English armies

[mikil100]

Hi, I'm new as you can see- been playing RTW for a few yrs just got M2TW, and have a quick question about the English, it says that they field a weak calvary- which I s'pose is true.

But, I have just started playing- and I'm noticing- it seems the ONLY anti-calvary/defensive melee units is their cheap spear militia- and I'm not too sure I want to be using them to hold my lines against heavy calvary exc.... My DFK's and Armoured Swordsmen just get ripped to shreds by any calvary.

So my question is, do the English have any GOOD anti-calvary/defensive infantry- as in something heavy, that can absorb a charge and not lose over half their unit strength. Longbowmen stakes and militia spears don't seem too promising lol.

Sorry for the noobiness- I plan on visiting here more, great discussions it seems.

[TheTrueGreek]

well, you could just use your own cavalry, make a atake box so the cavalry is useless, or hire crossbowmen to fire at the cav. i dont think they have much for anti cavalry

[Musthavename]

I find billmen & stakes combined can kill cavalry pretty easily. Cavalry will either simply die to the stakes, or, if they freeze, have your billmen charge. Even if the billmen eventually die, they're relatively cheap. Dismounted English Knights later on use Poleaxes, which may give a bonus against cavalry, but i'm not sure.

[Walternat0r]

Exactly as Musthave said, in the early period your armies will pretty much be spear militia anyways so thats ok, once you start churning out longbows though, you're sorted. Always aim to have 4+ in a full stack, and 3 in a stack less than this. you can make an effective stake barrior with them and hose down the cavalry as it moves around it or just hangs around infront of them. Your infantry should be able to beat most other factions inf so using the bowmen to take out cav is your best bet. Once they are at 50% size ish (doesn't take long usually) you can engage quite happily.

Edit: I've played custom battles where I took solely longbows, yeomans, retinues and sherwood archers (with a generals bodyguard) against a french army purely made of heavy cav; gendarmes feudals, chivalrics, lancers and what have you. I didn't deploy stakes either and I won (admittedly I had like 50 blokes left) so it goes to show that a lot of longbows can basically win you battles you'd think you'd lose. In english armies I try to have at least 7 units of longbowmen, a bunch of heavy inf and for cavalry usually just my general. Against the AI you pretty much can't lose unless the odds are stacked horribly against you.

[Double A]

In custom you can make a ring of stakes with your longbows and then all the AI's full stack of calvary will get pulverized by your stakes and hammers for the ones that live.

[Sorkenlol]

Well, english cavalry isn't that weak, I find the feudal knights pretty effective, they die too fast tho. Billmen can be used for cavalry, but spears are better.

[Wheelchair]

I find English knights to be very good, 7 charge? thats pretty good >_>

[Surgeon]

The part about English having weak cavalry is kind of misleading. Hobilars own everything. If that's not enough, English Knights take down Lancers like no tomorrow because they have uber AP axes for close combat (Lancer vs EK charges seem to inflict roughly the same casualties on both sides). Later on you have Demi Lancers.

As for anti-cav infantry, I'm leaning towards Billmen and Dismounted English Knights. Unfortunately they don't have any bonuses that spearmen do and so can lose a lot of men to a charge, however if they manage to engage cavalry (with the help of stakes and/or forest cover) they can hack down a unit of Generals Bodyguard before you can click the End Battle button.

If all else fails, you can always hire merc spearmen.

[SPARTAN VI]

In the early game, Hobilars were good for disrupting enemy cavalry maneuvers. Just snag them into a melee and bring up spearmen/billmen for support.

Same thing in the absence of cavalry, except I'd use cheapo/lower xp infantry to drag the cavalry into a melee and bring up spearmen for the kill.

[Double A]

Which are like from Arguin to Russia...

[Theseus1234]

billmen are good ONLY when the cavalry aren't charging, i.e. marching or standing or already engaged, so use cheap units like peasants to capture the horses, then reinforce them with billmen

[mikil100]

Hmmm well in that case I will just use my cheap spearmen to absorb the charge and send my billmen to finish up...

Plus Stakes infront of my longbowmen. woot. "God save the queen"

[zligor]

:hmmm:well,if you install custom campaign mod you can recruit armoured sergeants-valuable addition to any army.It changes very few things compared to vanilla but it adds great new units.If you decide to play vanilla, mercenary spearmen will be your best anticavalry unit.They`re expensive but they`re worth every coin.And can be recruited anywhere.

[Celsius]

Just get about 8 pike militia. 4 in front and 4 behind those. behind the last 4, get swordsmen aor spearmen. then cavalry in the back. Make sure to guard your flanks also.

[Shadow8]

Hi, I'm new as you can see- been playing RTW for a few yrs just got M2TW, and have a quick question about the English, it says that they field a weak calvary- which I s'pose is true.

But, I have just started playing- and I'm noticing- it seems the ONLY anti-calvary/defensive melee units is their cheap spear militia- and I'm not too sure I want to be using them to hold my lines against heavy calvary exc.... My DFK's and Armoured Swordsmen just get ripped to shreds by any calvary.

So my question is, do the English have any GOOD anti-calvary/defensive infantry- as in something heavy, that can absorb a charge and not lose over half their unit strength. Longbowmen stakes and militia spears don't seem too promising lol.

Sorry for the noobiness- I plan on visiting here more, great discussions it seems.

dont worry about noobiness, everyone is a noob sometime, "NOOB" jk

anyway, stakes work WELL, get them to charge straight at them, and cover the flanks with spearmen, upgrade your spearmen, or even get scottish pike mercs.

[Long John Silver]

My english armies are made up of longbowmen, sherwood archers, armored swordsmen, demi-lancers and hobilars.

I don't need a spear wielding unit because of the stakes and letting the sherwood archers concentrate their fire on the nastiest enemy units, like heavy cavalry.

Rarely they come close enough to charge. And if they do, in 90% they will charge right thru the stakes.

[Old Geezer]

Forget billmen. Use armored sarges. When I fight against the English, I chuckle will evil glee everytime I see a huge billman army because it means whatever unit I wish to get promoted will have an easy time (except peasants - I haven't recruited a peasant in over 6 months). I guess billmen would do okay against peasant archers if you can get them into melee.

[Celsius]

What are billmen used for.
They cost too much and suck.

[Surgeon]

Billmen vs infantry = shock infantry
Billmen vs cavalry = better than spearmen if they don't get charged

[Panthera leo]

Yup, billmen can really mince heavy infantry and heavy cavalry if used correctly. Like halbeardiers, the secret is not to use them to actuallt hold the line against cavalry (unless you have a stake wall in front) but rather to countercharge stationary cavalry and open them like tin cans. They do fairly well against most light-to-medium infantry as well.