Is there any siege equipment? (Besides canons, if you count that as siege equipement)

[Thescorpionx]

Hey there,

I was restarting a GC, so i got alot of annoying advices for the beginning...I started a siege with france and the advisor told me to watchout for forsts when moving and using Canons and Siege equipment...

What does he actually mean by siege equipment?...Anything i am not aware of, or i forget to use...

There is canons for walls and the doors, or ropes for the walls...besides that anything else?..

It might be just a misunderstanding with that advice, but it did actually get me confused for a second, wondering if i was missing out on something..

Any help?

[Jaketh]

nope, just shoot the out of thier walls with howys and ur done

[Gothic Revenge]

Well, historically they also used "mines".... digging up to the defence than planting explosives and than "BOOM"..... and than storm the city! The Turks used this in Vienna! They used diggers in Rome Total War, shame something like this is not in Empire..... maybe in the next expansion kit.

[boerekovic]

Well, historically they also used "mines".... digging up to the defence than planting explosives and than "BOOM"..... and than storm the city! The Turks used this in Vienna! They used diggers in Rome Total War, shame something like this is not in Empire..... maybe in the next expansion kit.

You are right, but the time needed to dig saps like the Turks did would overstretch any scaled gametime.

[Godless Pickle]

And make a siege pointless for a defender.

[Aradius]

It's not too difficult to assume that your pioneers dig tunnels under the walls while you maintain the siege for several turns.
That represents the necessary time better, anyway.
So besieging a city for several turns = cutting off supplies, undermining the walls, general bombardement and everything else that forces the defender to surrender.

[Nordmann]

Most wars that took place during Empire's time period did not involve sieges, rather, they would have taken the form of open battles, which generally decided the fate of any settlements in the area. It's also worth noting that most towns/cities no longer had defensive walls.

[Lord Justin]

It's also worth noting that most towns/cities no longer had defensive walls.

See Lee1026's post and Ondaderthad's post, and then realize that in the game you don't fight on city defenses but at forts which surround cities, which is a good emulation of period sieges.

I also like the idea of mines but they might screw up balance, and as far as I know this was a pretty rare technique. I imagine it could only be done under certain conditions.

Anyway, OP, what the advice is talking about is ropes and the like. Like I always say, just because it doesn't batter or sap doesn't mean it's not siege equipment! Actually this is the first time I've ever said that, but I think from now on I'll start saying it more.

[Lee1026]

Actually, this is the golden age of defensive warfare. Read up on the era - most of the key battles were sieges one after another. Field battles were the exception, not the rule.

[Ondaderthad]

Actually, this is the golden age of defensive warfare. Read up on the era - most of the key battles were sieges one after another. Field battles were the exception, not the rule.

See some of Vauban fortifications very nice aerial pictures in France:
http://lechenet.free.fr/Reportages/vauban/vauban.htm

Between 1667 and 1707, Vauban upgraded the fortifications of around 300 cities.
He directed the building of 37 new fortresses, and fortified military harbours.

[Tropical Coke]

The Turks lost in Vienna.

[The_Dude]

The Turks lost in Vienna.

yeah, that and the fact that defenders usually wouldnt simply let you dig like the 7 dwarfs all day but would try to undermine and collapse your tunnels. afaik during the siege of vienna there was also quite a lot fighting in those tunnels.
anyway, i think this would be kind of hard to represent and game, plus ofc it would really make defending a bit pointless.

[Gothic Revenge]

The Turks lost in Vienna.

They did indeed loose...... but they managed to blow a breach into the city wall using a mine. And they would have won, if the polish "winged hussars" would have not arrived just in time and flanked them.

Being besieged and stuck inside a city was in those times never a good idea. So it was always unfair for the besieged, as the besieger always had the chances in his favour, so long no outside reinforcements arrived in time to help.

[JCR]

Yeah, the polish winged Hussars did it all alone...
Are you guys all brainwashed by Kaczynsky??

The poles were one THIRD of the relief army (and even within the polish army, winged hussars were a minority), with contingents from all over the holy roman empire. Only Brandenburg arrived too late for the actual Battle of Vienna.
The polish contribution was important, but they didn't do it all by themselves.

But large sieges were relatively rare. In the seven years war, the Siege of Prague was a prussian failure and later campaigns in Silesia often involved fortresses, but rarely were there any direct attacks on them.
The prussian siege of Schweidnitz was one of the few direct assaults that were successful.
Mostly a fortress was besieged and the defender forced to withdraw.

[Singleton Mosby]

Mining would be interesting in ETW but I suppose a bit difficult to implement as you will also have to implement counter-mining.

There is another type of mining which I would like to see and which was used a lot. When the wall was breached the attacker formed a 'forlorn hope'. The defender tried to fortify the breach and mine the breach. I would like to see the AI mine these places before I move my men in.

[Rorarii]

Mining would be interesting in ETW but I suppose a bit difficult to implement as you will also have to implement counter-mining.

There is another type of mining which I would like to see and which was used a lot. When the wall was breached the attacker formed a 'forlorn hope'. The defender tried to fortify the breach and mine the breach. I would like to see the AI mine these places before I move my men in.

Alot of mining was used over the eons of warfare unfortunately it'shard to produce in meshed landscapes .. unless you add ground layer upon ground layer? but that's more trouble than it's worth. RTW mining looked quick and expedient - cheap and dirty but kinda did the job. unfortunately no counter mining was possible.

In ETW i would like to have seen trenches dug but that would have taken too long for a battle to conclude. And if we go down the trenches path then WWI here we come! And i'm off looking for a new game!

R

[The_Dude]

And they would have won, if the polish "winged hussars" would have not arrived just in time and flanked them.

ah, thats not even half the truth.
the army that broke the Siege consisted of Troops from Venice, Bavaria, Saxony, Franken, Schwaben, Baden, Oberhessen and Poland. The Polish Cavalry only attacked after the Battle had been raging for 12h allready.

heres the memorial plate

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

[Gothic Revenge]

ah, thats not even half the truth.
the army that broke the Siege consisted of Troops from Venice, Bavaria, Saxony, Franken, Schwaben, Baden, Oberhessen and Poland. The Polish Cavalry only attacked after the Battle had been raging for 12h allready.

heres the memorial plate

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Oh, we are well going of line here... but anyway.... yes, many others were involved as you listed..... which I did not mention (only not to make this a history discussion), and yes the polish did not do it on their own and they arrived late (polish timing!)..... but they did tip the balance against the turks. It doesn't matter if the turks blew a too small breach into the walls of Vienna, which was (in a way) easy to defend as the turks were funneled into a small killing corridor, if they were already decimated through desease before fighting broke out, weakend and demoralized by fighting on more than one front against all the other european reenforcements. However, they did piss their pants seeing the winged hussars comming down the mountain slopes charging into their rear and flanks and shortly after that the turks did route.........

Nice find with the Memorial plate:

The first being thanked is the King of Poland
Second the Duke of Lorraine
Third the Elector of Saxony along with the Elector of Bavaria
Fourth the Sovereign of Waldeck
Fith both Markgrafen of Baden
Sixth all other army commanders leading the troops of Emporer Leopold 1.

[War&Politics]

I read somewhere that it is beyond the limitations of the game engine to have simultaneous land and sea battles, because it would have been really cool to shell a city with your navy while your troops storm the land side. Maybe in the next TW game!

[The_Dude]

Nice find with the Memorial plate:

The first being thanked is the King of Poland
Second the Duke of Lorraine
Third the Elector of Saxony along with the Elector of Bavaria
Fourth the Sovereign of Waldeck
Fith both Markgrafen of Baden
Sixth all other army commanders leading the troops of Emporer Leopold 1.

heh, ive seen it in reality a couple of times, after all, i live in vienna