Russia -- again

**Viking Prince** · October 31, 2008, 12:16 AM

I have returned to Russia.

I read the stickied guide written by poetnic and I thought, why not? I have just finished Spain and Russia will be a nice change of pace. I then reviewed some advice that Clandestino had helped me within another thread. And I checked out the TotalWar.org guide as well.

I had forgotten how quiet and lonely it can be in Russia. No news from the Pope and not really concerned with the petty wars of the Catholics.

I began with the Vilnius Push basic strategy, but with a twist. I kept the Grand Duke's force intact and headed straight for Thorn. I hoped to either beat out the Poles or watch them retreat embarassed by the Baltic's defense. The Grand Duke was disappointed. Upon his arrival he was able to witness the triumphal Poles entering the castle at Thorn. Rather than start a war and seize the castle, he accepted a trade agreement for some florins. Map information was also given to the Poles in good faith. This was a waste of both time and resources. The Grand Duke was never quite the same after this.

It is now the during the reign of the next Grand Duke (turn 30) THe Russians have united Moscow, Ryzan, Caffa, Kiev, Iasi, Smolensk, Vilnius, Helsinki, and Riga into the Novgorod Grand Duchy. Cash is tight. The basic wall improvements are made as they become available, basic roads, land improvements, small churches, and ports have been constructed as quickly as possible. A drill square and ballista factory has been completed in Vilnius. The economy is growing as well as can be expected for such a poor land.

The land and population are growing -- faster infact than nobles to capmmand troops. Currently there is only the Grand Duke (in Vilnius, the capital), the Heir (in Moscow), and one other family member (in Iasi's castle). Three generals are not sufficient to command a large offensive and to also keep the rebel bands in check. A general was adopted, but with a single loyalty rating, he quickly turned rebel and had to be disposed of to set an example for the realm.

THe Poles are peaceful today, but perhaps not for long. Both Poland and Hungary are at peace with Europe and are not allied with other powers.
What should the grand strategy be for the Grand Duke at this point in time?

The youngest general has made a suggestion. We may very well end up at war with an allied Poland and Hungary. It well be best to strike first. If or perhaps when Hungary goes to war with Byzantium, we will find the opportunity. Complete some carapults at Vilnius and with a professional army -- strike at Bran. This is the heart of Hungary's ability to build a war machine. At the same time take a smaller cavalry force from Isasi to cover our flank. Follow up a quick strike on Bran with a seige of Bucharest -- first with the cavalry and then followed up with the seige train and army from Bran. Without Hungary, Poland may not even intervene.

The only problem is that the Grand Duke is living in splendid isolation. He does not believe in sending dplomats to the far corners of Europe. He believes that if the other powers are truly interested in contact with Russia that they will come to the Grand Dukes court.

Comments? Observations? Alternatives not considereed?

EDIT: Only Vilnius, Ryzan, and Isasi are castles -- all other settlements are city based.

**Lysimachus** · October 31, 2008, 04:37 AM

What about going for Sarkel, Bulgar and Tbilisi, and then maybe starting a war with Poland?

**Viking Prince** · October 31, 2008, 02:32 PM

Originally Posted by Alex Coles

What about going for Sarkel, Bulgar and Tbilisi, and then maybe starting a war with Poland?

I leave Sarkel, Bulgar and Tbilisi rebel intentionally. I believe this limits exposure to the Mingils if they come north of the Caspian. Also they simply do not pay more than they cost before the Mongols/Timorids come through. This also limits conflict with the Turks.

I am also intending to complete the traditional goals of uniting the slavic regions, the Balkans, and Constantinople before heading on other missions.

Attack Poland? This is a possability. THe question is really one of which is to be first Poland or Hungary? Probably depends on if one is tied down in conflict or not. Then the question is whether to attack the one at war or the one at peace. The key to a olish campaign goes through Thorn. With Hungary the key is Bran. To broad of a front to do both and Russia is simply not strong enough to take both on at once. This is why II staterted the thread.

Thanks for your post.

btw -- be sure to click the links if you want to learn what others have said on the opening strategy with Russia. Lot's of good stuff.

Regards.

**Viking Prince Olaf** · January 24, 2009, 10:37 AM

If the Mongols do come they'll come at Bulgar And Sarkel I think is very valuble as it is one of the 12 peices to Black Sea trade superiority.

If you want to fuel A large scale invasion to watever country
and you don't want to have too many cities and more castles to mass produce as Russia I think is A very overpowered faction starting with A city, A stable economy, an isolated position, and OUTSTANDING cavelry.
All come from castles so take control of the Black Sea trade or B.S.T.

What I usually do with Russia is like A battle flanking tactic

What you do is invade Scandinavia, take England, strike Spain and attack
France and HRE from all sides spliting their forces in half witch is not A problem for you by now as you can fund one first of all

How do you handle the Mongols? They come at A time where Russia should be at its peak so I think you can very well match or overpower them with your missle cavelry and numbers. I'm sure you have pwned Mongols many times over but I havn't. Come to think of it I have never head on engaged them, I did gurrila style tactics hit and run wearing them down, replenishing troops where needed as they couldn't and overwhelming them...... But, thats just my thinking of how to defeat them, I'll have to try it out on those barbarians......

**Viking Prince** · January 24, 2009, 10:45 AM

First, the Mongols tend to go south of the Caspian Sea almost every time.

Second, they are coded to find a homeland at Kiev, if they go north. All factions are strongest when focused on a single goal and weaker when dispersed toward many goals. The Russian strength is a corner position against powers that are surrounded.

The Mongols will end up with a surrounded position if they settle in Kiev and then need to deal with the Turks, the Byzantines, the Russians, the Hungarians, etc. Why attempt to crush the faction directly, when strategic overreach makes the process easier? I mean other than the pure fun of turning the Blsck Sea regin into a cinder!

**Viking Prince Olaf** · January 24, 2009, 11:03 AM

Their not going to head straight for Keiv, their going to loot and exterminate on the way.......

If the do travel south they'll have the ENTIRE middle east to themselves, theirs only 3 entries to the middle ast by land, Iberia/N.Africa, Turkey/Byzantium, and Turkey/Russia. All of witch is OUTSTANDINGLY holdeble by slim passes or bridges. If they so happen to make A home in Antioch and expand, it will take several turns of sea embarking to finally expunge them permanently. It's scary to think you will have to face an even better army the Timurids later. My point is wether its the Mongols or Timurids,....wherever they land IT IS NOT GOOD.

**Sodbuster** · January 24, 2009, 04:53 PM

My advice is get rid of Poland as soon as possible. Otherwise they'll start spamming armies that have 5+ Polish Noble units in them, and will be a royal pain in the ass. In my Russian campaign, shortly after they declared war on me, they sent one army to Riga that had 8 units of Polish Nobles and a general! Once they get heavy infantry they're going to be even more difficult for you. Go for Thorn first, so they can't make any more Nobles, and so you'll be able to make your heavy infantry. Then take Krakow and whatever else they have. Concentrate on Poland, keep a decent army in Kiev to defend against Hungary when it attacks.

I took Stockholm very early on, and I've had an incredible time defending it against full stack after full stack of Danish troops from Arhus. Mercenary Xbows and Spearmen kept me alive long enough to make a counter push and take Oslo, and now I'm perched to take Arhus and end this stupid Danish aggression. Poland is dead, and the HRE are losing because they're fighting France as well. Denmark, Poland, and the HRE all allied right away, and had been hitting my western border like mad. Seriously, Thorn is the only thing that kept me going against the HRE for awhile, until France attacked them.

Anyways, don't worry about the Mongols. Poland is your biggest threat, then Hungary. Poland can not be allowed to get any better, or their unit roster will be twice as good as yours and you'll be toast.

**Commander5xl** · January 25, 2009, 10:35 AM

Hmm, I'd say ally with the Byz and take out Hungary together then move onto Poland

**Viking Prince Olaf** · January 25, 2009, 11:42 AM

Your right,...Poland is A pain in the ass but Mongols have Thousands and their all medium class archers.....since theirs so many,...I'd call em the Aztecs of the East...lol

The Byzantines are A bigger threat LATER ON
but if you take over them you have B.S.F.T.A. (Black Sea Free Trade Agreement.) wll give you like 20-30k easy.

Russia has the potentiol to hold off The Mongols and Timurids.
Russia naturally owns 2 of the 3 entrances by land to the Deserts,
Sarkel and Constantinople.

**Viking Prince** · January 25, 2009, 12:16 PM

My best and somewhat recent campaign with the Russians was a won long campaign by first taking out the Poles (vassalage remains in Magdeburg and Stettin), elimination of the Hungarians, Conquest of the Balkans followed by the occupation of Constantinople and a bit of Anatolia, vassalage of the Venicians for the win. The Mongols approached Kiev and were blunted -- their main attack was against Antioch which became their home and then a Russian ally. A brief journey into the Holy Land in aid of the Mongols against the Egyptians was the last campaign to gather the required settlement count.

**Panzerbear** · January 25, 2009, 12:25 PM

I have played (as you can imagine) as Russian faction for quite a few times.

the best strategy is to choke Poland's growth from the very beginning, because they will be a major pain in the butt in later stages. also, I would highly recommend to capture Scandinavia right away. these areas are very secluded from Western Europe, but provide a perfect platform for launching sea-borne assaults and wreak havoc on all European coasts (and own their silly heavy-infantry biased armies with your cavalry armies).

**Gromovnik** · November 15, 2009, 06:04 PM

I have big money problems playing as Russia. And most of the rewards for missions are units, not florins, which makes things even worse...Other than that, great faction to play.

**RollingWave** · November 15, 2009, 08:45 PM

Why not head over and take Scandinavia provinces first?

**Viking Prince** · November 23, 2009, 12:39 AM

Originally Posted by RollingWave

Why not head over and take Scandinavia provinces first?

That is always a possible choice. I like to minimize potential enemy factions and moving into scandinavia just expands the number of enemies. Also, if you are role playing the factions -- the historic conflicts for Russia are all in the east. On the other hand, if you want the Russians to be a factor in western alliances -- Sweden and Norway make a good launching point to support or attack the Scots, the English, the French, etc. The choice is always yours.