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Thread: Byzantine Units Reworked (WIP)

  1. #1

    Icon1 Byzantine Units Reworked (WIP)

    Hello there! I'm working on a new sets of Byzantine units models for DLV and hopefully Chivalry : Sicilian Vesper and also vanilla replacer.
    Please note that this submod will require Battlefield Balanced for DLV.

    The units would range from 10-11th century or from Macedonian to Komnenian era. Though there are some anachronistic elements.
    Some units is still in desicion of their name/role

    I must thank you following modders or team who had given me the permission to use their stuffs
    Rusichi team : lots of their materials
    CBUR team : inspiration and lots of materials, I learned a lot from this thread
    Caudillo87 : largely used his models and textures from http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...az-Unit-Roster
    Absinthia : some shield, padded, and cloths textures and models from his Frankish-Frisian units
    East of Rome team : textures and parts of models
    Bellum Crucis team : some shield patterns
    paleologos : textures resources
    Broken Crescent team (to be specific ; TMK, Pacco, Leif_Ericson.) : textures and models

    I also use references from following artist/author
    Angus McBride
    Giuseppe Rava
    Raffaelle d'Amato
    Igor Dzis
    Christos Giannopoulos


    Here are some screenshots of my units

    Skoutatoi
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

    padded

    tier 2

    tier 3


    Akritai
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 






    The rosters are about 70% finished, I will update more progress soon!
    Last edited by paleologos; November 13, 2018 at 06:33 AM. Reason: added missing information/ edit typos

  2. #2
    isa0005's Avatar Content Staff
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    Default Re: Byzantine Units Reworked (WIP)

    Wonderful! Will this be compatible with BB?

  3. #3

    Default Re: Byzantine Units Reworked (WIP)

    Yes, it's intended to be played with BB

  4. #4

    Default Re: Byzantine Units Reworked (WIP)

    More update on "Kontaratoi" phalanx

    Tier 1
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 



    Tier 2
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 



    Tier 3
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 



    Units in action
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  5. #5
    isa0005's Avatar Content Staff
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    Default Re: Byzantine Units Reworked (WIP)

    Quote Originally Posted by Theodomar View Post
    Yes, it's intended to be played with BB
    Wonderful!! Can't wait to see more, +rep for you!

  6. #6
    isa0005's Avatar Content Staff
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    Default Re: Byzantine Units Reworked (WIP)

    Quote Originally Posted by isa0005 View Post
    Wonderful!! Can't wait to see more, +rep for you!
    On another note, are you simply replacing the looks of the units, or are you redoing the whole Byzantine unit roster as well? Furthurmore, do you have any intention of adding units, for example musketeers and plate armoured units? I understand that they aren't historically accurate, but lets face it when playing the Byzantines, we're all wanting to rebuild the Empire haha

  7. #7

    Default Re: Byzantine Units Reworked (WIP)

    Quote Originally Posted by isa0005 View Post
    On another note, are you simply replacing the looks of the units, or are you redoing the whole Byzantine unit roster as well? Furthurmore, do you have any intention of adding units, for example musketeers and plate armoured units? I understand that they aren't historically accurate, but lets face it when playing the Byzantines, we're all wanting to rebuild the Empire haha
    I'm thinking of redoing the whole roster (with a bit of anachronism) while some basic units will be reskinned. Bad news is it won't be save game compatible.
    Plus, I actually made a Byzantine musketeer unit for entertainment with Siphonatores models and will consider doing Byzantine renaissance units too if there is still enough room for more units(I'm not sure how many units the engine set limits for).
    Last edited by Theodomar; June 04, 2018 at 11:45 AM.

  8. #8
    Hellvard's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Byzantine Units Reworked (WIP)

    There can be 500 units total Great work!





  9. #9

    Default Re: Byzantine Units Reworked (WIP)

    Quote Originally Posted by Hellvard View Post
    There can be 500 units total Great work!
    Thank you! I think I'll do just fine without reaching the limits. I can also save more space by using armour upgrade instead of new units.

    Here's Menaulatoi ; spearmen armed with heavy spear called menaulion that could penetrate armour and kill horse quickly. Their task is to move in and kill any pinned down cavalry. They can also deploy stakes.
    Their shield patterns are from Palaeologos shield packs
    Menaulatoi
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 



    Upgraded
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 



    more screenshots
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    Arab cavalry above isn't mine, they belong to sumskilz





  10. #10
    isa0005's Avatar Content Staff
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    Default Re: Byzantine Units Reworked (WIP)

    Noice!

  11. #11

    Default Re: Byzantine Units Reworked (WIP)

    I pm'ed Broken Crescent asking them for permission to use their beautiful Byzantine shield patterns but it seems they aren't active on here anymore. And I actually made several units with their textures. Guess I'll just replace those shields with something else then post it here.

  12. #12

    Default Re: Byzantine Units Reworked (WIP)

    Good news! I've just got the permission from Broken Crescent Team! I'm now reimplementing their fabulous shields to the roster. So units below are still prone to changes except Hoplitai/Promachoi.
    Horses are from marka team and will be changed to those available in Deus lo Vult later.
    Kavallarioi
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    shield textures from Broken Crescent didn't match well with other models so they'll be changed


    upgraded 1, notice the whole set of shields from Broken Crescent so they look proper and nice


    upgraded 2, shields from Bellum Crucis


    Archontae / or perhaps "Archontoupouloi"

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 



    upgraded


    Hoplitai/Promachoi
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

    Though I'm still puzzled about their role but I already made them elite spearmen



    Last edited by Theodomar; June 17, 2018 at 05:28 AM.

  13. #13
    isa0005's Avatar Content Staff
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    Default Re: Byzantine Units Reworked (WIP)

    They look wonderful!

    My understanding of the ancient "Homeric" Promachoi is that they served a dual role. First, as front line heavy infantry or as William K. Pritchett states "a foward echelon of dismounted men-at-arms drawn up in front of the main body (the phalanx)" (Pritchett, W. K., 1985, "Studies in Ancient Greek, Part 5" p. 26) and second as a form of heavy, yet manoeuvrable vanguard brigade used to defend the rear of the phalanx. There is also mention of the Promachoi serving as front line, lightly armed, skirmishers, but this seems to vary depending on who they fought for. Of course this doesn't mean that the Byzantine interations served the same purpose there is several centuries difference between each soldier type. However, I don't see the problem in perhaps borrowing from these ideas. Perhaps they could serve as a form of front line heavy skirmishers that throw javelins before engaging in hand to hand combat with their spears?

  14. #14

    Default Re: Byzantine Units Reworked (WIP)

    Nice!!!.....I cant wait when you finish this work!?

  15. #15

    Default Re: Byzantine Units Reworked (WIP)

    Quote Originally Posted by isa0005 View Post
    They look wonderful!

    My understanding of the ancient "Homeric" Promachoi is that they served a dual role. First, as front line heavy infantry or as William K. Pritchett states "a foward echelon of dismounted men-at-arms drawn up in front of the main body (the phalanx)" (Pritchett, W. K., 1985, "Studies in Ancient Greek, Part 5" p. 26) and second as a form of heavy, yet manoeuvrable vanguard brigade used to defend the rear of the phalanx. There is also mention of the Promachoi serving as front line, lightly armed, skirmishers, but this seems to vary depending on who they fought for. Of course this doesn't mean that the Byzantine interations served the same purpose there is several centuries difference between each soldier type. However, I don't see the problem in perhaps borrowing from these ideas. Perhaps they could serve as a form of front line heavy skirmishers that throw javelins before engaging in hand to hand combat with their spears?
    Thanks for your advice! I think I might implement the heavy line skirmisher idea to menaulatoi instead (just like Broken Crescent) as they have stakes while Hoplitai/Promachoi will be kept as heavy line spearmen that support skoutatoi

    Quote Originally Posted by Baron Vlad Felix View Post
    Nice!!!.....I cant wait when you finish this work!?
    In the near future what is needed is couple more cavalry, 2 archer units (namely toxotai and another elite one), akontistai, 2 elite guards, and skoutatoi swordsmen.

  16. #16
    isa0005's Avatar Content Staff
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    Default Re: Byzantine Units Reworked (WIP)

    Happy to help!
    Speaking of Skoutatoi, will you be dividing the soldier type into Sword and Spear Skoutatoi like they are in vanilla DLV?

  17. #17
    AnthoniusII's Avatar XXI ARMORED BRIGADE
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    Default Re: Byzantine Units Reworked (WIP)

    I am very happy to see that CBUR Komnenean Armies still inspire.
    I see you compine CBUR material with Rusichi one plus Paleologos one too.
    So to help you.
    Here is a consept of Komnenean/early Palealogian heavy horseman.

    And here is how with same material scutatoi can be:

    Nottice the helmet that is western type in this example.
    Please continue...It will take a while for CBUR to remake Komneneans.
    Here is the reference consept CBUR Archontopulla (not Archontopoulloi) was based on.
    Last edited by AnthoniusII; June 25, 2018 at 11:35 AM.
    There are moments (in history), in which a nation owes,
    if it wants to be considered as a great one, to be able to fight.
    Even without hope of winning. Just because it has to.
    Greek War motto.
    XXI Armored Brigade. Proud that served in that unit in 1996!
    "Spartans do not ask how many (enemies are) but where they are"!
    XXI Armored Brigade's motto.
    The Greek Secret (or why they will fight again if it will be necessary or why they do not sell their history).


  18. #18

    Default Re: Byzantine Units Reworked (WIP)

    Some beautifully rendered troops!

  19. #19
    isa0005's Avatar Content Staff
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    Default Re: Byzantine Units Reworked (WIP)

    I'm really looking forward to this getting a release, its going to be awesome! its pretty much the only reason why I reinstalled DLVBB!

  20. #20

    Default Re: Byzantine Units Reworked (WIP)

    Thank you all for your feedback! Although I have less time due to finding a job but I will continue the work to finish it whenever I have time.

    Quote Originally Posted by isa0005 View Post
    Happy to help!
    Speaking of Skoutatoi, will you be dividing the soldier type into Sword and Spear Skoutatoi like they are in vanilla DLV?
    And yes, skoutatoi will be divided into swordsmen and spearmen. In fact, they are remodelled version of vanilla DLV
    Quote Originally Posted by AnthoniusII View Post
    I am very happy to see that CBUR Komnenean Armies still inspire.
    I see you compine CBUR material with Rusichi one plus Paleologos one too.
    So to help you.
    Here is a consept of Komnenean/early Palealogian heavy horseman.

    And here is how with same material scutatoi can be:

    Nottice the helmet that is western type in this example.
    Please continue...It will take a while for CBUR to remake Komneneans.
    Here is the reference consept CBUR Archontopulla (not Archontopoulloi) was based on.
    Thank you for the reference! CBUR Komnenean looks real nice, it's actually what inspire me to do this mod in the first place.
    PS I've always been a low key fan of The Great Conflicts for year

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