Carthage Reloaded - Full Pack Release

[Crawe]

Great units.

[Emperor Domitianus]

Colonel what are you planning next?

[Hannibal Smith]

I'm still making some LOD models for carthage so full pack with sprites and such should be coming next week. Then I dont really know what I'll do, so no plans

[Conqistador]

remake another faction, such as... an greek-style Egypt...

[Fireward77]

remake another faction, such as... an greek-style Egypt...

I like that idea!

[Lü Bu]

I would like to see your version of Gauls!

[S u l l a]

Gauls for sure and latin auxilia would be cool - have not seen too many of those units being made by modders

[Lü Bu]

Yes I think noone has make Gauls...

[Finch]

Yes I think noone has make Gauls...

the gauls in RS2 are i think remade and all of the factions as well

[Lü Bu]

Yes for mod but i was talking about pack like Hannibal has release for Charthage

[Hannibal Smith]

I understand what you mean Karlost, plus RS2 have remade every faction in the game (as have EB, RTR and few other mods that I probably should know the names of )

[Emperor Domitianus]

Yes remaking the barbarians would be a great idea. RS2 has remade the barbarians but I think that would be better for a Hannibal's barbs park.

[Hannibal Smith]

As I said no plans yet. Remodelling a faction is quite a bit of work, I started this project Nov of last year RL got in the way for a bit so I would like to see what the responce is to these units is before I decide if I will continue.

[Kylan271]

I appreciate your work Sir,and to open it to the community in a professional manner as here deserves rep heh,^_* . I am no modder(yet,sigh..),so things like this are a great boon to those unable to create what they feel is better for the game and community. I am trying in an unproffesional manner sadly,to redesign the Baktria roster in TE Gold. A hellene&persian mix is difficult without the historical evidence to go by,and then mainly from Russian authors(Archaeological work in Baktria being Russian and Japanese mainly)who's books are rare and in language I can't fathom,lol..even if I acquire.

I have seen several good Barbarian units,and I would love like here for yours,if they were in one collection available to the community with credit due where. I guess the same for all factions(dreaming...^_*). I collect mods just to see their art in each.

Again thankyou

OMG,I just realised your units have the blue colour I need for the Baktria units,lol....

[Lü Bu]

Old shield is for heavyer troops...

[Kylan271]

Hmmm I forgot. It is size like the Theuros I was thinking,but I do not know what is historical per unit also here? I do not even know if those units Thureophoroi or Thorakitai were in use by Carthage? But,still.

[Hannibal Smith]

As yet models are not made I was just playing with the idea. However Carthage was significately influenced by the greek military system so I dont think that Thureophoroi or Thorakitai would be a huge jump of the imagination. Also lots of mods have carthage with some Romanised units (something I do support) and the Thorakitai (sometimes thought of as imitation legions) especially mirrors that style.

For religion and Carthage I heard some nasty stories of child(and males)sacrifice to the God Saturn. If that diety is so important,is there any unit with links to him in shield or costume design?

I watched a program that argued against this idea (of child sacrifice), suggesting that it was roman propaganda. History is written by the victors

[pirates_say_arrgg]

Great job, really great job!

[hæressiarch]

@ Hannibal Smith
well you can always check here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religio...hild_sacrifice
archeology proved that so called tophets were places where children were sacrificed and killed. in ancient semitic beliefs we meet more than this eample of killing children to please the gods. check the bible and the story of sacrificing 3 young men to baal/moloch (is either the name of a god or the name of a particular kind of sacrifice associated with fire). as far as i remember you can find few quotes. i will post them right here.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

The laws given to Moses by God expressly forbade the Jews to do what was done in Egypt or in Canaan. “You shall not give any of your children to devote them by fire to Moloch, and so profane the name of your God” Leviticus 18:21

And he defiled the Tophet, which is in the valley of Ben-hinnom, that no man might make his son or his daughter pass through the fire of Moloch (l'Molech) 2 Kings 23:10 (on King Josiah's reform):.

And they built the high places of the Ba‘al, which are in the valley of Ben-hinnom, to cause their sons and their daughters to pass through the fire l'Molech; which I did not command them, nor did it come into my mind that they should do this abomination, to cause Judah to sin. Jeremiah 32:35

i found short description like this
Tophet is Moloch, which was made of brass; and they heated him from his lower parts; and his hands being stretched out, and made hot, they put the child between his hands, and it was burnt; when it vehemently cried out; but the priests beat a drum, that the father might not hear the voice of his son, and his heart might not be moved.
demonic isn't it?

but later commentators have compared these accounts with similar ones from greek and latin sources speaking of the offering of children by fire as sacrifices in the punic city of carthage, which was a phoenician colony. cleitarchus, diodorus siculus and plutarch all mention burning of children as an offering to cronus or saturn, that is to ba‘al hammon, the chief god of carthage. issues and practices relating to moloch and child sacrifice may also have been overemphasized for effect. after the romans defeated carthage and totally destroyed the city, they engaged in post-war propaganda to make their archenemies seem cruel and less civilized. but that's only a theory against what was writen before them and what was found after them.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

There was in their city a bronze image of Cronus extending its hands, palms up and sloping toward the ground, so that each of the children when placed thereon rolled down and fell into a sort of gaping pit filled with fire. Diodorus Siculus (20.14)
(Diodorus also relates relatives were forbidden to weep and that when Agathocles defeated Carthage, the Carthaginian nobles believed they had displeased the gods by substituting low-born children for their own children. They attempted to make amends by sacrificing 200 children of the best families at once, and in their enthusiasm actually sacrificed 300 children.)

... the whole area before the statue was filled with a loud noise of flutes and drums so that the cries of wailing should not reach the ears of the people. Plutarch, De Superstitiones 171:

but let's see what we know in theory and what we know for sure:

the existence of god named moloch is uncertain. more certain is that it was MLK and it should be pronounced as MULK or MOLK, which means a child sacrifice (similar to MLKRT isn't it?) he was identified as the solar cult ceremony and baal was recognized as the solar god of heavens (Ba'al, Ba'el means almost as much as EL - god, ruler, king). fire and solar cults were always very close to each other.

what we know for sure is something we call the tophet. the name is possibly derived from the hebrew toph = drum, because drums were used to drown the cries of children, but possibly connected with a root word meaning “burning” - the "place of burning". in the king james version, the form tophet is used, except in 2 kings 23:10, where it spelt topheth.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

“They have built the high places of Topheth, which is in the valley of the son of Hinnom, to burn their sons and their daughters in the fire” (Jeremiah 7:31).

the accuracy of such stories is disputed by some modern historians and archaeologists. several cemeteries containing the remains of infants and children have been found, including a really large one in carthage, which some scholars identify as sacrificial "tophets".

i believe that human sacrifices were part of religious life of phoenicians. specially that excavations showed many, many examples of children remains there... religions were always cuel and mysterious in antiquity

btw. i used ram/bull head on my carthaginians standards and banners to support the thesis of human sacrifices in carthage and existence of mentioned statue fo so called moloch.

regards dear cathaginians

haer - first roman soldier on the walls of carthage

[Hannibal Smith]

double post - please delete