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Thread: REAL DEATH 1.0 + ROYAL WOMEN 1.1

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  1. #1
    caralampio's Avatar Magnificus
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    Default REAL DEATH 1.0 + ROYAL WOMEN 1.1



    REAL DEATH 1.0 FOR STAINLESS STEEL

    In Real Death I have expanded over my Good Old Men submod. A variance to the age when your characters can get old and die has been introduced. Many mods offer variances in the age of possible death, this is nothing new, but I feel I have fine-tuned it using statistical analysis and in-game testing with results closer to real life and satisfactory from a gaming point of view.

    In Stainless Steel old age begins at 65. You don’t have to worry about your character dying before then, unless it is in war, a plague, or an assassin’s job. However, after that age is reached the chances of dying each turn are about 50%! No wonder very few make it beyond 66 or 67.

    In RD the beginning of “old age” is 56 years, which makes sense. Even in these times, people in their late fifties become more prone to things like strokes, heart attacks, cancer, etc.; let alone in the Middle Ages. Of course death can happen at an earlier age, but it is infrequent. Some argue that a big chance of early death was a reality in that era, I won’t deny it but having many characters dying young (which the linear probability-of-death in M2TW will cause) is not good from a gaming point of view. This is the problem with other age mods. A counter-argument could be that those that died young never lived to be prominent or do something useful, so they don’t appear in the game.

    I investigated the age of natural death of 40 prominent people of medieval times (kings, queens, popes, artists, scientists, notables, etc). The range was 32-96, with a mean of 63.7 years.

    This means that once your king (or any other character; generals, wives in the family tree, spies, priests, popes, etc.) is at or beyond 56, death may come at any time. However, no need to worry (too much) because the chances of dying each turn are a mere 3%.

    While you will see quite a few people dying in their prime, you will also see many of them reaching their late 60’s, their 70’s, even 80’s. The maximum age is set at 89; assuming that even if someone were to live beyond that, he or she will retire from activity. If maximum age is set higher, the chances of dying each turn go down and too many people will be reaching advanced age, which is as undesirable as too many people dying young.

    The average life expectancy should be about 66.5 in Real Death, which is about the same life expectancy in regular SS. The age of death of 100 characters in my last test was as follows:
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 



    The difference is a wider range for possible age of death (56-89) instead of the typical 65-68 we have now.

    Fortunately, most will have an heir before passing away… But also, we will see more kings dying before having a grandson of age, to ensure the continuity of the bloodline beyond the immediate heir. An uncle will probably become next heir in that case… Historical! That is why I have integrated my Royal Women submod, to offset a bit this effect on bloodlines. That way, at least Uncle will probably be of royal blood. This will cause a more unpredictable game, more realistic. What if your favorite general dies at 56? What if your corrupt, unpopular, mad, impious, “uninhibited”, extravagant, cuckold, stupid and every-other-bad-trait king lasts all the way to 89? William the Conqueror lived to 75 in one test, 56 in the next. A source for interesting AAR’s…

    And with more old geezers around, come the new old age traits. I have revised them so Senility might begin anytime after 65, but there’s only a 4% chance per turn of getting it. There’s about a 34% chance of gaining at least Somewhat Senile by 70, 56% by 75, and 71% by 80. But remember “somewhat senile” isn’t full-blown Alzheimer. It’s just like when you can’t remember where you put the car keys. Of course, characters with bad luck will gain additional levels and become Senile or Totally Senile. More ill effects have been added to these traits, since a demented general is very likely to be a terrible governor.

    Too Old to Fight will come at a variable age after 62 (thanks to aduellist for his idea), with Sickly characters gaining it more easily, while Robust ones tend to resist it. There is a chance that a robust general will be a worthy warrior all his life, even into his eighties! (Well, actually a sickly one might achieve that too, but the chances are about 1 in 5,000). Generally speaking, however, most characters will become too old to fight some time in their 60’s, a few in their early 70’s.

    The venerable characteristics of this trait (+ authority, + popularity) from Good Old Men have been removed since we don’t know at what age it will happen, and if he will be venerable enough by then. Instead, a reduction in command has been added.

    An acknowledgement to KaPPPa, for his original research on the workings of old age in M2TW.



    A creepy note:
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Working on this mod was a bit depressing. Avidly waiting for the “obituary” every turn (in faction announcements), thinking: Hey that was a really nice age to die! Trying to find the “realistic” age of death of people… I’m pushing 50 myself. I’ve been doing this so much during the last couple of months that now when the news announce the death of someone famous, what I’m most interested in is: “At what age? At what age?”



    ROYAL WOMEN 1.1
    This submod includes Royal Women, which causes the “of xxx blood” trait to be transmissible, like hemophilia, to the male sons of royal princesses. That way more of the family tree will remain related by blood to the dynasty founder. However, improvements have been introduced, hence it is version 1.1.

    ***The blood trait can now be transmitted from mother to daughter if both are princesses.

    ***Foreign princesses marrying into your family will give a “royal relations” trait to their sons. (This is as it was before, but it had been dropped in RW 1.0 because I had taken those same triggers, tweaked, for my mod). In addition, royal relations now give some real benefits (instead of just that “sense of entitlement”). These are usually similar to those gained by being of that blood, but somewhat reduced. Your princesses that you give away to other factions will transmit those benefits (from your blood) to their sons as well. Being thinner, these relations are only transmitted (after the original princess) from father to son. But a line of males could keep “French Relations” alive for a long time in Scotland’s family tree, for instance.

    MERCHANTS MOD
    While I’m at it, I might as well add another interesting little tweak. Many have noticed that merchants do not gain experience in SS as they used to in vanilla, except by taking over other merchants, which incidentally is mighty difficult given the lowered chances of success. Also, gaining monopolist traits has become impossible because all regions that had two of a same resource now only have one.

    Here, merchants have a small chance per turn of gaining GoodMerchant and Monopolist traits. This chance is just for being alive… It is assumed that whatever he is doing, trading a resource, traveling, sitting in a city, the merchant is always active in his trade and learning.

    I have tested this one for quite a long time and the results are like this: Most merchants will gain about 5-6 finance in a lifetime. A few lucky ones gain more and become uber-merchants. A few unlucky ones will die without having gained a single finance, or perhaps only one or two.

    This tweak works nicely with Real Death because if a guy lives long years, he will also likely become a great merchant.

    Instructions:
    Put descr_campaign_db and export_descr_character_traits in Stainless_Steel_6/data, and export_vnvs in Stainless_Steel_6/data/text. First, backup any file that will be substituted.

    Savegame compatibility: No.
    Other mod compatibility: Yes, if it doesn’t alter any of the files given here. Even then, merging is probably possible. Compatible with any mod in which characters age every other turn, regardless of the relationship between years and turns.
    Last edited by caralampio; November 16, 2008 at 08:13 AM.

  2. #2
    strife1013's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: REAL DEATH 1.0 + ROYAL WOMEN 1.1

    This sounds awesome, I'll give it a go. Plus rep.
    And 50 is the new 20


  3. #3
    Gnostiko's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: REAL DEATH 1.0 + ROYAL WOMEN 1.1

    Sounds awesome! Quick question though, have you any idea how real death will interact with 2tpy?

  4. #4
    caralampio's Avatar Magnificus
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    Default Re: REAL DEATH 1.0 + ROYAL WOMEN 1.1

    Quote Originally Posted by Gnostiko View Post
    Sounds awesome! Quick question though, have you any idea how real death will interact with 2tpy?
    As long as characters age every other turn, as I believe it is in 2tpy, it should work fine.

  5. #5
    Gnostiko's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: REAL DEATH 1.0 + ROYAL WOMEN 1.1

    Jaw-some, downloading now!
    So what's next in the pipeline?

  6. #6

    Default Re: REAL DEATH 1.0 + ROYAL WOMEN 1.1

    Lol, if death of characters was realistic I can imagine getting something like:
    "Your full-star and full-chivalry general just died by choking on a chicken bone!"

    Nice mod btw.

  7. #7

    Default Re: REAL DEATH 1.0 + ROYAL WOMEN 1.1

    Great work! Looking forward to checking this out... +rep
    ...longbows, in skilled hands, could reach further than trebuchets...

  8. #8
    ace4455's Avatar Semisalis
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    Default Re: REAL DEATH 1.0 + ROYAL WOMEN 1.1

    Nice DL now.
    +REP
    Last edited by ace4455; November 20, 2008 at 08:50 AM.

  9. #9

    Default Re: REAL DEATH 1.0 + ROYAL WOMEN 1.1

    is this sub mod compatibility with SS 6.1 ???

  10. #10
    Gnostiko's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: REAL DEATH 1.0 + ROYAL WOMEN 1.1

    Had to winmerge everything due to previous edits I'd made and attempts to reconcile various submods...
    Question about descr_campaign_db - because it's mostly gobledygook to me I'm presuming the only thing I need to copy over are the character ages?

  11. #11
    caralampio's Avatar Magnificus
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    Default Re: REAL DEATH 1.0 + ROYAL WOMEN 1.1

    @intestino- yes

    @Gnostiko- You only need to change maximum age, maximum age before death, and old age.

  12. #12
    Gnostiko's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: REAL DEATH 1.0 + ROYAL WOMEN 1.1

    Hmm, but what do I do to get the 3% old-age-death mechanic?

  13. #13
    Gorrrrrn's Avatar Citizen
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    Default Re: REAL DEATH 1.0 + ROYAL WOMEN 1.1

    Quick question:

    all those negative traits for the human player only or also AI factions?

  14. #14
    caralampio's Avatar Magnificus
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    Default Re: REAL DEATH 1.0 + ROYAL WOMEN 1.1

    @Gnostiko- The 3% chance comes with the mod It is a result of the modifications in descr_campaign_db and calculated according to KaPPPa's data, however in-game testing seems to turn out a little different from the statistically-predicted results; this could be chance, or something's a bit off in KaPPPa's algorithm (but close enough).

    @Rozanov- Yes, the traits should apply to AI factions. I have not actually seen one of my old age or blood traits on an AI character, but that's because AI traits are usually not readily visible to the player. I have seen foreign princesses give relations traits to my princes. I'm certain that the age mod works for AI characters as well (some of the characters included in the stats given above are AI). The merchant mod I'm also quite sure that it works on AI merchants. Their finance progresses at the same apparent rate as that of the player's merchants.

  15. #15

    Default Re: REAL DEATH 1.0 + ROYAL WOMEN 1.1

    Caralampio, your mod is great, however it's not currently compatible with Faction Crowns Mod that I'm using, as both change the export_descr_character_traits and export_vnvs files!

    Check it out..the mod is awesome!
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...faction+crowns

    So I'm wondering..could you post what I would need to add in those two files to make your mod work?

    I already have your descr_campaign_db file!

  16. #16
    caralampio's Avatar Magnificus
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    Default Re: REAL DEATH 1.0 + ROYAL WOMEN 1.1

    OK in export_descr_character_traits search for "Trait Royal_Blood_English". Everything from there to "Trait Princess_Royal_Blood_Kwarezm" should be copied. Now, if some of this material is in the other mod, they're not compatible.

    The go to the end of the file and paste this

    ;------------------------------------------
    Trigger TooOldSickly
    WhenToTest CharacterTurnEnd

    Condition IsGeneral
    and CharacterAge > 62
    and Trait Sickly > 0
    and Trait TooOldToFight = 0

    Affects TooOldToFight 1 Chance 25
    ;------------------------------------------
    Trigger TooOldNormal
    WhenToTest CharacterTurnEnd

    Condition IsGeneral
    and CharacterAge > 62
    and Trait Sickly < 1
    and Trait Robust < 1
    and Trait TooOldToFight = 0

    Affects TooOldToFight 1 Chance 15
    ;------------------------------------------
    Trigger TooOldRobust
    WhenToTest CharacterTurnEnd

    Condition IsGeneral
    and CharacterAge > 62
    and Trait Robust > 0
    and Trait TooOldToFight = 0

    Affects TooOldToFight 1 Chance 7
    ;------------------------------------------
    Trigger Alzheimer
    WhenToTest CharacterTurnEnd

    Condition IsGeneral
    and CharacterAge > 65

    Affects Senile 1 Chance 4

    Now find "Trigger agents33"
    Substitute that trigger with both the following triggers

    ;------------------------------------------
    Trigger agents33
    WhenToTest CharacterTurnEnd
    Condition AgentType = merchant
    Affects Monopolist 1 Chance 5

    ;------------------------------------------
    Trigger agents33a
    WhenToTest CharacterTurnEnd
    Condition AgentType = merchant
    Affects GoodMerchant 1 Chance 5

    OK I think that's it with traits. In vnvs,

    {Beyond_Battle} Beyond Battle
    {Beyond_Battle_desc} This man is no longer physically capable of taking the field of battle.
    {Beyond_Battle_effects_desc} -4 to your general's hitpoints (how many hits your general can take before dying), -15% to Movement Points, -1 Morale to all troops on the field, -1 Command
    {Somewhat_Senile} Somewhat Senile
    {Somewhat_Senile_desc} This man's mind is showing signs of aging. He is not as sharp as he once was.
    {Somewhat_Senile_effects_desc} -2 Command, -1 Authority, 5% penalty on tax income
    {Senile} Senile
    {Senile_desc} This man has clearly become senile. He is often incapable of keeping his mind on matters at hand.
    {Senile_effects_desc} -4 Command, -2 Authority, -1 Morale to all troops on the field, 10% penalty on tax income, 5% penalty on all trade income
    {Totally_Senile} Totally Senile
    {Totally_Senile_desc} This man's mental degeneration is complete. His moments of coherency are fleeting.
    {Totally_Senile_effects_desc} -6 Command, -3 Authority, -3 Morale to all troops on the field, 15% penalty on tax income, 10% penalty on all trade income, +2 to unrest (has a negative effect on public order)

    Then find everything that starts with Royal_Relation_ and substitute it with what's given in the mod.

    That's all I think

  17. #17

    Default Re: REAL DEATH 1.0 + ROYAL WOMEN 1.1

    Cool mod man, I am going to have to try this out, I'm playing Perfectly Polished that I installed awhile back, I love it but I may just downgrade to ST 6.1 and mod it myself (using various peoples mods, because i'm useless in everything except video warfare).

  18. #18
    caralampio's Avatar Magnificus
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    Default Re: REAL DEATH 1.0 + ROYAL WOMEN 1.1

    Santiago I missed something you also have to add in traits everything from
    Trigger Royal_Blood_English_CharacterComesOfAge_Father

    to

    ;------------------------------------------
    Trigger Royal_Blood_Kwarezm_CharacterComesOfAge_Father
    WhenToTest CharacterComesOfAge
    Condition FatherTrait Royal_Blood_Kwarezm > 0
    Affects Royal_Blood_Kwarezm 1 Chance 100

  19. #19
    strife1013's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: REAL DEATH 1.0 + ROYAL WOMEN 1.1

    Caralampio

    Can you create a file where the crown mod wont conflict with this mod?


  20. #20

    Default Re: REAL DEATH 1.0 + ROYAL WOMEN 1.1

    Thanx a lot Caralampio, gonna try it out!

    Here are the files from Faction Crowns Mod if you want to make it compatible for Strife!

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