This is a year old, but what the hell? PC gone utterly insane

[Farnan]

Defence chiefs have abandoned plans to raise a regiment of British Sikhs amid fears that the move would be branded racist.

The proposal to create the regiment, reminiscent of those that fought for Britain in the two world wars, was dropped by the Ministry of Defence after discussions with the Commission for Racial Equality (CRE).

Sikh leaders had informed Army recruitment officers that they could easily find enough volunteers to form a 700-strong regiment. However, despite the infantry being under strength by 3,000 soldiers, the offer was rejected.

Lieutenant General Sir Freddie Viggers, the Adjutant General with responsibility for recruitment, is understood to have accepted the argument put forward by race commissioners at the CRE that creating a Sikh regiment would be divisive and amounted to "segregation".

Leaders of Britain's 500,000 Sikhs were supportive of the idea of a new regiment, arguing that it would be no different from the Scots, Welsh and Irish Guards or the Royal Gurkha Rifles, which recruits exclusively from Nepal and which is regarded as a model infantry regiment.

The decision to shelve the plans was last night criticised by politicians, members of the Sikh community and soldiers, who claimed that the Army had fallen victim to political correctness.

Kuljit Singh Gulati, the general secretary of the Sikh Temple in Shepherd's Bush, west London, said: "The Sikhs have a long and distinguished heritage of serving with the British Army.

"I know there are many, many Sikhs who would join up and would serve wherever required. But if you want to get them in large numbers they need their own regiment, something they would take a huge amount of pride in.

"They would regard it as very prestigious. It is a shame that it now looks as though it will never happen."

A senior Army officer said: "The MoD has missed a golden opportunity in not tapping into the Sikh community's desire to form a regiment. It's nonsense to suggest this would amount to segregation and since when did the CRE dictate Britain's defence -policy?"

The decision will also dismay Prince Charles, who has expressed an interest in the creation of dedicated units to boost the number of people from ethnic minorities in the services and to harness the military tradition of the Sikh faith in particular.

Last year, the armed forces were ordered to meet tough targets to recruit more men and women from ethnic minorities.

A spokesman for the Ministry of Defence said: "The creation of a Sikh Regiment has been considered by the Army policy staff responsible for both equality and diversity issues, who went on to consult with the Commission for Racial Equality.

"Both agreed that grouping ethnic minorities runs counter to the Armed Forces philosophy that seeks to include, not exclude, and extend opportunities."

A CRE spokesman said: "We would not support any policy that seeks to isolate specific groups in the Armed Forces or wider society.

"The creation of a separate regiment according to ethnicity would be segregation, which amounts to discrimination under the Race Relations Act. Anything that creates separation between regiments can only have a detrimental effect upon our Armed Forces' operational effectiveness."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...%27-fears.html

What the hell?

The Sikh community wanted their own regiment, the Sikh politicians lobbied for it, the non-Sikhs probably didn't care and wanted it, but some probably white Christian/atheist/agnostic politicians decided it would be racist against the Sikhs so won't let it happen.

Furthermore, practicing Sikhs have a problem joining non-Indian militaries due to restrictions about facial hair and hair styles along with Turban wear. An all-Sikh regiment can get around this and allow them to serve.

[Oglethorpe1983]

Well come the PC world of the 21st Century...

We have been dealing with things like this is the states for the past 30 yrs... The PC culture is strangling the "Western" World... it really is pathetic...

In fact I have just come up with a new defiition for PC... Populist Commie

I dont scare if it sounds stupid...Im gonna use it.... but that might not be a PC thing to do... what a cunumdrum Im in

[Hunter Makoy]

Well come the PC UK of the 21st Century...

thats a bit more accurate. i haven't seen any other country go so over board on PC over the last couple of years as the UK. they got that self guilt part down pat.

[Hunter Makoy]

Nonsense. America has not suggested such a thing...

not on their scale.

[Каие]

not on their scale.

Really? pray tell.

[Oglethorpe1983]

thats a bit more accurate. i haven't seen any other country go so over board on PC over the last couple of years as the UK. they got that self guilt part down pat.

Have you been to America.... you cant walk 10 feet without bieng forced to apoligize to someone from something you did to offend them... America is the greatest victim of the PC mentality... I'll gladly debate this issue with anyone who thinks the UK can go toe to toe with us in that regard

[roy34543]

An all-anything regiment is pretty bad unless your talking about different branches, It really breaks morale to diffrentiate different groups. In a war some people might be annoyed they get stuck with "the wierd turban guys" that theyve never even met before. In my opinion just let them break regulation and move them into normal regiments.
That said its not racist at all if a sikh regiment exists. and if you have other nationality-only regiments its ridicolous not to choose between abolishing those or making a sikh regiment.

[Farnan]

An all-anything regiment is pretty bad unless your talking about different branches, It really breaks morale to diffrentiate different groups. In a war some people might be annoyed they get stuck with "the wierd turban guys" that theyve never even met before. In my opinion just let them break regulation and move them into normal regiments.
That said its not racist at all if a sikh regiment exists. and if you have other nationality-only regiments its ridicolous not to choose between abolishing those or making a sikh regiment.

However, in Britain you decide what regiment you join so the Sikh Regiment will be all Sikh so no one will be stuck with them unless they want to be.

Britain already has all-nationality regiments, the Royal Scots, the Royal Irish, the Royal Welsh, the Irish Guards, the Welsh Guard and the Scots Guards.

[Каие]

Britain already has all-nationality regiments, the Royal Scots, the Royal Irish, the Royal Welsh, the Irish Guards, the Welsh Guard and the Scots Guards.

Actually I believe they refer to area of recruitment, rather than nationality. As one can't be of Irish, Welsh or Scottish nationality technically, anyone can join those regiments too.

------

In regards to the topic, one of the things I advocate to boost recruitment numbers in the British Army is to do just that. Introduce all-ethnic/religious regiments.

• Currently over 10,000 commonwealth non-citizens serve in Britain. We should create a Commonwealth section of the Army split into regions of the world. I.e. Canadian, Afro-Caribbean, Indian, Pacific.
• In addition we should most definitely raise a 700 strong regiment of Sikhs, and not stop there either.
• Muslims too.
• Other minorities such as Indians, and Pakistanis.
• In addition we should set up a French-style EU/Foreign Legion to recruit foreigners and raise near to the 10,000 France has.

We already have foreign units, Falklands, Gibraltan, and Ghurka regiments. I think it's an excellent way to raise unity within the country to end the stereotype that the army is white-anglo-irish and is the tool of the white government.

Stupid PC.

thats a bit more accurate. i haven't seen any other country go so over board on PC over the last couple of years as the UK. they got that self guilt part down pat.

Nonsense. America has not suggested such a thing...

[Richard]

However, in Britain you decide what regiment you join so the Sikh Regiment will be all Sikh so no one will be stuck with them unless they want to be.

Britain already has all-nationality regiments, the Royal Scots, the Royal Irish, the Royal Welsh, the Irish Guards, the Welsh Guard and the Scots Guards.

That's what I was thinking, and the Ghurkas of course spring to mind also. Perhaps defining a Sikh might be difficult as it is defined by religion/culture rather than geographical area, but I'm sure Sikh imposters could be sorted easily enough.

[Farnan]

That's what I was thinking, and the Ghurkas of course spring to mind also. Perhaps defining a Sikh might be difficult as it is defined by religion/culture rather than geographical area, but I'm sure Sikh imposters could be sorted easily enough.

Well they can allow non-Sikhs to join, that wouldn't be an issue. The regiment would just be geared, uniform wise and special reg wise, towards the Sikh culture, just as Scottish Regiments get kilts for dress uniforms.

[Каие]

Well they can allow non-Sikhs to join, that wouldn't be an issue. The regiment would just be geared, uniform wise and special reg wise, towards the Sikh culture, just as Scottish Regiments get kilts for dress uniforms.

Yeah but there is a requirement regarding beard length for masks, and hair length for helmets, it disqualifies. If there was a way around...perhaps. I mean the Indian army must have sikhs in it right?

[roy34543]

However, in Britain you decide what regiment you join so the Sikh Regiment will be all Sikh so no one will be stuck with them unless they want to be.

Britain already has all-nationality regiments, the Royal Scots, the Royal Irish, the Royal Welsh, the Irish Guards, the Welsh Guard and the Scots Guards.

Yeah well .. it might be a good idea to get rid of that if you want an army thats more solidary in war. But then im not an army commander, Perhaps it actually works better somehow if all the regiments rival each other.

[Thanatos]

The minorities in America really need to learn to shut up. You want to know about working hard to get to better places? How about my parents for an example, then? My father is white, and my mother is Chinese. Both were absolutely dirt poor. They worked their butts off, and managed to get into Cal State Fullerton, which, let's be honest, is one of the crappiest colleges you can there is. They couldn't afford any better.

Yet they worked and worked and worked, and eventually scrapped enough to get their masters, and now they're both aerospace engineers for NASA and JPL/Caltech.

Don't give me any of this "I'm too poor, I'll never get anywhere, therefore I deserve welfare and special treatment" crap.

[Farnan]

The minorities in America really need to learn to shut up. You want to know about working hard to get to better places? How about my parents for an example, then? My father is white, and my mother is Chinese. Both were absolutely dirt poor. They worked their butts off, and managed to get into Cal State Fullerton, which, let's be honest, is one of the crappiest colleges you can there is. They couldn't afford any better.

Yet they worked and worked and worked, and eventually scrapped enough to get their masters, and now they're both aerospace engineers for NASA and JPL/Caltech.

Don't give me any of this "I'm too poor, I'll never get anywhere, therefore I deserve welfare and special treatment" crap.

What does that have to do with anything?

This is about the Sikh Community going to the British Army and offering to create a Sikh Regiment for the British Army and the British Army saying no because they believed it would be racist against Sikhs...

[Thanatos]

What does that have to do with anything?

This is about the Sikh Community going to the British Army and offering to create a Sikh Regiment for the British Army and the British Army saying no because they believed it would be racist against Sikhs...

I'm just speaking in general about everyone who whines about racism, be they a minority or no.

[Каие]

This is about the Sikh Community going to the British Army and offering to create a Sikh Regiment for the British Army and the British Army saying no because they believed it would be racist against Sikhs...

It must be noted that there is another PC culture rising which is only the other side of the same coin...mostly advocated by the far right, 'anti-white' discrimination. It's rapidly gaining ground. They believe anything done for minorities because they are minorities is anti-white, another form of PC which goes largely ignored. I would say it's nothing to do with being racist to the Sikhs, but rather, in the opinions of some, racist for them. I'm sure they see it very much as Sikhs 'don't want to serve with whitey' and the government is helping them do that. It's just double standards really.

Except this is a special circumstance. Sikhs can't shave their beards, have to wear their hair a certain way and have other religious requirements. Without this method their would be little way for them to serve despite a willingness to, unless you want to give them special privileges which would hurt relations badly.

This isn't a case of "I don't want to serve with whitey" but a case of "I want to serve but I can't because the military appearance requirements contradict my religious requirements and this is how I think I can do it"

But this is an excellent point and post, which I agree with entirely.It must be noted in the 'quest' to defeat PC, a different kind of PC has arisen. It seems there is no centre ground amongst the establishment.

[Каие]

Man, the thread is about the UK Army setting up a Sikh Indian only legion, which was rejected to racial connotations.

[LoZz]

segregation (by choice) has already done alot of damage to our society, our towns and tolerance. i do not think it would do our army any good.

[Farnan]

segregation (by choice) has already done alot of damage to our society, our towns and tolerance. i do not think it would do our army any good.

Except this is a special circumstance. Sikhs can't shave their beards, have to wear their hair a certain way and have other religious requirements. Without this method their would be little way for them to serve despite a willingness to, unless you want to give them special privileges which would hurt relations badly.

This isn't a case of "I don't want to serve with whitey" but a case of "I want to serve but I can't because the military appearance requirements contradict my religious requirements and this is how I think I can do it"