Pseudo-Irish Nationalists.

[SepulchreUK]

This is just a question born out of curiosity. I have noticed on this site and around many others a deep seated effinity with the Irish, with many people claiming ancestry, heritage or a link to the Emerald Isle. It's claimed that there are almost 5 times as many people who "claim" to be Irish than there are actual Irish citizens.

Often I have found the Ireland these people claim to be so strongly related to is heavily romanticised, and I have also found quite a few real Irish people who seem almost slightly offended by the Pseudo-Irish claims to lineage.

So I am curious to those on here who believe you have Irish ancestry why are you so proud of it, why not be proud of your direct national roots instead of a country you do not live? What is it about Ireland and the Irish that so draws you in?

This is not a dig at the Irish, so I apologise beforehand if anyone misconstrues it as so.

[Incontinenta Buttox]

Because pseudo-irish nationalist buy in to the romantic "freedom-fighter" propaganda peddled by the IRA and their Sinn Fein apologists. Lefists, of course. Love this sort of stuff.

When the reality was that the IRA were bigoted, sectarian facists, whose day job was drug-dealing, bombing random innocent people and shooting off-duty policemen in fornt of their children.

[nce_wht_guy]

Because pseudo-irish nationalist buy in to the romantic "freedom-fighter" propaganda peddled by the IRA and their Sinn Fein apologists. Lefists, of course. Love this sort of stuff.

When the reality was that the IRA were bigoted, sectarian facists, whose day job was drug-dealing, bombing random innocent people and shooting off-duty policemen in fornt of their children.

Don't even start with this .

[SepulchreUK]

The IRA were just as bigoted as the UDA, UDF or any Unionist paramilitary force. It's like Israel and Hamas, they are both as bad as each other.

Although I do agree with the misconceptions about the IRA. My uncle was a soldier killed by the IRA in 1978, and although he was a soldier and I can appreciate it, but to this I still to this day will not buy a McDonalds product because of their support of Republican paramilitaries and I am very untolerant of plastic paddies with little to no knowledge of the real issues about the Troubles.

[Incontinenta Buttox]

The IRA were just as bigoted as the UDA, UDF or any Unionist paramilitary force. It's like Israel and Hamas, they are both as bad as each other.

Although I do agree with the misconceptions about the IRA. My uncle was a soldier killed by the IRA in 1978, and although he was a soldier and I can appreciate it, but to this I still to this day will not buy a McDonalds product because of their support of Republican paramilitaries and I am very untolerant of plastic paddies with little to no knowledge of the real issues about the Troubles.

I suggest you dont read the pile of anti-british, leftist toss wriitten by some stupid cow by the name of "Bea Campbell" in todays guardian.

[SepulchreUK]

I suggest you dont read the pile of anti-british, leftist toss wriitten by some stupid cow by the name of "Bea Campbell" in todays guardian.

I'd rather have my nipples removed by a near starved Dachshund than read the Guardian.

[Incontinenta Buttox]

LOL!

I agree. guardian readers are .

[The Alcotroll]

LOL!

I agree. guardian readers are .

Hey, now that's not fair. I know the Guardian has disappeared up its own arse recently, but I still read it now and then.

Rather, let's say that people who read the Guardian and then believe everything they've read are wan... are very silly people.

But then you could say that about any other paper.

[SiamWarrior]

It's an actual fact that there are probably more Irish decendants living outside of Ireland than the people actually living there.

Half of London,Liverpool,Glasgow,Manchester and Newcastle have Irish decedants and that's just scratching the surface of Irish geneology in the UK.

I suppose it's the mystery of the Irish that English people like and the fact that they have kept most of their older cultural links to the past alive.

Ireland's small population with there own industry and small immigrant community, it's the type of thing we wish we still had in England.

I suppose in England were now all multicutural and over populated and also confused about what our culture actually is.

[Djûn]

It's an actual fact that there are probably more Irish decendants living outside of Ireland than the people actually living there.

Surely this can be said for almost any nation, given the widespread immigration which has taken place over the past two centuries at least.

[SepulchreUK]

Surely this can be said for almost any nation, given the widespread immigration which has taken place over the past two centuries at least.

You would be hard pushed to find more French people than those that live in France, the same with Germany, Italy. Sure there are large ethnic contingents globaly but not on the scale of the "Plastic Paddy" population claims.

[SepulchreUK]

It's an actual fact that there are probably more Irish decendants living outside of Ireland than the people actually living there.

Half of London,Liverpool,Glasgow,Manchester and Newcastle have Irish decedants and that's just scratching the surface of Irish geneology in the UK.

I suppose it's the mystery of the Irish that English people like and the fact that they have kept most of their older cultural links to the past alive.

Ireland's small population with there own industry and small immigrant community, it's the type of thing we wish we still had in England.

I suppose in England were now all multicutural and over populated and also confused about what our culture actually is.

Horse . There are not 3 1/2 Million people of Irish stock living in London. Glasgow and Liverpool have been uniquely shaped by a very large Irish influx that has grown to match the pre-existing native population.

I agree with your other points though

[Djûn]

Horse . There are not 3 1/2 Million people of Irish stock living in London. Glasgow and Liverpool have been uniquely shaped by a very large Irish influx that has grown to match the pre-existing native population.

I agree with your other points though

It depends what you consider to be 'of Irish heritage'. If we are to take it to mean that there is one other person 'of Irish heritage' in your ancestry then chances are there are a hell of a lot of the aforementioned people.

You would be hard pushed to find more French people than those that live in France, the same with Germany, Italy. Sure there are large ethnic contingents globaly but not on the scale of the "Plastic Paddy" population claims.

As I said, it depends on your definition of someone with a certain heritage. I'm sure it'd be incredibly easy to find an equal or greater amount of people who have a French ancestor who live outside of France than inside - especially given the very widespread nature of French culture.

[Djûn]

Yes but if you take that line of thought then we are all a bit of about 20 different nations if you stretch it back far enough.

I'm sorry but having a Great-Great Uncle from Donegal who married your Great-Great Aunt does not make you Irish in my opinion.

Exactly, I agree with you entirely. But you can see that it is not difficult to come up with statistics which say that there are more people of X heritage than there are in their native country.

[Bovril]

It amuses me how the mongrel poulation of the US pick and chose which bits of their ancestry to identify with. One never hears about English ancestry (except in the epithet WASP) and rarely about German or French ancestry. But ones hears plenty about Irish, Scotish and Native American ancestory. I guess they are just more glamorous and less politically contentious.

[Ahlerich]

It amuses me how the mongrel poulation of the US pick and chose which bits of their ancestry to identify with. One never hears about English ancestry (except in the epithet WASP) and rarely about German or French ancestry. But ones hears plenty about Irish, Scotish and Native American ancestory. I guess they are just more glamorous and less politically contentious.

alcoholics allways find a reason to justify excessive drinking

[SepulchreUK]

It amuses me how the mongrel poulation of the US pick and chose which bits of their ancestry to identify with. One never hears about English ancestry (except in the epithet WASP) and rarely about German or French ancestry. But ones hears plenty about Irish, Scotish and Native American ancestory. I guess they are just more glamorous and less politically contentious.

I know plenty of yanks who claim German heritage, infact last I remember seeing the vast majority of the white American population is of German heritage. Which really did take me as a surprise.

It's just the claims to Irish heritage when the links are tenous at best that surprise me.

It depends what you consider to be 'of Irish heritage'. If we are to take it to mean that there is one other person 'of Irish heritage' in your ancestry then chances are there are a hell of a lot of the aforementioned people.

Yes but if you take that line of thought then we are all a bit of about 20 different nations if you stretch it back far enough.

I'm sorry but having a Great-Great Uncle from Donegal who married your Great-Great Aunt does not make you Irish in my opinion.

[Londinium]

I know plenty of yanks who claim German heritage, infact last I remember seeing the vast majority of the white American population is of German heritage. Which really did take me as a surprise.

It's just the claims to Irish heritage when the links are tenous at best that surprise me.

Germany (19.2%), Ireland (10.8%), England (7.7%), Italy (5.6%), Scandinavia (3.7%) and Poland (3.2%)

There was a substantial amount of Germans even in 1776 America (although not to the same extent as the 19.2% shown here for 2000 stats). It must be remembered that 70,000 UEL, mainly English/Scots fled north after the end of the Revolution, thats nigh on 7% of the pre Revolutionary population, so that explains the discrepancy between Germanic and English ancestry.

Well added to the fact that the English also had plenty other places to go to, unlike the Germans who seemed to migrate only to America.

[Antagonist]

Most European countries have experienced a sizeable flow of emigration to "the colonies" at some point, and thus have a diaspora. I believe Ireland's is exceptionally large (estimates I've seen vary wildly, but figures of 60 million or more are regularly quoted in reputable, academic sources: well over 10 times the current population) but that alone doesn't really explain the "Plastic Paddy" effect. Similarly, it seems reasonable and understandable that in immigrant societies people long for a sense of heritage and continuity which some find in harking back to their ancestors in the Old Country, but again, that doesn't explain why (for example) Irish-Americans are so much more obvious about it than German-Americans or whatever.

Antagonist

[Hookah Smoking Caterpiller]

Ireland (10.8%)

Only ten percent of Ireland claims Irish Heritage? what? :hmmm: