Questions for Shia (prefer Persians)

[Carpathian Wolf]

I studied Islam for a while and actually considered it for a bit. But a strange question came to me when it came to Sunni/Shia relations. I'm not sure how to word it in a manner of a question but i'll do my best. You as Shias are for the most part Persian/Iranian while most Arabs are Sunni. The Arabs more or less conquored the Sassanid Empire, uprooted zorastrianism and placed Islam as the religion. Later you have the Sunni/Shia split. What keeps you as Persians/Iranians faithful to an Arabic religion when you have this rift going? I personally would feel neglected so to speak, abandoned even.

[jankren]

Shiism is largely Zoroastrianism coated with the flavor of Islam. If you learn about Shiism and Zoroastrianism in depth you will notice heavy similarity. It is said that the Persians chose to embrace Shiism (and modify it to resemble Zoroastrianism more) which was a minority sect as a symbolic show of defiance against the Arabs who were mostly followers of Sunnism. In fact, modern Islam is also influenced by Zoroastrianism thanks to early Islamic scholars who were mostly made up of those of Persian origin. So in a way the Persians managed to retain their ancient religion and also 'reconquer' the Arabs from within.

I know you might want more detail but Im too lazy right now. Maybe next time.

What keeps you as Persians/Iranians faithful to an Arabic religion when you have this rift going?

I just wanna respond to this particular point. What do you think is the reason countless people in the Third World who are now Christians remain faithful to a 'European religion' despite the fact that the Europeans who brought Christianity uprooted their ancient local religions and raped their ancestors and their land? The answer is the same. When you were born with a certain religion you will think it is the right religion because most people follow the belief of their parents.

[motiv-8]

The conversion of much of Persia to Shiism was a gradual, lengthy process that included much in the way of personal and political motivations and events. It was not until the 16th Century that the sect made any headway into the Iranian plateau, and it was mostly because of the establishment of a ruling elite that was Shi'a, much like with the 10th-11th Century Fatimid faith. The only difference is that the state proved to be more lasting and secure than Fatimid egypt, allowing Shiism to be promoted, usually associated with Persian ethnicism in defiance of Turkish Ottoman (Sunni) ethnicism.

So to answer your question, I would suggest looking into the historical background of the Safavid state and its relations with Shi'a religious scholars.

Furthermore, Islam is not an Arabic religion; that's a grossly ignorant statement when looked at by someone who really does study Islam. The vast majority of Muslims are not Arab, and Islam never proscribed itself as a purely Arab religion. It rejects all nationalism and other ties in favor of one Muslim community. History shows that was not always the case, as in the Arab-Persian tension during the early centuries, but that's the ideal.

[Arto]

To answer the wolf: Why should you leave your religion if your parents and relatives believe in it?

[Carpathian Wolf]

Shiism is largely Zoroastrianism coated with the flavor of Islam. If you learn about Shiism and Zoroastrianism in depth you will notice heavy similarity. It is said that the Persians chose to embrace Shiism (and modify it to resemble Zoroastrianism more) which was a minority sect as a symbolic show of defiance against the Arabs who were mostly followers of Sunnism. In fact, modern Islam is also influenced by Zoroastrianism thanks to early Islamic scholars who were mostly made up of those of Persian origin. So in a way the Persians managed to retain their ancient religion and also 'reconquer' the Arabs from within.

I know you might want more detail but Im too lazy right now. Maybe next time.

When you have more time could you give me some examples you have noticed?

I just wanna respond to this particular point. What do you think is the reason countless people in the Third World who are now Christians remain faithful to a 'European religion' despite the fact that the Europeans who brought Christianity uprooted their ancient local religions and raped their ancestors and their land? The answer is the same. When you were born with a certain religion you will think it is the right religion because most people follow the belief of their parents.

I think it was because for the most part the reigion in some of these third world countries were not as extensivly developed. Zorastrianism I think was much more developed and that is why the Shia/Persian situation seems rather unique to me. It is a bit like the "Byzantine Rite Catholics" which were Orthodox at one time but due to forceful conversion/military conquest/politics and what not the people remained Orthodox in worship for the most part but were loyal to the Vatican. If people were this way to you why are you still following a religion more or less forced upon you, or why not convert fully to Cathoicism. Maybe there are cultural reasons but to me religion isn't about culture. I for one didn't follow a religion because of my parents and I think that's a poor reason to.

Furthermore, Islam is not an Arabic religion; that's a grossly ignorant statement when looked at by someone who really does study Islam. :wink: The vast majority of Muslims are not Arab, and Islam never proscribed itself as a purely Arab religion. It rejects all nationalism and other ties in favor of one Muslim community. History shows that was not always the case, as in the Arab-Persian tension during the early centuries, but that's the ideal.

I know it isn't an Arabic religion in who has the most followers. But it was spread by the Arabs at first wasn't it? That was my only point.