Archers for offense?

[Leutnant]

I know a lot of players here like to play defensively and thus, their use of archers makes sense; but, what about players who like to go on the offense? I personally have only one offensive strategy that involves archers... and I hardly ever use it.

Personally, I think that archers/crossbows serve no purpose for players who like to blitz. The only context in which having missile troops would be a good thing would be if you used HAs.

What's your opinion on this?

P.S. share strats please

[mikil100]

Well if you don't mind the wait peppering the out of them with archers always weakens lines- especially if you hit that area hard when you charge, makes it rout quicker and more likely to get a quick win... and of flaming arrows when you smash into the enemy line with you main force is pwnagee

[Viking Prince]

Early in the game even peasant archers are effective on offense. The tide quickly turns after maybe 30 or 40 turns. The factions with good later achers and any mounted archers will always find a use.

The mounted archers are expecially useful against rebels since they have good movement and lower upkeep than the non-archer cavalry.

The main problem with the campaign game is the dependance on siege assaults throughout the game. On defense the archers can be effective, but offense they leave a bit to be desired. I usually only use them on seiges when I am willing to wait for the enemy to sally out. The roll is then really defensive.

[platinumkiller]

well archers are good if the enemy dosent move just shoot at them until your out of amo then use them more like suciders aka walk tordes the enemy once they start to chase u come from the side with calvary and do major damage

[platinumkiller]

o can i also get some rep and also can someone tell me how to start my own thread?

[NobleNick]

o can i also get some rep and ...?

+rep is for people to show that they find other people's advice/posts helpful. Be kind, courteous and helpful, and the rep will come.

BTW - Welcome to the forums!

[jsktrogdor]

IZ U B CRAZY??!!?! :hmmm: Archers are fantastic, ~especialy~ when playing as offense. When your on defense the enemy army will move strait for you, on offense you decide when the infantry will clash. It just depends on having good archers. I always keep them in front of my infantry so I dont have to worry about them being forced to fire in an arc. Let me give you a short scernario:

Genoa V HRE:

4 units of simple genoese crossbow milita line my front, a unit of HRE heavy infantry is making my knees knock together due to my, at that point, out of date italian spear militia. As soon as they're in range I make sure that two of crossbow units are focusing fire on the heavy infantry unit. When they marched out of austria they had 120 men, when they walked on that snowy plain in western hungry they had....120 men. By the time they had ran the 200 feet from their front line to the line of whimpering Italian Spear militia...there were about 30 of them. Dont even get me started on longbowmen, I experimented with english armies with 6 units of longbowmen

Some people said use them as suicide troops...nah, protect them almost as much as you protect your calvary. Leave an extra infantry unit on the ends (spearmen, or anti horse infantry) at a slight angle outwards behind your mainline. Depending on your difficutly the AI looooves to swoop around with calvary and knock out some archers, if that doesnt happen the extra flank units can sprint around and attack enemy rear flank. Archers are bomb.

[Hounddog]

I always pack a few ranged units in offensive armies, they do have some use.

Siege:
If you break the walls/towers, place a ranged unit just outside the breach, this may cause the defenders to either move a bit away from the breach, or better yet, come out through it.

If you take the walls rather than break them, place ranged units on the walls while you fight in the streets.

If the defenders are holed up in the center with few/no missile and cavalry, you can pepper the center a bit with arrows before going for the all out melee assault.

Land battles:
Mostly used as a kind of skirmisher unit, to try and goad the AI to break up lines, their use like this is often very limited, and they only get to really rank up some kills if the enemy is really lacking in ranged troops. HAs are almost always much better and safer in land battles.

ALWAYS keep them safe, ranged units can get really high experience if you keep using them and minimize their casualties, in the above use they should take no/minimal losses, NEVER let them be exposed to cavalry, one charge and most ranged footsoldiers are gone. And I seldom let them slug it out with other ranged units, as those ranged units are taken out much more efficiently with a charge. And never ever try a ranged match with ranged units if the enemy is on walls.

[Xamt]

i assume u mean offensively and defensively when conducting a battle and not in general on the campaign map...

for me archers have 3 roles:
1) supporting my infantry and softening up the enemy - this is easily used either in offense or in defense.. just put them in front of your infantry (when defending) or behind your advancing infantry (when attacking) and have them soften up the enemy before infantry clashes
2) countering enemy archers (especially horse archers) - i usually use 1-2 units of peasant archers (who draw all missile fire on them by advancing more than my more elite archers) and the rest better equipped/trained archers (number of units depend on enemy army usual composition)... i usually try to have at least the same number of missile units as my enemy
3) drawing out enemy cavalry in feigned advances - there are a lot of times that enemy cavalry can be drawn out in the open by seemingly weak archer units... just march your archers out in the open and wait for the enemy to start comming to u... at the right moment (requires some practice) move your decoy back and destroy as much of the enemy as possible

Note: i always focus fire my archers against one enemy unit (be it horse archers, generals bodyguard, enemy archers etc) and i very rarely use flaming arrows (only when the enemy is cluttered in a big mass or in bridge battles)

[TheTrueGreek]

i assume u mean offensively and defensively when conducting a battle and not in general on the campaign map...

for me archers have 3 roles:
1) supporting my infantry and softening up the enemy - this is easily used either in offense or in defense.. just put them in front of your infantry (when defending) or behind your advancing infantry (when attacking) and have them soften up the enemy before infantry clashes
2) countering enemy archers (especially horse archers) - i usually use 1-2 units of peasant archers (who draw all missile fire on them by advancing more than my more elite archers) and the rest better equipped/trained archers (number of units depend on enemy army usual composition)... i usually try to have at least the same number of missile units as my enemy
3) drawing out enemy cavalry in feigned advances - there are a lot of times that enemy cavalry can be drawn out in the open by seemingly weak archer units... just march your archers out in the open and wait for the enemy to start comming to u... at the right moment (requires some practice) move your decoy back and destroy as much of the enemy as possible

Note: i always focus fire my archers against one enemy unit (be it horse archers, generals bodyguard, enemy archers etc) and i very rarely use flaming arrows (only when the enemy is cluttered in a big mass or in bridge battles)

i always do the same thing as 2, but i have the extra archers on fire mode, the rest on normal

[clandestino]

Oh now, attack without range units is like sex without forplay, I allways put at least 6 ranged units in my armies, at the beginning of the battle I put them in line so they can pepper enemy lines before I charge them with heavy infantry and cavalry. The thing with ranged units is that they have to be closely supported by other troops that means that you have to put your heavy infantry just a couple of feets behind them so the archers can run and hide behind them if enemy suddenly charges you. With heavy infantry right behind them and cavalry support on flanks ranged units can kill some 30-40% enemies before they run out of ammo. And when they run out of ammo heavy infantry and cavalry step in to finish the job.

[Wheelchair]

:O Archers are my WMD of the medieval era.

as english I compose my armies of atleast 10 longbowmen, the rest are Heavy Cav and Heavy Inf, most likely English Knights.

Hell I kill 50-75% of the enemy army before they get to me. O.o

[Hounddog]

:O Archers are my WMD of the medieval era.

aye, but that has got to be those with long bows the others are no way near their effectiveness.

Longbows (all types) are a top notch in any battle, long range, early availability, shield, armor piercing, decent melee and stakes together offers a huge boost in archer performance.

[HighLord z0b]

Another good use of archers in offense is for sieges, at first I didn't use archers but now I found that they are invaluable, especially when up against the enemy's general bodyguard.

This is how I use them; once you have breached the walls/rammed down the gate and sent in your infantry, send in archers to stand behind the infantry then slowly move the infantry supported by the archers up the streets. Either the enemy will charge your infantry and the archers will be able to get some good hits in before they reach you, or the enemy will just stand in the town square and you can pepper them with missiles until they route or decide to charge.

Can also work with crossbows but not half as effectively unless you can get them up onto walls to shoot down, which I find happens more in castle battles but is devastating especially against that pesky general's unit.

Basically, if the enemy retreats behind the inner walls in a castle battle, get your archers/crossbows up onto those walls if you can. In that situation ladders are very useful, you may need to send up some infantry first to clear the walls but in this situation the enemy are often just standing guard in town square. I'll put a unit of infantry just in front of the walls to block the door leading up to the walls but let the missile units do most of the job.

Either method will often make the AI stand around getting shot until about half the unit is gone and then they will charge into your waiting infantry.

[Xamt]

aye, but that has got to be those with long bows the others are no way near their effectiveness.

Longbows (all types) are a top notch in any battle, long range, early availability, shield, armor piercing, decent melee and stakes together offers a huge boost in archer performance.

archers are effective at any level (even peasants) if you shoot at the enemy from the right angle... shooting a generals bodyguard from the front will get you few if any kills.... try shooting them from the side where they are holding their weapon or even better from behind.. you will be surprised by the results

[tyboman]

I only ever use archers as troops to defend castles, never in a mobolized army, it wrecks my style of charge and destroy.

[Barry]

Welcome to the forums tyboman. Please refrain from gravedigging (bringing up old threads) in the future though

[Kallum]

Archers are in my opinion the greatest units in the game. They decide sieges and I recall that I have beaten a early spanish army with a full stack of peasant archers(note they had padded armour and I was on a hill so a truly fair battle it never was but to quote a true saying: I never want my soldiers to fight a honest battle)

[Viking Prince]

@tyboman

This is only from August -- go for it! I have bumped older in the battle planning rather than start a new thread without a note (yet) from a moderator.

I also will use the peasant/militia archers in the beginning when seiging a settlement. They are great for pushing the ram to the gate and distracting attention from the ram and towers which could be flamed.

If I wait for the enemy to sally out -- they are great for weakening moral as they rush the spears tha t you start the campaign with.

[Landtuber]

Always have a couple units of archers in every offensive army, but for a different reason. The ability to put them on skirmish can play havoc with an enemies charges if you use it correctly. The AI will often send cavalry to charge your archers in front, with quick reactions and your archers on skirmish, I find its one of the best way to quickly eliminate the enemies cavalry. Best use, spread your archers out a bit, and when one group is charged, turn other group off skirmish, and fire your flame arrows into their flanks as your infantry/cavalry move up to face the charge. I have eliminated many an armies heavly cavalry this way early on in the battle. I have also lost many an archer to my slow reactions or not paying attention though, lol.

Note that it also really screws up infantry charges. If you have your archers in front of your front line, leave them off skirmish. Then, as the enemy gets just close enough to charge, flick it on, and they'll run behind your lines. If the timing is right, the enemy charge will falter and die just 10-20 yards from your lines, and you can charge into their scattered formation. Works wonders. If you haven't tried this, give it a shot. Requires a lot of attention, but makes a huge difference.