybe its just default for the ally?

**StromRen** · March 22, 2009, 05:07 AM

I always siege, sometimes you can get the city without a fight when they surrender

**Mahatma Gandhi** · March 22, 2009, 05:48 AM

Yeah, I disagree w/Fisher as well, to an extent. If theres a significant force w/in the city sieging can work out to your benefit. I just log-off after capturing Amsterdam as French following a 3 day seige. I kept forcing the issue hoping that he'd give up Ceylon/Carqcao, but instead they came out to assault spelling their doom. Simple trench works-stakes placed the AI at a significant disadvantage and I saved alot of lives because of it.

Stack vs Stack and the final tally was 450 to 120-140. Next turn, there were only 3-4 left to defend when I went in.

**René Artois** · March 22, 2009, 06:21 AM

On mine they dont take attrition damage. but I do! thats what really pisses me off.

**Pahoo** · March 22, 2009, 12:18 PM

I realize this isn't medieval. I prefer to maintain the siege in order to force the sally under certain circumstances depending on the owner's troop number and type. As Hebrew Hero said, I also prefer the open ground to town combat.

I guess I felt while the city is surrounded by my men, even with the stake picket around the town belonging to me... how is it ever justified that someone else can come in and take the town ? It was a 3 way fight, (me and my ally vrs the defender) I had superior troop numbers also.

I suppose to avoid this problem I should've just attacked straight away, I just prefer to fight a different type of battle.

So, how is this justified ? Anyone know?

Thanks for the replies.

**Flavius Silvanus** · March 22, 2009, 12:28 PM

The same thing happened in RTW, but I'm can't remember is the AI could initiate if you were already seiging.

You had to go balls to the wall to get to the town square before the AI which always meant taking extra casualties.

**Pahoo** · March 22, 2009, 12:33 PM

Originally Posted by Flavius Silvanus

The same thing happened in RTW, but I'm can't remember is the AI could initiate if you were already seiging.

You had to go balls to the wall to get to the town square before the AI which always meant taking extra casualties.

You know, you probably have something there.

Its been so long since I've had an ally involved in my wars I forgot all about that.

Thanks!

**Aykis16** · March 22, 2009, 01:51 PM

I've seen them take attrition damage, although not much. And the AI tends to sally within the next turn as well so they usually don't even give you the chance to stay put. That for me, makes seiging worthless and I usually just attack outright.

**Kazang** · March 22, 2009, 01:53 PM

After you defeat the sally you have to re-siege the town, it will still be the same number of turns left till surrender as when they attacked. So you dont lose any time.

Not sure if this is bug or feature but it means that you have to re-seige immediately or any allied AI forces will ninja the region from you. I normally just attack it outright after i defeat the defenders sally.

**SuperStick** · March 22, 2009, 01:59 PM

They never friken surrender =(

**Pahoo** · March 22, 2009, 02:26 PM

Originally Posted by Kazang

After you defeat the sally you have to re-siege the town, it will still be the same number of turns left till surrender as when they attacked. So you dont lose any time.

Not sure if this is bug or feature but it means that you have to re-seige immediately or any allied AI forces will ninja the region from you. I normally just attack it outright after i defeat the defenders sally.

I have noticed this before also.

However, what happened in my situation was a bit different.

- I ended my turn, town is under siege.
- Bavaria on its own turn sallies, and is defeated. They do still have military units visible in city.
- Wuttenberg's turn comes up and they attack Bavaria. My army shows up as reinforcements instead of actually being in the battle so I watch my whole army enter the battlefield one unit at a time.

So before my next turn I can still see the siege picket stakes surrounding the city, even while Wuttenberg takes the city.

**Skyline Pete** · March 22, 2009, 10:17 PM

Yeah this is annoying, but it happened in Medieval 2 as well. Whoever the attacker is (regardless of who is besieging) gets the city. It's only more noticable now because there's no need to wait a turn or two to build equipment, you can just go straight into it.

Personally I love besieging because if the AI lets you stay for more than a turn you go into defensive mode on the battle map and can build defenses.

**MyKingforahorse** · March 22, 2009, 11:58 PM

In fort sieges you have to go balls to the wall and be the first to claim the center. In open city sieges, I have yet to figure out how the (excuse my language here)

it figures out who gets the spoils of war.

IN autoresolves I've had it go both ways, where I've gotten the region and then other times where my ally has gotten the region.

And then in manual battles, I've had instances where I've gotten the region and others where they've gotten the region.

For the life of me, I just cannot figure out what system is being used to determine who gets what when where and why.

**the_mango55** · March 23, 2009, 08:17 AM

They do this to each other also.

As the ottomans the Russians had Georgia under siege, when all of a sudden the tiny faction above Georgia puts me under siege too! Neither actually captured the city though, I fought off the Russians and my relief army got there in time to save it from the others.

And they aren't even allies!

**TeutonicKnight** · March 23, 2009, 09:43 AM

There are three reasons I will conduct a seige rather than an immediate assault:

1) My troops are battered, and another turn or two will allow them to recover.

2) My seige train is still getting there. Often when I invade I will send troops forward without artillery support to invest the seige, and get the artillery there the next turn. This allows me to utilize speed to overwhelm the enemy. Of course, speed is relative.

3) For diplomatic points. The AI doesn't seem to become "aware" of the seige until the next turn, so by investing a town, I can often score better concessions from the AI on the following turn.

If you intend to take the town, and you've got the guns and the troops, I see no reason to wait for an assault, excepting the reasons above.