Phalanx Question

**SphincterH0ld** · August 17, 2008, 09:41 PM

Hey, just coming back to RTR and RTW in general after about a year or so break and just can't seem to figure out what the deal is with phalanxes. Was the phalanx button removed / replaced? Although there is no button, sometimes my units seem to automatically enter a phalanx state, what triggers this? I am playing as the greek cities (im a huge fan of the phalanx

) and im not sure if the cheaper hoplites seem to be forming a phalanx.

Im sorry if this question is anwered in a FAQ somewhere but I did some quick searching around and couldn't seem to find anything. Last time I remember playing RTR I was able to hold a city entrance with a single cheap unit of phalanx because it was so deadly, im assuming it was nerfed somehow.

Thanks for the answers!

**Jamey** · August 17, 2008, 09:58 PM

Hoplites form up in a very dense deployment that is very similar to the phalanx formation (which still remains for phalangites).

I believe that this was done to reduce exposure to the bugs present in the phalanx formation (particularly the soldiers wandering out of it for no apparent reason). My understanding is that Phalangites still use phalanx mode because the long pike doesn't work without it.

**SphincterH0ld** · August 18, 2008, 01:12 AM

Ah ok, makes sense, thanks a million for the response!

**SphincterH0ld** · August 18, 2008, 03:44 AM

I find that units that have retained the actual phalanx formation ability keep the enemy at a much further distances from themselves and are a lot more effective when creating a choke point. The phalanx like formation that exists with the Greek hoplites seems to be pushed through much easier.

My example being a city gate. I positioned a hoplite unit that didn't have the ability infront of a gate, and due to the large amount of enemies trying to funnel in, they pushed through quite easily through the unit. While in a similar situation with a squad of phalangites which have the formation, they kept there formation far better when actually met by a large enemy.

After doing some digging I think if change the standard greek hoplite's attribute from short_spear to what im guessing would be long spear, I can get back the actual phalanx formation. im willing to put up with the glitch of random wandering dudes.

Would anyone happen to know what file / what I would have to edit to give the standard greek hoplites along with other hoplites the phalanx ability? Much appreciated!

**Jamey** · August 18, 2008, 01:19 PM

Originally Posted by SphincterH0ld

I find that units that have retained the actual phalanx formation ability keep the enemy at a much further distances from themselves and are a lot more effective when creating a choke point. The phalanx like formation that exists with the Greek hoplites seems to be pushed through much easier.

My example being a city gate. I positioned a hoplite unit that didn't have the ability infront of a gate, and due to the large amount of enemies trying to funnel in, they pushed through quite easily through the unit. While in a similar situation with a squad of phalangites which have the formation, they kept there formation far better when actually met by a large enemy.

I find that both hoplites and phalangites will do fine holding a line in most circumstances if you form them up deep enough. A minimum of 6 ranks is needed, but for town defense I often try for 10+ ranks deep at key defense points. As you've noticed, you'll get a lot of troops massed against you.

**Marcus Camillus** · August 19, 2008, 09:46 PM

Originally Posted by SphincterH0ld

I find that units that have retained the actual phalanx formation ability keep the enemy at a much further distances from themselves and are a lot more effective when creating a choke point. The phalanx like formation that exists with the Greek hoplites seems to be pushed through much easier.

My example being a city gate. I positioned a hoplite unit that didn't have the ability infront of a gate, and due to the large amount of enemies trying to funnel in, they pushed through quite easily through the unit. While in a similar situation with a squad of phalangites which have the formation, they kept there formation far better when actually met by a large enemy.

After doing some digging I think if change the standard greek hoplite's attribute from short_spear to what im guessing would be long spear, I can get back the actual phalanx formation. im willing to put up with the glitch of random wandering dudes.

Would anyone happen to know what file / what I would have to edit to give the standard greek hoplites along with other hoplites the phalanx ability? Much appreciated!

The file you're looking to edit is the EDU, i.e. export_descr_unit.txt (or is it export_descr_units.txt, I don't have the game's file handy at the moment?)

I forget the exact text for "long spears", but just compare the entry of a hoplite unit to a phalanx style unit and you should be able to figure out what needs changing.

Oh, and if anyone else remembers any other things that might need changing, such as changing DMB models for the hoplite units, please mention them. Thanks.

**sumaznguy** · August 18, 2008, 09:14 AM

My phalangites are getting pushed back by hoardes of enemy in the townsquare unfortunately. Never had this problem at the gates though.

But basically the enemy had a huge stack of infantry. They just ran right through all my phalanx units which caused them to take out their swords making their phalanx formation advantage voided.

**SphincterH0ld** · August 20, 2008, 12:00 AM

I actually figured it out after doing some digging the directory and found the file you described. You just need to add the phalanx formation after the square one and it works perfectly in terms of allowing you to use the formation. Im going to do some more experimenting in which works better for me.

So far its boiled down to this for me. Sometimes the phalanx formation works perfectly and its great, but then sometimes the bug kicks in and sucks ass. While the phalanx "like" formation is consistently mediocre.

**Marcus Camillus** · August 23, 2008, 12:45 AM

Cool, glad you worked out how to get what you desired. If you like, go ahead and post here, or send me a PM, what you decide to use. I would be interested in maybe trying it out myself.

**mcantu** · August 25, 2008, 10:09 AM

Originally Posted by SphincterH0ld

I actually figured it out after doing some digging the directory and found the file you described. You just need to add the phalanx formation after the square one and it works perfectly in terms of allowing you to use the formation. Im going to do some more experimenting in which works better for me.

So far its boiled down to this for me. Sometimes the phalanx formation works perfectly and its great, but then sometimes the bug kicks in and sucks ass. While the phalanx "like" formation is consistently mediocre.

so what you're doing is turning the hoplites into phalangites?

**DaveOz** · August 25, 2008, 09:57 AM

What i miss with the old system is being able to tell my units to get out of the phalanx formation and fight with there swords. That came in handy if they were being flanked or i there figthing on a wall, now they just hold there spears semi up and 'nudge' them or something

**TITANAS84** · April 18, 2009, 05:44 AM

hoplites phalanx is like shield wall with upper spears,macedonian phalanx is solid formation with two handed long spear(historical).vanilla rtw hoplite is complete unreal but rtr is too unreal.

**silverster** · May 21, 2009, 03:21 AM

EB manages to do the overhead hoplite formation (like this the one to the right)

in EB

However... I think the overhead is only used for the initial charge (can someone correct me on this?)

besides, i'm pretty sure a trained swordsman unit can chew through overhead formation reasonably easily.
The in-game Phalanx function should only be used in conjunction with the Macedon Phalanx's (as 'invented' by Philip II), I dont see how Macedon phalanx would work with any shorter spears..