Playing SS while Empire's bugs are worked out

[x0teutonic0x]

After dealing with the BS that is Empire, it became even more clear to me how great SS is. Don't get me wrong, Empire will be great once it's patched and modded, but for now, SS is the king. Just consider the map..in previous TW games, and in Empire, the landscape on the campaign map is a joke. The Alps are like a pimple, the Appallachians look like tiny hills. But then you go and look at Georgia or Switzerland in SS, and you feel like you're actually traversing those huge mountain ranges. And unlike M2TW or Empire, it actually takes like 20 turns to conquer Scandinavia. It just feels so cheap when you overrun the entire British Isles or all of Italy in like 8 turns.

[_Belisarius_]

Ya. I don't know what it is but I just can't get into Empires... maybe its the generic armies that are available. I dunno maybe shogun 2???

[x0teutonic0x]

Yeah, I guess that just comes with the age though. The rule of European warfare by that time was massed lines of infantry. The only variety you can find is in cavalry really. The biggest part of my interest in Empire is in doing warfare in the Americas. But of course, the thing is buggy as heck in the New World, not to mention that there's no AI naval invasions...kinda undermines the whole term of "empire."

[runtheplacered]

Yeah, I guess that just comes with the age though. The rule of European warfare by that time was massed lines of infantry. The only variety you can find is in cavalry really. The biggest part of my interest in Empire is in doing warfare in the Americas. But of course, the thing is buggy as heck in the New World, not to mention that there's no AI naval invasions...kinda undermines the whole term of "empire."

I really can't imagine how a game like this passes any sort of QA when there's no enemy naval invasions. It boggles my mind.

[toluas]

Ya. I don't know what it is but I just can't get into Empires... maybe its the generic armies that are available. I dunno maybe shogun 2???

Agreed! Me neither.

Well chosen name, btw!

[_Belisarius_]

Agreed! Me neither.

Well chosen name, btw!

Thank you. I just got done reading the Belisarius books by david drake and eric flint. I would really really enjoy a shogun 2.. Its a smaller map but I really enjoyed the art in the game.

[Caesar Clivus]

Lets not turn this into an Empire bashing thread or I'll have to lock the thread.

[x0teutonic0x]

Lets not turn this into an Empire bashing thread or I'll have to lock the thread.

Dang buddy, the power you wield must be intoxicating.

Really though, I was actually praising that game for the most part, but then I spent most of my post praising SS even more.

[Santiago de Pola]

I would strongly encourage people to download the 6.2 patch! The improvements are numerous, and Gracul's improved CAI is the best I came across..a real challenge!

[Cynik]

I think the vanilla games are getting worse tbh, Rome and MTW2 was fairly playable and borderline enjoyable, though I can only ever truly enjoy these games with great mods such as SS. I've only recently started playing SS and boy, it truly is the best mtw2 mod out there atm.

[runtheplacered]

I would strongly encourage people to download the 6.2 patch! The improvements are numerous, and Gracul's improved CAI is the best I came across..a real challenge!

I haven't played SS for a bit, and want to try it again. And I see people talking about 6.2, but I only see a link for 6.1. Where can I find the 6.2 patch?

[_Belisarius_]

Ya. I would LOVE to download 6.2 but I want certain submods and I'll wait till they are compatible.

[Medieval PossuM]

I haven't played SS for a bit, and want to try it again. And I see people talking about 6.2, but I only see a link for 6.1. Where can I find the 6.2 patch?

submod-forum.

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=204562

but it´s not an official patch and it does seem to change gameplay from what I´ve read, so it´s not just bugfixes
I´ve just recently installed SS anyways, so I´ll finish a game or too and then try the patch

[delra]

Bash bash bash. Bash.

Seriously though, I never liked vanilla CA products, Rome and add-ons were a historical and gameplay disasters, M2TW Ai made me abandon the game for two years before I discovered SS and started playing again. Kingdoms I bought only to play SS 5, 6 and maybe 7 in future.

I think about ETW not like it was a computer game or a finished product. I think about it like it was a brand new modding platform that will allow people to base really good new mods (of all eras!) on it.

Think how much mods like Broken Crescent, Stainless Steel or Third Age improve vanilla M2TW (10x? 20x? 50x?) and now look at ETW... and imagine it improved 50x.

That's why you should buy ETW, to play mods based on it. And that's why you should play ETW for a while, you will later appreciate modders work more.

[Medieval PossuM]

Bash bash bash. Bash.

Seriously though, I never liked vanilla CA products, Rome and add-ons were a historical and gameplay disasters, M2TW Ai made me abandon the game for two years before I discovered SS and started playing again. Kingdoms I bought only to play SS 5, 6 and maybe 7 in future.

I think about ETW not like it was a computer game or a finished product. I think about it like it was a brand new modding platform that will allow people to base really good new mods (of all eras!) on it.

Think how much mods like Broken Crescent, Stainless Steel or Third Age improve vanilla M2TW (10x? 20x? 50x?) and now look at ETW... and imagine it improved 50x.

That's why you should buy ETW, to play mods based on it. And that's why you should play ETW for a while, you will later appreciate modders work more.

still, it feels wrong to give CA 50 bucks for it, when the modders get 0.
while the modders are working on making CA´s last game decent, CA works on the next title.
and the next title has better graphics, so noone wants to play the old one anymore, even if it´s modded.
and then history repeats

stainless steel may be a exception in that pattern, but I still don´t really like CA´s business model: get paid for something unfinished, let others finish it for free

[Gnomer87]

Bash bash bash. Bash.

Seriously though, I never liked vanilla CA products, Rome and add-ons were a historical and gameplay disasters, M2TW Ai made me abandon the game for two years before I discovered SS and started playing again. Kingdoms I bought only to play SS 5, 6 and maybe 7 in future.

I think about ETW not like it was a computer game or a finished product. I think about it like it was a brand new modding platform that will allow people to base really good new mods (of all eras!) on it.

Think how much mods like Broken Crescent, Stainless Steel or Third Age improve vanilla M2TW (10x? 20x? 50x?) and now look at ETW... and imagine it improved 50x.

That's why you should buy ETW, to play mods based on it. And that's why you should play ETW for a while, you will later appreciate modders work more.

While you got a point, it doesn't sitt right with me that I am supposed to pay for a unfinished product, the entire total war series is like that. You need a bunch of incredibly talented modders to fix the games for you, in MTW2 case SS ofcourse.

Now empire isn't all bad. The naval battles are incredibly fun, albeit way to generic, to little difference in ships. Land battles is just a joke. Tried attacking a city? Reminds you of this really old 3d tank game were the towns look like the architect decided to put structures entirely at random while giving up on the idea of roads and stuff completely.

[Smikis]

While you got a point, it doesn't sitt right with me that I am supposed to pay for a unfinished product, the entire total war series is like that. You need a bunch of incredibly talented modders to fix the games for you, in MTW2 case SS ofcourse.

Now empire isn't all bad. The naval battles are incredibly fun, albeit way to generic, to little difference in ships. Land battles is just a joke. Tried attacking a city? Reminds you of this really old 3d tank game were the towns look like the architect decided to put structures entirely at random while giving up on the idea of roads and stuff completely.

it takes 3 years ~ for ca to create new game... it takes 2~years for moders expand that game about 5 times.. and improve about 10 times..

so i wonder how exactly unskilled is ca team.. apart engine making team.. since apart engine.. ( which is sadly poor in etw.. did i mention SLI DOES NOT WORK , as sli owner.. i cant even force my self to play.. when i have to lower settings and game still runs like , considering that both nvidia and ati helps game companies with games.. ca messed up big way in my eyes, even mtw2 supports sli.. and it comes from age.. where sli was "rare " to age in etw.. where 50% gamers have sli/cf ) game doesnt have much to offer..

if it etw were mmogrp, it would be buried already.. like many released in last/this year..

[Kjertesvein]

And unlike M2TW or Empire, it actually takes like 20 turns to conquer Scandinavia. It just feels so cheap when you overrun the entire British Isles or all of Italy in like 8 turns.

I need 100 turns to conquer british isles in DLV . Now that is what you call hard.

[x0teutonic0x]

I need 100 turns to conquer british isles in DLV . Now that is what you call hard.

Really? That sounds like my kind of game. I feel like the thing that the vanilla versions lack is a sense of history. I mean, it took England centuries to conquer all of the British Isles. I guess you have to consider that TW games are geared toward military conquest. In real life, politics and economics are just as crucial. I'll have to give DLV a look-see.

[Kjertesvein]

Really? That sounds like my kind of game. I feel like the thing that the vanilla versions lack is a sense of history. I mean, it took England centuries to conquer all of the British Isles. I guess you have to consider that TW games are geared toward military conquest. In real life, politics and economics are just as crucial. I'll have to give DLV a look-see.

DLV has been upgraded from 5.7 til 6.1, so there is ALOT of new stuff in it to make it harder so England might be harder.
I played Sicily 1180 -> 1320 A.D. (2 turns pr. year)
Then the Dark ages shocked in: Took half my settlements. Killed half my population in the plauge. Then a civil war that was close to ruin my already damaged kindome in half, b/c of poor judgement. I had to gather a meeting in the capital. Several of the nobel where sent to jail, b/c low bribing found.

• 9 of totaly 18 settlements fell to rioting naighbours.
• Half my populations died out.
• Lots of high ranking govenors died.
• Civil war resuted in that I had to send 50% of my govenors to jail.
• Interest % in the bank went down like a stone and my saving was lost(Savings, 50 000) aswell as my money (75 000).
• I got into dept, b/c I had poor logistic, gambled(-45 000) and loand(-30 000) to much money.

6X
He he, now that is hard. It's hard to even start again after the plauge. Sicely is considderd to be one of the more easy factions to play. Don't take my wrong. I bet SS i hard to, with the BAI+BGRV+RR+RRRRC++CBUR+BTG+DVD+PMS+ATV+AID and all the other mini mods.