SGFNP--->Faction Overviews/Difficulty Levels

[Xtiaan72]

I want to compile player impressions on Faction Difficulty levels for all the factions for a new section of the SGFNP. This thread will hopefully lead to some lively discussion about which DLV factions are the hardest and which are easier and why...Some questions to get the ball rolling. You don't have to answer them all to contribute, just the first two. If you are knowledgeable about multiple factions bring them up in separate entries,please! Much thanks for helping improve the SGFNP

1. What Faction are your currently playing?

2. Do you play them Default DLV or Historical Campaign?

3. What difficulty are you playing on? + (Civ Style or Total war AI)

4. Is the Faction Very Easy, Easy, Moderate, Hard, or Very Hard compared to other DLV factions you've played?

5. What is your opinion of the faction's starting position/situation?

6. What rivals does the faction always end up at war with?

7. Which factions are potentially dependable allies/trading partners?

8. What are some early game strategies that have worked for you with that faction?

9. What are some strategies that don't work for the Faction?

Factions with write-ups*:

Armenia (Default)
Armenia (Historical)
Aztecs (Default)
Byzantines ( Historical)
England (Default)
Egypt (Historical)
France (Historical)
HRE (Default)
Hungary (Historical)
Ireland ( Default)
Kiev (Default)
Kingdom of Jerusalem ( Default)
Norway (Default)
Norway (Historical)
Poland (Historical)
Sicily ( Default)
Scotland (Default)
Spain ( Default)
Teutons ( Default)
Teutons ( Historical)
Turks (Historical)


* We need multiple write-ups for each faction and campaign type. The average of the opinions on difficulty will be used for the guide but all write-ups will be included!

Contributors:

LLAMAD
Barendz
Ivanhoax
Hotcobbler
Blackleaf
Ahlerich
Omar Nelson B.
Ghoul1221
RYOFU
2D-RON
JON
SHADRACH
Aneximanes
Mac-Picsou
baligant
Pinowarrior
Junpei
Nice
Aneximanes
Sarkiss
Bacus
Nice

[Barendz]

1. What Faction are your currently playing?

Im currently playing the Byzantines

2. Do you play them Default DLV or Historical Campaign?

Historical

3. What difficulty are you playing on?

VH/VH

4. Is the Faction Very Easy, Easy, Moderate, Hard, or Very Hard compared to other DLV factions you've played?

Id say they are easy/very easy. Im new to DLV and its one of the few factions Ive been able to maintain in a campaign, along with HRR. I havent tried them all so it could be there are easier ones.

5. What is your opinion of the faction's starting position/situation?

The starting position is the best on the map as far as I can tell. With Constantinople already a huge city and Nicaea a fortress with drill square plus a lot of other cities and some castles to develop. There are a lot of rebel settlements around, especially in turkey so no need to go to war with other faction early in the game.

6. What rivals does the faction always end up at war with?

Ive played a campaign with the Byzantines twice and both times I ended up in war with Egypt. Afaik they need Limassol for their end goal so they show up on Cypress at some point. At the start of the game youre at war with Turkey but both times they came to me to offer a truce. Hungary is usually not friendly either. In my current campaign Ive just hit the first dark ages and Venice and Hungary declared war. To my surprise Turkey didnt bother (so far) which was anoying because I anticipated on that and stationed most of my troops at the Turkish border .

7. Which factions are potentially dependable allies/trading partners?

I am currently allied with multiple eastern faction (dont ask for names, I have no good memory for impossible to understand russian faction names ) Kiev, Novgorod and the Armenians I think. They did not break their alliances with me when the dark ages hit so I guess they are pretty reliable although I had to break my alliance with novgorod because Kiev attacked them. Because you can trade with these factions over the Black sea your economy doesnt break down completely when the dark ages hit.

8. What are some early game strategies that have worked for you with that faction?

Ofcourse setting up our economy is top priority in the beginning but it is fairly simply due to the large amount of settlements. When I had captured all the rebel forts within my territory I started capturing rebel settlements in turkey and some in eastern Europe. I avoided getting at war with other factions but perhaps I could have handled that aswell. After I captured 6-7 cities in turkey and upgraded them a little my population started to grow rapidly so I could recruit a lot of troops. You will need them to complete the end goal because that includes multiple cities and castles in the middle east and the three core settlements of Egypt: Cairo, Alexandrie and Gaza.

9. What are some strategies that don't work for the Faction?

So far I havent done anything terribly wrong but I also think my way was not optimal.

I think Basileia Rhomaion (Byzantines) is a good option for starting DLVers (like myself). The good starting position and large number of starting regions makes it a relativly easy faction, relativly because I still head banged the walls a couple of times in frustration

Barendz

[Xtiaan72]

Very cool right up man... I take it you are playing historical campaign?...I should add that as a question because the starting situations are very different default/historical...

I think in BIZ case, they are much harder in Default than Historical...

I'm surprised Turkey didn't come at you early too and that Turkey wasn't a default opponent during Dark Ages...

[Barendz]

Yes thats correct, its the historical campaign. I forgot to mention that. Edited it in now.

I was indeed surprised by the Turks, I was a little afraid of them because according to the turn overview window they were the strongest military force on the map. Instead Venice declared war and tried to capture Raguza. I got reinforcements their in time to save it but only beause they besieged the castle an extra turn to build more siege equipment.

[Xtiaan72]

I'd be curious to know how hard you found Biz on Default after playing Historical...

I think you are right, Biz is a good place to start for new players...especially on Historical...

In general, Default is more balanced that Historical at the start (as intended)

The difference between factions starting power has a lot more variation in Historical.

For instance, I've never tried playing them but I imagine Armenia would be extremely difficult to play in the historical campaign. Tiny country trapped between two super-powers.

[Barendz]

I am kind of a realism freak so I prefer the historical campaign, I like the differences in power.

I will give it a try sometimes though but probably not as far as I am no because Id rather spend that time on another, more difficult faction in the historical campaign.

Regarding Armenia, in my current campaign they only own Adana which is a castle so you'd have zero income from trade etc. Thats already a nice challenge right there (I wonder if its even possible?) Afaik they are not at war with the Turks in my current campaign but I wonder how Biz will act when they are AI. I tried to ally with them so I could focus on Turkey but they didnt want to. When I get another good general I might finsih them off but I cant afford the extra fortress right now. Anyway, they can be put high on the list of very hard faction for sure.

PS: just noticed the difficulty question, VH/VH for me.

[hotcobbler]

1. What Faction are your currently playing? Tuaithe of Eire (Ireland)

2. Do you play them Default DLV or Historical Campaign? Default, with all scripts enabled.

3. What difficulty are you playing on? VH/VH

4. Is the Faction Very Easy, Easy, Moderate, Hard, or Very Hard compared to other DLV factions you've played? This is only my 5th campaign, and I've gotten farther in this one than any other without being annihilated. I'm still a noob, but I'd say Ireland is in a pretty Easy position for a number of reasons.

5. What is your opinion of the faction's starting position/situation? As far as their position goes, it's hard to find a better one on the map. You have a good homeland to conquer on an island by yourself. Though you only start with 1 settlement, the other 3 on the island are easy enough to conquer and, in my case, were heavily subsidized by the nobles gifts.

6. What rivals does the faction always end up at war with? I always end up at war with England, but I usually start it. Scotland has been allied to me since turn 2 and have never attempted to take my lands, on the contrary they helped me take York against overwhelming odds (though I doubt that was their intent, I just got there first). Regardless, with all of England's homeland and Ireland under my rule, I am making good money and am secure enough to go on Crusade in Lithuania. Denmark just started a war with me by blockading a port, but I think that's because I brought my Crusading army back by ship through their waters, and ran into a couple of their navies.

7. Which factions are potentially dependable allies/trading partners? As I mentioned before, Scotland is probably the best. Norway has been with me for a while, but they've been hording off and on for 50 turns or so. They are currently restricted to a little island, so they're pretty useless. France was allied to me for a long time, but the Pope didn't like that so we split up (he paid me). Spain is also a good trading partner once you take England and have ports, as is Denmark and Flanders.

8. What are some early game strategies that have worked for you with that faction? I waited to get missions for each city I wanted to conquer, and pretty much left most of the hard rebel armies alone, avoiding them until I could build up a massive force to get rid of all of them at once. My main general lived until age 87, and I retired him at 60, he was very useful in subduing England. I would say focus on a balanced army of Templar spearmen with Fianadii as backup, they are pretty good melee troops with the added bonus of javelins. Kerns are also more useful than they seem, behind some spears they can destroy units. Marcach, the light javelin horsemen, are useful for distracting heavy cavalry, as they can pepper them with javelins while running away from the charge. Once the infantry is dead, you can easily lead them to your main force and slaughter the nobility.

9. What are some strategies that don't work for the Faction? I wouldn't try to fight Scotland, though I haven't tried yet (I'm planning on backstabbing them at some convenient time to take all of my islands) they have far superior infantry to you, and they are your best friend against England. Also, try to fight English armies in the field, Ireland's strength is their mobility and javelin troops. They have spears, swords, light horse, and skirmishers with javelins. In some ways they are like a Roman army of old, without the heavy armor. On the walls it is difficult to win without some good heavy mercenaries or Templar spears.

[Xtiaan72]

Ireland is my favorite faction...DLV is one of the few mods that has an Irish Faction which makes them especially unique. I also think they are one of the best executed 'Additional Factions' in DLV.

They are just plain fun...They have a one province start..Which is FUN! They have an absolutely unique roster as you are saying!

Are they the easiest faction?:hmmm: Hard to say...Although their roster is great early and mid game... It is relatively weak mid to late game. It's hard to maintain your early game expansion if you over do it.

Also, as you mentioned the nature of their units means you have to be a pretty skilled tactical player to use them effectively...They definitely have a lot of "Chuck and Run" going on....

Those cheap horse archers and light cav are a huge plus for them. There really is no NE faction that can deal with them well.

It is really hard to be eliminated playing Ireland which makes them one of the best factions to get your head wrapped around DLV features as a new player.

A great faction for new players but still Ireland has unique challenges to overcome on the battlefield... I would rank Norway easier even though they have a tougher start...Their roster pays huge dividends mid-game if you can slog through. At that point the Irish weakness ( no real quality Spear Militia) becomes a problem.

Like you I build my Irish armies around the Fiandii with maxed out armor upgrades but later I gradually switch to a light cav focused around horse archers and light cav with javalins when their lack of quality Spearmen becomes an issue.

Maybe a difference in playing styles but I find myself at war with Scotland all the time and only rarely England... I find Scotland invades Ireland more often than England....I don't know why.

I always pick France and Norway as dependable allies... But I usually try to snag Greenland off Norway before making nice.. Trade partners: France, Flanders, Denmark and Norway. England and Scotland I don't even bother cause I know it's not income I can count on them in a pinch.

[hotcobbler]

I just got to the dark ages with them a few turns, and Scotland and I still have mutual military access. It's really helping out a lot, as my old ally Norway has gone renegade on me and invaded my home island. Since that has never happened, I had no troops there, and got lucky to defeat a besieging army with some Templar Knights and Javelin Cavalry from York.

I get the feeling they'll attack me soon though

[Xtiaan72]

What year is it now in your campaign?

Sounds like you are starting to experiencing that mid-game "squeeze" I was talking about it.

Don't be surprised if Scotland turns on you....Count on it

[hotcobbler]

1274 I think. I just got a CTD when clicking on Hamburg's building browser, I had just taken it from Denmark on Crusade.

It's weird because this is the first CTD I've had with this version of DLV.

[Xtiaan72]

The browser is definitely touchy...I always wince when I need to take a look

[hotcobbler]

I reloaded it and it's working fine now. Who knows?

Anyway, 2 turns later and Scotland attacked me with 2 fullstacks at York. Good thing I listened to you and sent some of my disparate forces there. Those armies have been sitting on my border since the beginning of time, I really didn't think they'd bother me. Oh well, guess it's time to take over my island

[Xtiaan72]

You actually got lucky in your game. You are right in saying that Scotland is harder to deal with than England in the beginning and they attack early on the home island in most games. The Fiandii are an excellent early unit but no match for Highlanders... Snagging Templars for Ireland was a bit of a coup...

The Scots are unlikely to seek peace...You need a real bastard commander with high dread.. Stay on the offensive and 'execute' their population centers. Destroy everything to negate their money script advantage...and watch out for 'William Wallace'! He does emerge and will overwhelm you if you don't have stacks supporting your main army. The Scots are tough...They have that 'emerging army' advantage just when you think you have them on their knees.

[ivanhoex]

1. What Faction are your currently playing?
Kiev


2. Do you play them Default DLV or Historical Campaign?
Default with all options on, but CIV style


3. What difficulty are you playing on?
VH/VH


4. Is the Faction Very Easy, Easy, Moderate, Hard, or Very Hard compared to other DLV factions you've played?
Moderate. can become hard too easy.


5. What is your opinion of the faction's starting position/situation?
Perfect. big income cities, excellent rebel places, easy to defend thanks to position of main castle, lots of ports,
every unit in the game is near enough to pay a visit so its a fun starting point too.


6. What rivals does the faction always end up at war with?
polland, novgorod, georgia, turks, bizantines, lithuania, hospitallers, hre, venice, high chance of danes and norwegians joining too.

Mongols in some games have a rather shy behaviour, if so, its absolutely worth it to politely invite them to war.
And dont you worry, once started they know how to play the game, so be ready..


7. Which factions are potentially dependable allies/trading partners?
turks against biz, then egipt if turks are frontier. hre in the beggining to wipe out polland and venice, then... who knows.
the rikis are good allies mid game too. if they dont get too greedy


8. What are some early game strategies that have worked for you with that faction?
sending lots of merchants to the monopoly areas of turkish and biz capitol cities.
i have two ways to play kiev but posibilities are limitless:

a- go for minsk. that means forgetting about crimea. get moscu before novgorod and you will wipe them out soon.
once you have from kiev to novgorod, to the east till the castle after moscu..

b-go for crimea, expand south, face georgians and turks for the black sea waters. become a sea master.
conquer all the future turks territories (greece + asia minor + crimea area)


9. What are some strategies that don't work for the Faction?
let me see... access to boats early if you want to... inland fighting if you like... near riches for your merchants..
your cities have a strong defensive position so turtle is available, but blietzrieg is more than likely thanks to so many rebel cities...
i tend to have 6 cities and 2 castles by year 1210... whether i go north or south..


i have never ever played with assasins and diplomats as my main force.. thats as much as i can picture right now for a no go...
specially since you dont need to build space to expand at the cost of killing out a faction..




how fun are the units it can field / variety of strategy:
excellent all-around troops, from heavy horse archers and foot to heavy lancers and heavy foot spears, maces, axes, swords...
you lack two hand swordsmen and pikes, but pikes come from merc tent and i dont like two hand swords anyway XD
you can play anyway you like with this guys.


and hell... units are from the elite modders of RUSICHI MOD!

[Xtiaan72]

Nice write up. I've never tried Kiev but they sound like fun especially with the new Rusichi units.

I like your aggressive merchant tactics...! Smart use of merchants is definitely the one advantage you can give yourself over the AI. Important considering all the handicaps the player has.

[Omar Nelson B.]

They would be a nice choice for somebody that wants alittle more of a challenge but nothing too crazy. Mongols are always fun to fight too!

[Xtiaan72]

Hey Omar....Nice to see you around man!

[Agis Tournas]

@ ivanhoex
Have you ever considered writing a book?
I am sure you would make great sales!
(I am a journalist and I can tell - )
I like your writing style very much!
+rep

[2-D Ron]

1. What Faction are your currently playing?

Holy Roman Empire

2. Do you play them Default DLV or Historical Campaign?

Default DLV

3. What difficulty are you playing on? + (Civ Style or Total war AI)

Civ Style (I like Micro Management)

4. Is the Faction Very Easy, Easy, Moderate, Hard, or Very Hard compared to other DLV factions you've played?

First time I've played the Holy Roman Empire with 6.0 and I can say it is unspeakably hard compared to the last time when I played Version 5.0 where I ubered it in VH/VH.

5. What is your opinion of the faction's starting position/situation?

Holy Roman Empire has opportunity to expand from all directions but is faced with threats from all sides later.

6. What rivals does the faction always end up at war with?

Milan and the Magyar's, Milan invaded 3 of my bordering settlements simultaneously, I lost my Italian Territories and only managed to keep my third. It was 3 to 5 but I managed to beat the odds with my Cavalry.

7. Which factions are potentially dependable allies/trading partners?

Sicily and Teutonic Faction and even THEY were hard to convince, but nobody else will accept trading rights with me????
Milan gave me Trading Rights and attacked me on the same turn.

8. What are some early game strategies that have worked for you with that faction?

In Battle make use of what Cavalry you've got and deal with the Rebels on your land before expanding.
There is a load of Rebels everywhere, how I never lost Frankfurt on my second Turn is a Miracle as they lifted the siege 2 Turns later.

9. What are some strategies that don't work for the Faction?

Like Q.8, deal with the Rebel hordes in your own borders before expanding, there is just WAY too many of them.
Keep your Italian Territories well guarded as well as Vienna, as Milan and the Magayr's will storm those lands.
You really have to be a Genius to balance the Economy and Home Security, before even considering Expantionism.