Why Is There Constant Crap Happening In Balkan And Middle East?

[jankren]

My theory is that the regions are located at the crossroad of the world. As a result, the places have always been extremely diverse in terms of ideas and ethnicities for millennia. Moreover, countries from left and right enjoy making it a battleground. Therefore, this is why crazy stuff never stop occurring there.

[Shadowcry]

Well because in the middle east we do not have a strong dictator uniting the nation like Indonesia! =)

[JP226]

The mideast is full of arabs and poor people

[Heathen Hammer]

People of different nations and faiths living in a small area would always result in bloodshed.

[Visna]

People of different nations and faiths living in a small area would always result in bloodshed.

That's certainly a truth with big modifications. Take New York for example. In a 2000 census foreign born persons accounted for 36% of the city's population.
Almost 50% of those 36% arrived after 1980.
http://www.nyc.gov/html/dcp/pdf/cens...ng_booklet.pdf
Go to page 5.

Almost 170 different languages. God knows (haha) how many religions. A population density of over 10,000 per square kilometre. And yet, no bloodshed to speak of. No airplanes bombing the city to rubble. I wonder why... :hmmm:

[jankren]

That's certainly a truth with big modifications. Take New York for example. In a 2000 census foreign born persons accounted for 36% of the city's population.
Almost 50% of those 36% arrived after 1980.
http://www.nyc.gov/html/dcp/pdf/cens...ng_booklet.pdf
Go to page 5.

Almost 170 different languages. God knows (haha) how many religions. A population density of over 10,000 per square kilometre. And yet, no bloodshed to speak of. No airplanes bombing the city to rubble. I wonder why... :hmmm:

Lets see how it will be in 500 years. You cant compare decade long immigrants with peoples who have lived in the same land for centuries.

[Visna]

Lets see how it will be in 500 years. You cant compare decade long immigrants with peoples who have lived in the same land for centuries.

The original statement, you know, the one I replied to was this:
"People of different nations and faiths living in a small area would always result in bloodshed."
A statement clearly proven wrong in New York. A city which is, to my knowledge at least, one of the most densely populated on earth. And it's certainly one of the most ethnically and culturally diverse. And yet, the people there are not engaging in some of the activities we've seen in the Balkans or the Middle East.
If you want to try to argue that will change in time, (500 years wtf?), go right ahead. Ow, and give me next week's lottery numbers while you're at it. Cheers.

[jankren]

The original statement, you know, the one I replied to was this:
"People of different nations and faiths living in a small area would always result in bloodshed."
A statement clearly proven wrong in New York. A city which is, to my knowledge at least, one of the most densely populated on earth. And it's certainly one of the most ethnically and culturally diverse. And yet, the people there are not engaging in some of the activities we've seen in the Balkans or the Middle East.
If you want to try to argue that will change in time, (500 years wtf?), go right ahead. Ow, and give me next week's lottery numbers while you're at it. Cheers.

I agree to say 'always' is a mistake and Im sure the person who said that was merely making an exaggeration.

Ethnic and religious diversity can be greatly lessened through 'nationalism' based on a set of ideals instead of race or religion such as in USA, Turkey, France, India, Indonesia, or former Yugoslavia.

[Kiljan Arslan]

also happens in another crossroads called the Congo.

[Big War Bird]

The muslim faith is the common element. It is a religion built for domination. When people resist it, bad things happen.

[CarbEast]

The muslim faith is the common element. It is a religion built for domination. When people resist it, bad things happen.

Yeah, that's why Muslim nations constantly invading others to force their system and values on them... Wait! It's not Muslims who do it!

[Big War Bird]

Yeah, that's why Muslim nations constantly invading others to force their system and values on them... Wait! It's not Muslims who do it!

How did Islam which started out as a minor desert cult get so big?

[antares24]

The muslim faith is the common element. It is a religion built for domination. When people resist it, bad things happen.

while i agree that Islam made its part in the Balcan and middle east problems, Europe too until a few decades ago was a constant battleground, as others part of the world, so religion isn't the only problem.

Here my list of the reason for the ME and Balcans costant mayhem.

-ethnic strife
-multiethnic states that doesn't work well
-religious fanaticism
-religious differences in the same states
-poverty and Govs. corruption

[Kiljan Arslan]

yeah considering Islam dosn't exist in the Congo I think you need to check your bigotry.

[jankren]

yeah considering Islam dosn't exist in the Congo I think you need to check your bigotry.

Lol, you are a joker my friend.

[Big War Bird]

yeah considering Islam dosn't exist in the Congo I think you need to check your bigotry.

Please don't call me a bigot, since I certainly am not. A rudimentary understanding of history shows that religion is a major factor in warfare, with Islam a serious contender for the top prize in all of human history.

[Sher Khan]

Please don't call me a bigot, since I certainly am not. A rudimentary understanding of history shows that religion is a major factor in warfare, with Islam a serious contender for the top prize in all of human history.

Yes, too bad we couldn't put this in the VV, where we could rip apart the ridiculous assertions made in this thread with little more than 'a rudimentary understanding of history.'

First, how is it 'constant crap'? If you mean recent crap, that's something different altogether as these regions were hardly any different from any other in the world suffering similar issues and problems.

If you want a reason, look towards the violent rise of nationalism and subsequent collapse of the Ottoman Empire. While the Balkans, Syrians, and Arabians were always very independent, it was the rise of nationalism that tore apart the region (regardless of the empire, whether Ottoman, British/French, or Hapsburg). In the Balkans, this had the unhealthy effect of balkanization, where every single ethnic group fashioned themselves their own nations and people with their own distinctive national identity and history (despite whatever similarities between themselves), rather than unite under a conglomerate national identity or language (suppose France developed its national identity not as French, but as Burgundians, Provencals, Normans, Brittagnians, Gascons, and the like). So lines drawn by ethnic blocs inevitably lead to wars based around ethnic lines as each major group tries to rid itself of its undesirable minority, causing the homeland of that minority (usually a neighbor) to intervene and hopefully take back its own vision of a greater 'whatever' backed by their own national history.

The Middle East is eventful only for the wars involving Israel, and the dictatorships that formed (of wholly secular means and persuasions save Saudi Arabia and Iran) were created out of opposition to the state based out of Pan-Arab nationalism, not religion.

Religion took up the nationalist cause after many of the people came to realize how full of it their military despots were.

[Oklop]

Y In the Balkans, this had the unhealthy effect of balkanization, where every single ethnic group fashioned themselves their own nations and people with their own distinctive national identity and history (despite whatever similarities between themselves), rather than unite under a conglomerate national identity or language (suppose France developed its national identity not as French, but as Burgundians, Provencals, Normans, Brittagnians, Gascons, and the like). So lines drawn by ethnic blocs inevitably lead to wars based around ethnic lines as each major group tries to rid itself of its undesirable minority, causing the homeland of that minority (usually a neighbor) to intervene and hopefully take back its own vision of a greater 'whatever' backed by their own national history.

So true.
+rep

[Kiljan Arslan]

Really not want of land, loot plunder, none of those effected war more? Religion is just one of many ways peolpe unite so they'll have an excuse for their much pettier reasons for war.

note until recently INdia had a long history of conflict going back at least 3000 years long before Islam ever existed there.

[Big War Bird]

Really not want of land, loot plunder, none of those effected war more? Religion is just one of many ways peolpe unite so they'll have an excuse for their much pettier reasons for war.

Did I say otherwise?

note until recently INdia had a long history of conflict going back at least 3000 years long before Islam ever existed there.

Considering your specific duty as a kshatriya, you should know that there is no better engagement for you than fighting on religious principles; and so there is no need for hesitation.