Hi Joar,
the Bulgars are a single faction in AoD part "3" (the herakleios campaign)!!
The poll in this thread is faulty and not correct.
The faction which is used for AoD"2" is a loose confederacy under the banner of the Avars (which includes the Bulgars).
That means - depending of the region - you can also recruit Bulgar units as Avar player.
According the hist. euratlas we have strong Avaric groups north-east of the black sea and west side of the caspian sea.
Historically (at the beginning of the 6th century) they still provided de facto the leadership of Alani (the group which settled north of the crimea area), Antes, Bulgari, Abasgi and Maeotae.
The famous time of the Bulgars begun in the 630s when the 2 main tribes of Utigurs and Kutrigurs were united under Kubrat - and that state was know under the name Onogundur-Bulgar (Oghondor-blkar).
Before - they were part of the Avar dominion in the west and part of the Göktürk empire (558AD) in the east.
If somebody has interests about that era I suggest the book of Petar Dobrev with the title Unknown Ancient Bulgaria. page 158 (and on) is related to that issue (6th + 7th cent.).
Best regards
pm
Last edited by Pompeius Magnus; October 18, 2009 at 10:51 AM.
yes they are. But not as closed nation as you know them from Attila's time.
It is a faction, similar like the Avars, which consists of several tribes.
After the defeat at the Battle of Nedao we can see that the hunnic tribe became divided by 3 parts.
The 1st under the leadership of Ernak was settled (under roman leadership) in the Dobrudscha-area. They became later the basic for the new Gagausic-tribe (or Gagavuz).
The 2nd group settled by themself at the border of the modern serbia+bulgaria.
The 3rd group stayed in what is know today as Hungary.
At the black sea area and near the end of the river Volga we still see several bigger tribe confoederacies which were also mentioned between 539 and 540 by roman writters (esp. by Procopius and Agathias).
this is a translation of Procopius' famous book "The Secret History"
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
As the Romans were now at peace with all the world and he [Justinian] had no other means of satisfying his lust for slaughter, he set the barbarians all to fighting each other. And for no reason at all he sent for the Hun chieftains, and with idiotic magnanimity gave them large sums of money, alleging he did this to secure their friendship. This, as I have said, he had also done in Justin's time. These Huns, as soon as they had got this money, sent it together with their soldiers to others of their chieftains, with the word to make inroads into the land of the Emperor: so that they might collect further tribute from him, to buy them off in a second peace. Thus the Huns enslaved the Roman Empire, and were paid by the Emperor to keep on doing it.
This encouraged still others of them to rob the poor Romans; and after their pillaging, they too were further rewarded by the gracious Emperor. In this way all the Huns, for when it was not one tribe of them it was another, continuously overran and laid waste the Empire. For the barbarians were led by many different chieftains, and the war, thanks to Justinian's senseless generosity, was thus endlessly protracted. Consequently no place, mountain or cave, or any other spot in Roman territory, during this time remained uninjured; and many regions were pillaged more than five times.
But as said, you can't see them like the huns of the classical Attila-time, however, it would also be a mistake to ignore them.
It is better said a confoederacy which saw itself as legal successors of the old hunnic group - which includes the groups of Kutrigurs, Utigurs, Onogurs, Sarigurs and others which were collectively called "Huns" by the Romans (hunni) as well as by themself!
Kutrigur and Utigur were tribal chiefs (sub-kings), but their name was given to the people they led.
Result for AoD2: you see a hunnic faction with a certain small pool of typically tribal huns (a minority). On the other side, and this is more important, you'll find larger groups which were part of the old hunnic confoederation (time of Attila) and who became now the domiant part.
Even long after the 550s we find tales of huns who attacked Constantinople or greece together with the Avars. But the term "hun" was used as a collectively word by the scholars.
Finally, after 560s we meet new powers which were established out of the existing hunnic structures like the Bulgars and certain turc-people (e.g. the Cumans, Petschengs, Chasars or Volga-Bulgars). But that's more a chapter of AoD3.
Last edited by Pompeius Magnus; October 18, 2009 at 07:17 PM.
im trying to find a news clip from along time ago about a african trib that claimed to be the vndel tribe, anyone who can find it please post it for me
im going to be the Romans hmmm or maybe the goths of italy or the franks....NO..the Britts....then again the king of kings might be good.......I CANT MAKE UP MY MIND!!! AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
"ANY person,country or race who use's religion as a pretext to kill or conquer deserves neither Religion nore Name"
As am I glad to see you, since I got pulled from the corps I haven't wanted to post much..more of in shame that they..ugh never mind. I'm allways lurking about I'm the ibfd forums and here. Im glad to see sbh and Pm. I miss all the posting and topics you guys had. I realy want Runia Roma and AOD 2 lol
I love the thought of a Romano gothic kingdom, I realy do mainly because Italy was doing better under them
but that dose not mean the empire won't strike back
Last edited by legio_XX; November 26, 2009 at 04:17 AM.
"ANY person,country or race who use's religion as a pretext to kill or conquer deserves neither Religion nore Name"
Ohhhh NO you get your Awesome historic modding butt back here!! Lol just kidding get to work best of luck hope things are going well. I will stop over posting I promise(sorry for doing so don't mean to bother)
it's time to sleep then eat alot of turky, play call of duty and eat so more!
Happy thanksgiving to all yanks!! I swear we Americans look for any reason to over eat..I'm so...proud
"ANY person,country or race who use's religion as a pretext to kill or conquer deserves neither Religion nore Name"
Ohhhh NO you get your Awesome historic modding butt back here!! Lol just kidding get to work best of luck hope things are going well. I will stop over posting I promise(sorry for doing so don't mean to bother)
it's time to sleep then eat alot of turky, play call of duty and eat so more!
Happy thanksgiving to all yanks!! I swear we Americans look for any reason to over eat..I'm so...proud
i could eat some Turkey now ,but doesn't it sort of ruin Christmas having turkey and all that so close
sorry,i understand you don't realize i'm joking(ok,maybe not a good one for germanic people)but i really like vandals,especially Genseric,and I think that their bad rename is not deserved,because other peoples are worse than vandals,for instance huns or mongols.In my country vandals it means hooligan,and avar some cheap and tight fisted(stingy).Sorry for my English
PM i read a very interesting book recently you might be interested in its called "The Ruin of the Empire" its by James J .o'Donnell .its about the emperor Justinian and Theoderic mostly ,he's not a fan of Justinian (title sort of says that )its very informative ,not much of a book review i know but give it a read if got time .Do not know if its printed in German though
Re: Which nation will you play... and why?
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Originally Posted by Pompeius Magnus
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best of luck hope things are going well. I will stop over posting I promise(sorry for doing so don't mean to bother)
