- The Library -

[ray243]

I really think there is a need for people to avoid the Osprey books. Osprey books are not written for other historians, which can result in a poorer quality work and allow the authors to get away with all sorts of assumptions without backing it up.

If plenty of historians dismiss the Osprey books as unreliable, then any person who is really interested in history should avoid them I think. A person who isn't well-read about the topic that Osprey is discussing can be easily misled by them.

[Constantius]

Indeed all quotes and extracts should always be accompanied by the proper references e.g( Author ,date ,book ,publisher ,pages no.s) Obviously that's for academic referencing and this is for fun ,but certainly ,nobody should really say anything ,without at least saying were they got the information .

[Magister Militum Flavius Aetius]

Heres some from my library:
How the Barbarian Invasions shaped the modern world
enemies of rome
Roman Warfare
Rome and Her Enemies

[juvenus]

So, I just wanna check something: what can I expect from that book "Martijn Nicasie (1998)- ‘Twilight of Empire: The Roman army from the reign of Diocletian until the battle of Adrianople"? I'm about to buy it.
I'm particularly interested in whether it provides a good in-depth (as much as possible) account of numerous military operations on the Rhine and Danube?
Thanks

[ray243]

So, I just wanna check something: what can I expect from that book "Martijn Nicasie (1998)- ‘Twilight of Empire: The Roman army from the reign of Diocletian until the battle of Adrianople"? I'm about to buy it.
I'm particularly interested in whether it provides a good in-depth (as much as possible) account of numerous military operations on the Rhine and Danube?
Thanks

Same here. I tried to find it but it seems it is beyond my reach for now. Sigh, couldn't even get the library to purchase that book.

[Constantius]

I know what you mean its out of stock ,everywhere I'v looked.They are still taking orders on Oxbow books .So its not dicontinued or anything .I'll try the University later ,let you know .Here is a Review about Twilight of the Empie and other books you might be interested in .Be better informed to make your decsion .Hope it helps

[Valentinian Victor]

So, I just wanna check something: what can I expect from that book "Martijn Nicasie (1998)- ‘Twilight of Empire: The Roman army from the reign of Diocletian until the battle of Adrianople"? I'm about to buy it.
I'm particularly interested in whether it provides a good in-depth (as much as possible) account of numerous military operations on the Rhine and Danube?
Thanks

'Twilight of Empire' is probably one of the best books of its kind out there. It is unfortunately very difficult to obtain. Try an on-line search in Abel books or some other sites.

[juvenus]

Thanks for that review constantius! It's really useful. In the meantime, in an attempt to give my small contribution to this discussion I suggest this one:
"The Cambridge history of Greek and Roman Warfare volume 2:Rome from the late Republic to the late Empire".
I'm not from England but I have to say that every book with prefix "Cambridge" I've ever read was an excellent piece of work. This one is no exception. It provides such a great view into all aspects of military. Some of the most eminent names collaborated on this book, such are Hugh Elton, A. Goldsworthy, Michael Whitby, Philip Rance, etc.
To be honest, I'm surprised that you missed it so far. I don't know for the "Twilight of Empire" (I haven't read it yet), but this one, I'd say, definitely should be on the list.

[Constantius]

Thanks juvenus I'll take a look, your right about those eminent names

[julianus heraclius]

Twilight of Empire is available at one of our libraries and I have managed to photocopy some chapters, namely Chapter VI on the Roman army in the 4th Century and another chapter on battle tactics. I have to admit, that I didn't really learn anything new from the reading, though his breakdown of the roman army is good. Would I buy it if I could? YES.

[juvenus]

Thanks juvenus I'll take a look, your right about those eminent names

Sure, I highly recommend you to do so. Since you're probably very well informed about the Roman army, perhaps you won't learn too much. But, I'm definitely not an expert and this book was more than useful for me. It is structured around many chapters and each one is written by other historian. Personally, I find the chapter "The Battle" written by Philip Rance, along with some others, to be a first-class work.
Of course, there are several other Cambridge editions which concern the late Roman empire/army (I can post their names if you wish). I didn't manage to read them yet for those are quite some books (the one I mentioned is 567 pages!).

[ray243]

Paul Erdkamp's A companion to the Roman army also covers quite a bit on the late Roman army.

[Constantius]

Yes please do post the others .You can never stop learning, theres always a different interpretation or new evidence .

[juvenus]

Ok then, as I said all Cambridge editions are to be regarded as high-class material. Many of these books are not 100% dedicated to the military stuff as they elaborately cover all aspects of the late Roman state (imperial dynasty, economics, social changes, religion, foreign policy, etc). However, every one of them has many chapters devoted to all aspects of the military and thus can be very useful.
1. Cambridge Ancient History: The Crisis of the Emipre 193-337
2. Cambridge Ancient History: The Late Empire 337-425
3. Cambridge Ancient History: The Late Antiquity 425-600
4. Cambridge Companion: The Age of Constantine (I've read it-EXCELLENT!)
5. Cambridge Companion: The Age of Justinian (it also covers a lot of the Late "Rome")

To make it clear, I have all of these books and many more. However, due to many real life obligations (studying, girls, football, gym, games) I didn't read them all yet. Since you're from England, you'll probably have no problem to get the Cambridge editions.


BUT, if you encounter any problems, my friend, just PM me........We'll think of something

[juvenus]

Paul Erdkamp's A companion to the Roman army also covers quite a bit on the late Roman army.

I have this one as well....Didn't read it as of yet, but it looks good indeed.

This is an invaluable detailed reading of Adrianople and a useful corrective to the Osprey book - anyone wishing to go deeper into the debate would find much interesting material here:

Adrianople

Two points arise out of my own admittedly amateur research into this battle: where are the Saraceni foederate cavalry in the battle? Ammianus is always dismissive and reticent about Arab barbarians, and, also, in reference to the priest sent over to Valens with the two letters, I think I might have divined his identity but await further enlightenment from the scholars on this site! (p.s: I wonder if we should open a separate thread here?!)

My friend, +rep for this. I'd just recently saw this post and now I've finished reading. It's a great work. I've read the Osprey book, Campaign:Adrianople 378, but this essay brings new light on the issue.
And, I'm inclined to believe the author of this essay rather than Osprey. He provides some quite logical explanations.
Please, post more of such essays concerning the Late Roman army if you have. It seems that sometimes we can learn more from an essay than from a full book.

[Constantius]

Then I think you will find this interesting too.SORRY DELETE ME !! PLSE

[Constantius]

Then I think you will find this interesting too.

[juvenus]

Excellent!+rep

[Magister Militum Flavius Aetius]

+rep

[julianus heraclius]

Thought I would try to collect as many of the articles as possible to gether and have posted them in post #1. there is a limit of 10 attachments to a posting. SOme have been posted before but I thought it would be good to have in one location.