What if...Barbarossa hadn't drowned?

**KaerMorhen** · August 18, 2008, 05:09 AM

Originally Posted by duda

If he hadn't drowned? Well, honestly, I think he would've been alive..................

I've never guessed

**man** · August 18, 2008, 05:19 AM

thing is, he did drown either died of suffocation or anaphlactic shock and died so he didnt do any thing
anyway i think he would have died abt 2 months after reaching the holy land because of the heat-not good for an old man

**Arto** · August 18, 2008, 08:53 AM

Come on he was 68 years old, well I could think that he died of an heart attack during the Siege of Jerusalem. By that his force could have a deceived defeat.

**Cyrus the Virus** · August 18, 2008, 11:02 AM

A little off topic but Barbarossa's campaign in AoE II was my favourite..

**Aru** · August 18, 2008, 11:23 AM

It would be significant enough if he only managed to bring his army to Holy Land. Then, even if he died, many if not most of his troops would have stayed in the Crusade, commanded by others. Sheer numbers he brought would be quite a help to the European effort and things would, no doubt, end up differently.

**Nik** · August 18, 2008, 04:30 PM

A question for the more medieval savy people:
Barbarossa was not only crowned king of the holy roman empire of german nation, but also crowned emperor by the pope, would that give him a higher standing in leadership struggles than Louis and Richard?

**gaius valerius** · August 18, 2008, 06:58 PM

Originally Posted by Nik

A question for the more medieval savy people:
Barbarossa was not only crowned king of the holy roman empire of german nation, but also crowned emperor by the pope, would that give him a higher standing in leadership struggles than Louis and Richard?

Theoretically (with or without a crusade) he could make such claims, the term emperor always had that touch. But let's not be distracted from reality by mere play of words. Barbarossa could claim all he want, wouldn't change a thing though. So in reality it wouldn't matter anything. In those days when you wanted power, you had to seize it, a mere play of words would've gotten you nowhere.

Wholly in agreement and I would've said exactly the same thing. So I can keep this short.

The only sensible answer to a "what if" question is "we just don't know"/"to hard to tell". The only use it can have is to put that which happened into perspective, of course, it is mindfull not to exaggerate (like 'the Roman empire would still be around'-stuff). So looking at the episode with Fritz, one thing is for sure: had he lived, things would have no doubt been different, on the short run most likely. A 1291 wasn't something that could've been avoided. Frederick's host was the largest and don't forget that his succesful march through Anatolia was somewhat of a unicum, apart from the First Crusade it was a stunt that others had consequently failed in. Saladin would've gotten a most fearsome opponent, strong minded, a skilled politician, on the other hand, kinda an old man, a really old man. Could Jerusalem have been recaptured? Hansa made all the points there were to be made alrdy so nothing to add to that. The only sensible conclusion to this what if is that had old Fritz not passed away, the 3rd Crusade would have been a greater succes for the Latins. Would it have changed the course of history? Very unlikely.