Basic Questions of Organization

[Blau&Gruen]

The following has been posted at various other places by me in one or the other form. As it might be worth of a broader interest. I allow me to make an own thread about. Feel free to discuss or to complement.

R e m a r k:

CA uses in ETW a modelling of infantry rgt in a scale 1:10 on ultra.

O v e r v i e w:

Rgt Inf (administrative organization)
(- battalion)
-- company

Rgt Inf (tactical organization)
- battalion
-- full division (company sized body)
(--- half division)
---- peloton/platoon*

Bat Inf (administrative)
- 4 companies of musketeers, 1 company of grenadiers

Bat Inf (tactical)
- 16 small peloton of musketeers (in 4 full divisons) + 1 company/full division of grenadiers
- 8 large peloton of musketeers (in 4 full divisions) + 1 company/full division of grenadiers

Gren bat (ad hoc)
- are formed out of the Gren companies of 2 rgt inf
-- 4 companies of gren
--- gren are distributed among the musketeer pelotons (between 1670 until shortly before 1700), then gren are divided like the musketeers in peloton)

Numbers (including staff and aides):
Rgt Inf 1300-2400 men
Bat Inf 500-900 men
Company Gren 100 to 150 men
Peloton 30-40 men (earlier, smaller type = quarter of a full division)
Peloton 60-80 men (later, larger type = half division)

Cav Rgt (administrative)

Cav Rgt (tactical organization)
- 4 to 6 squadrons

Numbers Cav:
Rgt about 1000 horsemen
Squadron 140-190 horsemen

N o t e:

*The peloton (or platoon) is the basic tactical fire "unit" in the 18th century. The peloton is formed ad hoc on the battlefield by dividing the battalion into 16 later 8 teams of the same size (counting through the ranks). The peloton replaces earlier tactical fire forms such as the enfilade and the counter-march. The early pelotons have about the size of tactical units that fired in the enfilade and the counter-march (20-30 men) normally under the cover of pikemen or adjected to pikemen units.

[geala]

Nice information. But you should add that it is more or less the Prussian organisation. It differed from other nations. For example the French had (at some time) 13 companies in a battalion with 12 pelotons for firing.

[Blau&Gruen]

It is Prussian and Austrian mainly Silesian and Seven-Years-War orientated tactical organization.

Thank for your remark with the French,

the French administrative organization of regiments was according to another text, I have read somewhere 17 companies (at least one grenadier company should be included here). I might be mistaken here.

I suppose if I am not misstaken then that your number represents not the same state of development of the structure of organization. If you could provide some further information that would be cool. It would be extremely strange if the french regiments of infantry kept the same administrative subdivsion between 1670 and 1789.

I would also be interest even more about the tactical organization, especially the fire tactic related subdivisions would ben interesting.

The 13 or 17 companies should be per regiment, I think. 12 pelotons as the subdivison of a French battalion of infantry fits well in if you consider that the French battalion was uselly smaller than the Prussian ones (about two hundred to three hundred men less).

I would propose:

French Rgt Inf (administrative)
- 13 companies

French Rgt Inf (tactical)
- 2 bat
-- 12 peloton per bat

If 1 bat has 540 men, then 1 peloton à 45 men.

This is within the range of the older smaller peloton type before 1750.

[geala]

I'm not a specialist for the French army unfortunately (and also not for others ). Most of my information in this case comes from Anatomy of Victory from Nosworthy. The book is great but gives only examples. Matters changed seemingly quite often. In 1755 the French changed the number of companies per battalion from 13 (12 fusiliers + 1 grenadier) to 17. It was really per battalion, the French companies were smaller than the Prussians.

I presume there are other people who know better of the French and other nations and could add some information.

[Blau&Gruen]

You see you know much.

1755!

bat or rgt

I am not sure if you're right here because. Traditionally a batallion is a half of a regiment.

If your battalions had 13 or 17 companies, then the regiments were extremely large even if the companies were smaller than prussian companies.

It is a common missunderstanding in literature.

Compare

Austria: 1 bat = 4 full-divisions/(companies) = 16 pelotons = about 800 men

Prussia: 1 bat = 4 full-divisions/(companies) = 8 pelotons = about 600 men

France: 1 bat = ........................ ? ................ = 12 pelotons = about 600 men

The reason for this missunderstanding is that the company is a name for an administrative body but sometimes it is also used for tactical bodies.

In your case the French company would have about the size of an Austrian peloton which had about half the size of a Prussian peloton.

I assume the French peloton has about the size of an Austrian peloton and your source may have mixed the terminology.

It is possible that your source refers not to a tactical organization but to an adiminstrative organization of a battalion of a regiment including training units, units for levé purposes etc.

[CBR]

The Austrians switched from 4 to 6 companies per battalion by 1757. The Prussians had 5 musketeer companies per battalion.

The French companies were rather small and was about 40 men each. So yes the 13-17 companies are per battalion which would put the battalion paper strength of about 710 men(for 17 companies that is)


CBR

[Quintus Hortensius Hortalus]

well, basicly your assumption is wrong. In ETW 1 man represents 3 or 4 in reality. So 1 unit is representing 1 Regiment. Furthermore a platoon was not a standing formation in a company of a bataillion in the 18th century. A platoon was more "fire-group" (also called "half-company"). Anyway the most important formations in the 18th century were bataillions and regiments (in some states 1 regiment had only 1 bataillion). A company was not provided to act as indepent military formation, ist main goal was to keep the men in line and ease the execution of orders.