US Treasury wants us to trust them -- no courts and no congressional oversite

[Viking Prince]

Treasury Seeks Asset-Buying Power Unchecked by Courts

The Bush administration sought unchecked power from Congress to buy $700 billion in bad mortgage investments from financial companies in what would be an unprecedented government intrusion into the markets.

Through his plan, Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson aims to avert a credit freeze that would bring the financial system and the world's largest economy to a standstill. The bill would prevent courts from reviewing actions taken under its authority.

``He's asking for a huge amount of power,'' said Nouriel Roubini, an economist at New York University. ``He's saying, `Trust me, I'm going to do it right if you give me absolute control.' This is not a monarchy.''

As congressional aides and officials scrutinized the proposal, the Treasury late yesterday clarified the types of assets it would purchase. Paulson would have authority to buy home loans, mortgage-backed securities, commercial mortgage- related assets and, after consultation with the Federal Reserve chairman, ``other assets, as deemed necessary to effectively stabilize financial markets,'' the Treasury said in a statement.

The Treasury would also have discretion, after discussions with the Fed, to make non-U.S. financial institutions eligible under the program.

The plan would raise the ceiling on the national debt and spend as much as the combined annual budgets of the Departments of Defense, Education and Health and Human Services. Paulson is asking for the power to hire asset managers and award contracts to private companies. Most provisions of the proposal expire after two years from the date of enactment.

With elections in about 6 weeks -- is this a wise approach to solving the banking problem? Is Congress giving up oversite authority? Can Congress really draft legislation to keep the courts out of the process? Is this wise even if possible?

I have grave doubts about this proposal. The above questions pretty much show my thoughts. Please read the entire Bloomberg article and comment.

[Каие]

So much for small government, and anti-communism. (I know, I know it's not really communism, but bloody well close enough) It seems those who favour 'small' government, it only works in time of peace and economic prosperity. For in times of war and security conscience government is big, and intrusive in times of capitalistic failure of banks and the economy, government gets bigger and full of even more intrusion.

Is small government ever even an option?

As for this, it's probably the best way to solve this almighty mess, maybe in future we will regulate these trigger happy banks and mortgage lenders.

[Heinz Guderian]

Capitalism: you're doing it wrong.

[Scar Face]

Troubling. I guess on one hand it shows how bad the state of our economy is when this is actually being seriously considered.

[The King Of Peasants]

It is an disapointment that our government has shed its (supposed) philosphy of small government capitalism during a crisis that's the most important time.

[LoZz]

It is an disapointment that our government has shed its (supposed) philosphy of small government capitalism during a crisis that's the most important time.

rather that then another great depression.

[El Brujo]

rather that then another great depression.

That's the kind of attitude that lets them take away your freedom.

[Iscariott]

That's the kind of attitude that lets them take away your freedom.

+rep

[LoZz]

That's the kind of attitude that lets them take away your freedom.

well dont complain when your queuing around the block for your daily soup.


politcal ideology isnt as important as having a roof over your head or a job or food in your belly. now we are not there yet, but if we carry on down the road of "freedom" and allowing the banks to go under, we will be there.

i couldnt care less what system of government i had ruleing me if i didnt have a job, or a home or even food, little things like government structure are pritty unimportant if you dont have the basic's. socialism vs libertarianism means nothing if you dont have the basics. some people really would bite there nose to spite there face.

[Erich von Manstein]

rather that then another great depression.

If this kind of crisis could cause another Great Depression, I can't even begin to fathom the magnitude of the impact on the world economy when the U.S. is forced to default on its loan - in part due to measures like these. At the very least, the American economy will be permanently crippled (nobody wants to loan to defaulters) and the Chinese economy will fall into a lengthy depression. Odds are that the true impact will be far more widespread.

America's current position is analogous to a person with an infection on his hand who has been too busy to treat it. What originally could have been treated with an antibiotic ointment now requires surgery to remove the necrotic tissue. If the person refuses the surgery, amputation of the limb will become necessary. If the person refuses amputation, there is a very significant likelihood that death will follow.

America is currently somewhere between surgery and amputation. Whereas in 2000 it looked as if a balanced budget and smaller government would eventually solve the problem, it is becoming increasingly likely that a permanent slashing of major government programs (Social Security, for instance) will be necessary just to keep the American (and world's, by extension) economy intact. Given that the politicians are continuing to bury their heads in the sand by believing they can "buy" their way out of each economic downturn, things aren't looking good for the patient.

[Mikelus Trento]

rather that then another great depression.

Or so we are told.

Others might suggest that it is nothing more than an election ploy.

[JP226]

rather that then another great depression.

what amkes you think there is going to be another great depression?

[LoZz]

what amkes you think there is going to be another great depression?

if the us government didnt do what there doing. there could of been. thankfully they did the right thing, the smart thing and we are no way near one.

[C-Rob]

I think it's all really kind of stupid and based on the capitalistic philosophy we should just allow the banks to fail. The banks took risks, and it bit them in the butt. The problem is that they used the freedom of doing their own business to make a huge amount of loans that mostly would not ever be paid back, and it effects a lot of people.

[Marie Louise von Preussen]

politcal ideology isnt as important as having a roof over your head or a job or food in your belly. now we are not there yet, but if we carry on down the road of "freedom" and allowing the banks to go under, we will be there.

You can go to jail then. There you have food in your belly and a roof to stay 24/7.

"If you want total security, go to prison. There you're fed, clothed, given medical care and so on. The only thing lacking... is freedom. " - Eisenhower.

Sorry... It was just the perfect chance for this quote.

[Scar Face]

You can go to jail then. There you have food in your belly and a roof to stay 24/7.

"If you want total security, go to prison. There you're fed, clothed, given medical care and so on. The only thing lacking... is freedom. " - Eisenhower.

Sorry... It was just the perfect chance for this quote.

I agree. I am not going to abandon my ideals just out of fear. Yes, theres a possibility we may enter a recession, and theres a possibility this may stop it- theres a possibility it will fail as well, and I am not willing to risk my freedoms be curtailed for a mere possibility.

Edit: If the Stock Market does Crash [correct me if im wrong] doesn't that effect everyone, to some degree? Obviously you may not be one of the people losing their jobs, but the entire economy would be hit, extremely hard. No one would just shrug it off.

[LoZz]

You can go to jail then. There you have food in your belly and a roof to stay 24/7.

"If you want total security, go to prison. There you're fed, clothed, given medical care and so on. The only thing lacking... is freedom. " - Eisenhower.

Sorry... It was just the perfect chance for this quote.

ahh yes because this action by the treasury means we are all going to jail. by not following capitalism to the extreme we are all doomed to spend our lives in jail....


nice quote. means nothing to what we are actually talking about.

I agree. I am not going to abandon my ideals just out of fear. Yes, theres a possibility we may enter a recession, and theres a possibility this may stop it- theres a possibility it will fail as well, and I am not willing to risk my freedoms be curtailed for a mere possibility.

what freedoms are you risking? do you know what the word even means?! people seem to throw the word "freedom" around as a defence to change or to try and stop difficult things. capitalism isnt a perfect system. it a close as we have to perfect but it has flaws and the current situation highlights this.

to follow the road of "freedom" and allow all these banks to fall could send america back to the stone age. it would most certanly end its rule as the worlds only super power and china and possible even russia will then overtake the USA. libertarianism or capitalism or whatever you see america as doesnt have to be treated as some religious extreme. you can bend these things for the greater good. the greater good being avoid another great depression which is a serious risk if these banks where allowed to go under. it will not hurt you or take away your feedom. F&F started life out as government owned banks, now they have gone back to the government (sort of) they can go private again once the situation improves

the only fear here is the fear that america will turn into a new USSR overnight if you allow this, it wont.

[Каие]

You can go to jail then. There you have food in your belly and a roof to stay 24/7.

"If you want total security, go to prison. There you're fed, clothed, given medical care and so on. The only thing lacking... is freedom. " - Eisenhower.

Sorry... It was just the perfect chance for this quote.

Excellent quotation, but not at all relevant to this situation. In fact I would go as far as to say it's silly to put on a 'brave' face by saying you don't want the government to help in times of need, simply to adhere to some ideology and to score moral points.

I don't think the government should take away our rights, but they aren't doing that, here. They are simply making the necessary steps to be able to solve this crisis and hold the economy, and global economy steady. This doesn't affect your freedom.

[Valiant Champion]

The only people and companies that will suffer are ones who are already having problems paying their loans or are trying to get new loans.

With or without the bailout you will still have trouble getting new loans.

I will not be affected by a stock market crash whatsoever. I also think it is a grand opportunity for those businesses that played by the rules and managed their finances better to do really well in the vacuum caused by these other failing companies.

Also if they are determined to pass a bail out plan I think it should include a serious investigation to nab those responsible for this mess. I think they should follow the evidence where it leads and I bet one of those people will be Barack Osama.

[Marie Louise von Preussen]

ahh yes because this action by the treasury means we are all going to jail. by not following capitalism to the extreme we are all doomed to spend our lives in jail....


nice quote. means nothing to what we are actually talking about.

You actually understood the meaning of it. But if you have no freedom, your bread will be taken away immediately too, so don't expect political indifference to be more important in regards to its preservation than a constant vigilant attitude even if it means the fall of busineses that logically should have broken due to their misdealings. Alas, don't forget that continuous generations of your ancestors abandoned their bread and their roof to bleed in the mud to fight for freedoms such as those, and to keep conceding liberties because you care less for them than for your bread is the first step towards trashing all their life efforts.