Winning First.

**paolrus** · September 18, 2008, 02:01 AM

Sorry if this has been asked before. But how do you get the trait Winning First? I do not like the trait because it gives +1 dread. I always try to play battles, but sometimes I see this trait even if I won a Clear Victory. Thanks in advance for the answer.

**Johann von Bremen** · September 18, 2008, 03:18 AM

As far as I know, I general would get the "Winning First" or the "Fair Fighter" (+1 Chivalry) traits 50/50 if he manages to kill at least 8 enemies in combat. This condition, in turn, also has a 50/50 percent chance of being met; in one battle my greenhorn general killed at least 20 enemies and yet he didn't get any new traits

.

If you don't want your general to have the +1 Dread/Chivalry (since they seldom go hand-in-hand), you should best avoid using him for direct combat. Or, if you want, you could always cheat by using the "remove_trait" cheat.

**paolrus** · September 18, 2008, 03:28 AM

Oh man not using the general is not really fun.

I always use the General for charges and flanking and he always get battle scars which is nice because it adds a lot of hit points for the General.

Anyway thanks for the answer.

**Sorkenlol** · September 18, 2008, 05:57 AM

In my opinion, if it matters, you should only keep your governors (the ones you have in cities/castles throughout the whole game for extra income and public order and guilds) chivalrous, and your generals, the ones you take to combat, dreadful, so that you can play with your general during battles and being able to exterminate islam cities so you do not have to keep a full stack of troops in them to avoid rebelling and sacking cities for the money

**paolrus** · September 18, 2008, 07:13 AM

Nice. I also try to sack cities with high dread generals, and it gains the trait looter for bonus income. Having dread is easy but chivalry is quite hard.

**Sorkenlol** · September 18, 2008, 10:09 AM

Yeah having high-chivalry generals can be quite a pain in the ass if you have 10 chivalry and worked your ass off to get it, then you run into a huge city that gives 20k if you sack it, knowing you'll lose atleast half of the stars if you do.

**Double A** · September 18, 2008, 08:31 PM

Originally Posted by Sorkenlol

Yeah having high-chivalry generals can be quite a pain in the ass if you have 10 chivalry and worked your ass off to get it, then you run into a huge city that gives 20k if you sack it, knowing you'll lose atleast half of the stars if you do.

That's only extermination. Sacking is neutral.

**Mythre** · September 18, 2008, 10:44 PM

In my games, 90% of my generals have at least decently high chivalry... i find it hard to get dread actually.

**jimjimjim** · September 19, 2008, 08:08 AM

i found you get winning first trait if you over use archers and dont send in infantry or cavalry.

**Sorkenlol** · September 19, 2008, 09:11 AM

Originally Posted by Double A

That's only extermination. Sacking is neutral.

Really? I'm pretty sure you lose chiv if you sack a valueable city.

**Zeeky_Bomb** · September 18, 2008, 06:58 PM

You're also more likely to get dread traits if you seriously outnumber the enemy - try purposely holding back some troops from the army to even it out or even make yourself outnumbered.

**Nikos** · September 19, 2008, 08:27 AM

You also get winning first if you choose to hunt down the routing enemy after the battle is won.

**Double A** · September 19, 2008, 10:50 PM

Well, if you're Catholic and it is to, maybe.

But no, sacking is the "ransom" of cities. It doesn't add chiv or dread but it gets the most money.

**Dead Sun** · September 20, 2008, 07:45 AM

Winning first comes to your generals if they slaughter them while the enemy is running away. Im not saying "dont take prisoners" im just saying let a few run away. Normally works for me...