Where is our African Charity Money?

[Watercress]

we've all been paying for years into african charitys, to help the people and stuff like that. look at comic relief. we've been going it for ages, and what has it done? nothing. every year we get the same story, more kids are dieing. where is our money going to?

[JP226]

[MyNameIsGreat]

60% to the Christian charities
30% to local militias
10% lost in transaction

I LOL'd at JP's original response... pretty much nailed it on the head.

[roy34543]

funny you know.... kinda makes you think that bush saving 1.3 million africans from aids would figure more on peoples minds...its just people cant be bothered to think bush may have actually done something positive...or dont check anyway

[Boer]

funny you know.... kinda makes you think that bush saving 1.3 million africans from aids would figure more on peoples minds...its just people cant be bothered to think bush may have actually done something positive...or dont check anyway

I’m not a real big fan of Bush, but I think that this is once area where he has done a lot of good. His program seems to really be making an impact. There are concerns about corruption, but it sounds like things are mostly running well, at least in some countries. http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/africa/july-dec07/aids_11-06.html is a good report about the topic, and you can watch or reed it. One of the biggest improvement thanks to us aid is that without treatment a baby born to a HIV/AIDS positive mother gets infected 45% of the time. With US provided treatment it’s only around 1%.

[Oglethorpe1983]

Angry Rant in 5, 4, 3, 2, 1.....

Okay people...now this is something that I have been arguing for years.... Why are we as a nation giving billions of dollars in food, and supplies to the poor nations of Africa? If you can put aside the emotional factors where they put the starving chrildren on TV like olive twist "please sir may I have some more"... and look at this rationally, this is a bad idea....

Now dont get me wrong... I dont get my jollies thinking about 300 million peole straving to death.... I think it is absolutely horrible.... but lets face it thats what may need to happen... I am a believer in Malthusian Economics...that nature has a way of dealing with uneven ratios between population and the ability for it to support itself...

Now lets look at this... every year we as a nation give billions of follars in food to African nations, all this food does is keep them on the verge of starvation...giving them just enough energy to have more kids.... meaning next year we have to give even MORE food just to keep them in that same semi-starved state. Now Im not completely heartless... I do have a solution help/force them to cultivate thier own land to whatever extent is necessary to feed there own people... no matter what the acreage is needed there... make them do it.... give them plows and water pumps and irragation equipment.... force these people to feed themselves.... (and if there is an area that simply cant be farmed you tell those people to get the F out and move somewhere else... if they are living in an unsustainable place...and surviving soley on the goodwill of Western nations...that is a problem... I would be all for spending billions of dollars if I knew it was a productive use of the money.... but at the current use its not.... If 300 million people need to die for these nations to be slf sufficent so be it.

On the AIDS issue... Do you people realize there is a cure for aids.... Oh yes there is.... and it costs absoletely nothing.... its called stop F...ing...

I cant image that there is a wide spread heroin epidiemic in africa...so shared needle use is probably limited.... so only other main source is having sex. If you make it so that anyone with aids cant have kids...the AIDS gnerations will die off... and that means no more AIDS... no 50 billion dollar cure needed.... in 50 years AIDS will still be around for sure...but in a fraction of the numbers it is now....

If the population of even a few African nations were to be smaller and healthier it is very feasible that they could not only become self sufficient agriculturally.... but they might even achive surplusses...which could be sold on the market....allowing these nations to become wealthier... AND since there is less of a strain on local resources it is reasonable to assume there would be less warfare over said resources.... Just a few benefits of actually forcing a nation to be self relient....

Okay...Rant Over....

[Viking Prince]

Angry Rant in 5, 4, 3, 2, 1.....

<snip>

I do have a solution help/force them to cultivate thier own land to whatever extent is necessary to feed there own people... no matter what the acreage is needed there... make them do it.... give them plows and water pumps and irragation equipment.... force these people to feed themselves.... (and if there is an area that simply cant be farmed you tell those people to get the F out and move somewhere else... if they are living in an unsustainable place...and surviving soley on the goodwill of Western nations...that is a problem... I would be all for spending billions of dollars if I knew it was a productive use of the money.... but at the current use its not.... If 300 million people need to die for these nations to be slf sufficent so be it.

<snip>
Okay...Rant Over....

Great post -- but a few points to consider. To participate in the 21st century -- subsistence farming will not work. Look to the painful transitions to modern agriculture that took place in Mexico due to NAFTA.

The major problem is thug politicians and their terror squads and funded redel groups that simply destroy capital investment, education opportunities, and the rule of law. You cannot run a business based on favoritism with the local thug. Thugs change.

Not all Africa is a basket case. North Africa is doing quite well, but more progress is always desirable. South Africa has seen a bit of economic improvement also. Equitorial Africa is simply a basket case that money alone will never fix. Get rid of the thugs.

My rant is now over also. Thanks for your post/rant.

[Boer]

Angry Rant in 5, 4, 3, 2, 1.....

(and if there is an area that simply cant be farmed you tell those people to get the F out and move somewhere else... if they are living in an unsustainable place...and surviving soley on the goodwill of Western nations...that is a problem...

Okay...Rant Over....

There are many people who don’t want to live where they are in Africa, but the neighboring countries don’t want to allow these poor, landless, starving people in because it would cause unrest in their own country. People of the more stable countries don’t want a new influx of immigrants who will work for less money and drive wages down. It was not that long ago that South Africa had riots targeting people who fled there from Zimbabwe. (http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/africa/05/20/southafrica.violence/) Cultivating more land would be an important step, but of course most of Africa need foreign (read Western) aid in order to achieve that goal as well.

[Viking Prince]

There are many people who don’t want to live where they are in Africa, but the neighboring countries don’t want to allow these poor, landless, starving people in because it would cause unrest in their own country. People of the more stable countries don’t want a new influx of immigrants who will work for less money and drive wages down. It was not that long ago that South Africa had riots targeting people who fled there from Zimbabwe. (http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/africa...rica.violence/) Cultivating more land would be an important step, but of course most of Africa need foreign (read Western) aid in order to achieve that goal as well.

Good point on immigration.

Problem still remains regarding employment though. Subsistance farming does not work. Modern capital intensive farming only needs about 4 % of the population. Any capital enterprise needs rule of law to function.

Again, first step is to get rid of the thugs.

[Viking Prince]

Aid for anyone not capable of supporting themselves is very short-term assistance. Give them skills and opportunities. Protect them from thug governments. Then maybe you will see a payoff.

[Mythos]

Throwing money into a sea of corruptness. Where exactly do you think they are going?

[HannibalExMachina]

at least the weapon industry flourishes, or what do you think dictators spend most money on? western governments are quick to speak of corruption. corruption IS a big problem, but far more goes into weapon purchase - which we gladly encourage.

[Pallantides]

I miss Rhodesia, now that seemed like a nice country!

[Lord Consul]

Stop giving those corrupt states cash donations and start investing in education. That's all.

[VALIS]

Stop giving those corrupt states cash donations and start investing in education. That's all.

And how are African nations with no money supposed to invest in education? With our money, thats how.

We have given multiple nations money to invest in education and it has all beeen virtually squandered on wars and private palaces for the despotic regimes of those countries.

[Admiral Piett]

Viking Prince, how would you suggest "getting rid of the thugs"?

[Viking Prince]

Viking Prince, how would you suggest "getting rid of the thugs"?

First and most important -- It is the responsibility of each country's good citizens to police their own house. But other nations can help -- do not fund IMF and World Bank loans, do not forgive debt, do not sell weapons, do not allow the thugs to enter your country or place "personal" investments through the banks. You get the general idea. The key is no international support that will fall into thug pockets or support thug oppression.

BIggest hurddle is cooperation from China. They are hyper about intervention since they could always be the next country on any list.

I am not advocating outside military intervention unless the government collapses into civil disorder. This always gets more complicated than it is worth.

[Holger Danske]

Recolonize... With the objective of educating them rather than ripping their lands of resources and brag before your other European nations for having more, better, bigger colonies than them.

[Viking Prince]

Recolonize... With the objective of educating them rather than ripping their lands of resources and brag before your other European nations for having more, better, bigger colonies than them.

And how will this come about? Who will be first? Russia?

[Holger Danske]

They are not even worth it... Just remove their damn nukes (one way or the other) and let them be.