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Thread: [Faction Discussion] Dai Viet

  1. #141

    Default Re: [Faction Discussion] Dai Viet

    Quote Originally Posted by Ashigaru View Post
    In Dai Viet armies, they didn't use axe a lots, i think. So in my opinion, do not add axemen to the list.
    I think vagabond is right, lacking armored troops is the weakest point. However, light inf in DV armies in game should have high damage, some effective against armor and high morale, even the militia.
    DV armies also have heavy inf, but in the last tier, i think.
    I read some books said axes had been used in warfare by Viets from generations, for thousands years and was a very good weapon, both in def and att. But i'm not sure, need some professional here.
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  2. #142

    Default Re: [Faction Discussion] Dai Viet

    At least in my list, there aren't any axemen. In war, the people use any think they have, even a hoe, but it not realy an "official weapon" for the army right? I can't post the list here because i think the modder want a "surprise" when the mod release

    The highlanders use a special weapon (i don't know how to call it =.= , strange sword??? ):
    Last edited by gamevn; June 10, 2009 at 12:30 AM.

  3. #143

    Default Re: [Faction Discussion] Dai Viet

    Quote Originally Posted by Ashigaru View Post
    In Dai Viet armies, they didn't use axe a lots, i think. So in my opinion, do not add axemen to the list.
    I think vagabond is right, lacking armored troops is the weakest point. However, light inf in DV armies in game should have high damage, some effective against armor and high morale, even the militia.
    DV armies also have heavy inf, but in the last tier, i think.
    R U sure ? I have some image from http://www.baotanglichsu.vn/Index.aspx?lang=en

  4. #144

    Default Re: [Faction Discussion] Dai Viet

    Quote Originally Posted by KingR View Post
    R U sure ? I have some image from http://www.baotanglichsu.vn/Index.aspx?lang=en
    You should look at the date of these objects again.

  5. #145

    Default Re: [Faction Discussion] Dai Viet

    Quote Originally Posted by gamevn View Post
    At least in my list, there aren't any axemen. In war, the people use any think they have, even a hoe, but it not realy an "official weapon" for the army right? I can't post the list here because i think the modder want a "surprise" when the mod release

    The highlanders use a special weapon (i don't know how to call it =.= , strange sword??? ):
    it's called a falx (similar to the thing Thracians use in Rome Total War)

  6. #146

    Default Re: [Faction Discussion] Dai Viet

    Quote Originally Posted by gamevn View Post
    You should look at the date of these objects again.
    Of course, they are the objects before the game 1000 years. But 1000 years later even the weapons are more diversified.
    Sr, course my English not well

  7. #147

    Default Re: [Faction Discussion] Dai Viet

    Quote Originally Posted by KingR View Post
    Of course, they are the objects before the game 1000 years. But 1000 years later even the weapons are more diversified.
    Sr, course my English not well
    Source please? Axe was used on daily works, maybe in some urgent case of war by peasant. But as far as i know, it never be an offical weapon to equip for the army.

  8. #148

    Default Re: [Faction Discussion] Dai Viet

    I have read a book about the Daiviet 's history, it said sword, machete, falx, crossbow and halberd were used popularly.
    In my country there aren't so many books about VN history, but the information seem to be reliable.

  9. #149

    Default Re: [Faction Discussion] Dai Viet

    Quote Originally Posted by Ashigaru View Post
    I have read a book about the Daiviet 's history, it said sword, machete, falx, crossbow and halberd were used popularly.
    In my country there aren't so many books about VN history, but the information seem to be reliable.
    And you'll see all of them (if the modders agreed with us). Machetes (upgrade to falchions) are a second weapon for missile troops and cavalry; falx for highlander. There are swordmen, crossbowmen and pikemen (use dagger-axe, upgrade to halberd) too. Most kinds of units in page #4 don't change, but the building's level, and available.
    Last edited by gamevn; June 11, 2009 at 10:01 AM.

  10. #150

    Default Re: [Faction Discussion] Dai Viet

    Quote Originally Posted by gamevn View Post
    Source please? Axe was used on daily works, maybe in some urgent case of war by peasant. But as far as i know, it never be an offical weapon to equip for the army.
    even you have no source of other weapons, I think so.
    Documents recorded were destroyed in many wars.
    I can only know Axe is 1 in 18 weapons common in Vietnam, China ...
    http://vi.wikipedia.org/wiki/Th%E1%B...5_ngh%E1%BB%87
    ( In Vietnamese Axe as rìu or Việt )
    Last edited by KingR; June 10, 2009 at 09:47 AM.

  11. #151

    Default Re: [Faction Discussion] Dai Viet

    Actually i have. Not directly, but in many source mention about sword, spear, crossbow, bow... in army, but i never see any word prove that the court equiped axes for the soldiers. The most nearly weapon is halberd.

    "Việt" is a word describe the shape as a new moon. There are many strange weapon that are called "Việt" completely different from an axe. "Phủ" is a better word to translate "axe".

    And the problem here is not "Are there any axes?" (of course there are) , but "Are there any arm that used axe as a main weapon?". I don't said "It's not used", I just said it's not commonly used in army, at least, not enought to be an arm.

    The 18 common weapons are used in material art, not in army. Like Chinese, they have many, many strange weapons in material art, but not all of them were used to equip for the army. Base are sword, blade, spear, halberd, crossbow and bow.
    Last edited by gamevn; June 10, 2009 at 09:49 PM.

  12. #152

    Default Re: [Faction Discussion] Dai Viet

    Quote Originally Posted by gamevn View Post
    Actually i have. Not directly, but in many source mention about sword, spear, crossbow, bow... in army, but i never see any word prove that the court equiped axes for the soldiers. The most nearly weapon is halberd.

    "Việt" is a word describe the shape as a new moon. There are many strange weapon that are called "Việt" completely different from an axe. "Phủ" is a better word to translate "axe".
    And the problem here is not "Are there any axes?" (of course there are) , but "Are there any arm that used axe as a main weapon?". I don't said "It's not used", I just said it's not commonly used in army, at least, not enought to be an arm.

    The 18 common weapons are used in material art, not in army. Like Chinese, they have many, many strange weapons in material art, but not all of them were used to equip for the army. Base are sword, blade, spear, halberd, crossbow and bow.
    I think he's right. Military weapons always elvove. I found no source said axe was a main weapon in DV's army. But i think we should add some falx, they used them alot and it's very effective vs armour.
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  13. #153

    Default Re: [Faction Discussion] Dai Viet

    Quote Originally Posted by Vagabond View Post
    I think he's right. Military weapons always elvove. I found no source said axe was a main weapon in DV's army. But i think we should add some falx, they used them alot and it's very effective vs armour.
    Falx was already added. The highlander'll use them as a 2'nd weapon (1'st is crossbow). I plan (only my own plan) this troop is a multi-role troop, good at both missile and melee (They remind me the rangers in some Lord of the Rings mods ). Only available in highland regions.

  14. #154

    Default Re: [Faction Discussion] Dai Viet

    Quote Originally Posted by gamevn View Post
    The 18 common weapons are used in material art, not in army. Like Chinese, they have many, many strange weapons in material art, but not all of them were used to equip for the army. Base are sword, blade, spear, halberd, crossbow and bow.
    What's the difference between a sword and a blade?
    Morning Sun (adds Korea and China to the Shogun 2 map)
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/forum...28-Morning-Sun

    Expanded Japan mod (97 new regions and 101 new factions)
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...ew-factions%29

    How to split a region in TWS2
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...split-a-region

    Eras Total Conquest 2.3 (12 campaigns from 970-1547)

  15. #155

    Default Re: [Faction Discussion] Dai Viet

    Quote Originally Posted by uanime5 View Post
    What's the difference between a sword and a blade?
    I'm not sure is it a right word, but i think a blade is curved, and a sword is straight

  16. #156

    Default Re: [Faction Discussion] Dai Viet

    Oh, I think "rìu" ( Việt ) is the best word to translate from "axe" , and "Búa" ( Phủ ) is a "big axe".
    Axe was used on daily works, maybe in some urgent case of war by peasant
    Many soldiers in Daiviet army are "half farmer, half soldier".
    Quote Originally Posted by gamevn View Post
    The highlanders use a special weapon (i don't know how to call it =.= , strange sword??? ):
    I thing, it's a Kukri , not faxl . it's used by highlander
    Swordmen and spearmen equipped falx ?? I don't thing so them 2nd weapon are machetes

  17. #157

    Default Re: [Faction Discussion] Dai Viet

    Quote Originally Posted by KingR View Post
    Oh, I think "rìu" ( Việt ) is the best word to translate from "axe" , and "Búa" ( Phủ ) is a "big axe".

    Many soldiers in Daiviet army are "half farmer, half soldier".
    You don't want to understand, don't you? I said "some urgent case of war by peasant" mean when they don't have any "army's weapons". If they were in army, they would use another weapon, which they were equiped.

    And if you want more information about this: ""Việt" is a word describe the shape as a new moon. There are many strange weapon that are called "Việt" completely different from an axe. "Phủ" is a better word to translate "axe". " I'll give you this link http://www.kienandokungfu.com/Thapbatbanbinh%20khi.htm . Check it yourself.

    Last thing: I think we are going too far
    Last edited by gamevn; June 11, 2009 at 10:02 AM.

  18. #158

    Default Re: [Faction Discussion] Dai Viet

    Quote Originally Posted by gamevn View Post
    Falx was already added. The highlander'll use them as a 2'nd weapon (1'st is crossbow). I plan (only my own plan) this troop is a multi-role troop, good at both missile and melee (They remind me the rangers in some Lord of the Rings mods ). Only available in highland regions.
    It's a very nice idea , i forgot completely about these highlanders . A very good vertisal, multi-roles troop. And do you plan to give them some rattan armour, like some troop in the romance of 3 Kingdoms ?

    Quote Originally Posted by uanime5 View Post
    What's the difference between a sword and a blade?
    I think "blade" is a common, general word which point to anything can cut, especially if it's made by metal, but only the part that cut. And a sword is a sword, one particular type of "blade", like knife, falchion, etc.... My english is bad, so ...
    Last edited by Vagabond; June 11, 2009 at 02:09 PM.
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  19. #159

    Default Re: [Faction Discussion] Dai Viet

    yup blade describes a wide range of cutting and slashing weapons (machetes, falchions, scimitars, daggers, cutting knives,...) while swords are a type of blade.

  20. #160

    Default Re: [Faction Discussion] Dai Viet

    I found some picture. These are the oldest pics i can find, have been taken by the French about the 19'th century (oh, but there are some new pics too).

    Buddhist temple (from small to huge): http://s674.photobucket.com/albums/v...t_AUH/temples/

    Peasant's Houses: http://s674.photobucket.com/albums/v...et_AUH/houses/

    Walls and Gates (from bamboo to huge stone): http://s674.photobucket.com/albums/v...s%20n%20gates/

    Halls: http://s674.photobucket.com/albums/vv109/daiviet_AUH/halls/
    (more Royal palace's pictures (Nguyen dynasty): google picture search
    I'm not sure about Hall's level, but seem that the more levels, more rooms, compartments, and storey.

    Other: http://s674.photobucket.com/albums/v...iet_AUH/other/
    Last edited by gamevn; June 12, 2009 at 10:50 PM.

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