Units that you dont use.

[Dengero]

So ok I'm playing as romans. I own half the map (Iberia, Cathage Africa, Greece, Italy, Britain, Germania) and going for the other half (Asia minor, Eygpt etc etc).

Right now, every battle is almost full stack legionares vs full stack legionares against the egyptians. The chances of me using AOR units are nearly nil because

1. I can't retrain them
2. Some of them are so expensive.

A really good example are the african elephants. Back 100 years ago when I just conquered Cathage, I shipped a set of 5 elephants to conquer greece. I stamped out the macedonians, but they all died in the process. I never bothered to import new ones from africa because they are so expensive to maintain!!!

Right now it takes me 5 turns to ship them to the front lines and chances are, they're gonna get sunk halfway anyway.

So am I just doing this wrong? Or is it a natural thing that AOR units gets disused later in the game?

A little side question is, why are the navy so weak?????????? I seriously have barely won any naval battles, it is SO rigged. 20 full stack quinquiremes against 2 rebel longboats and I lose like 12 boats? wtf?

[fourganger]

If you use elephants right then they are a worthwhile investment. My faction leader recruited them in Greece (they appear there every now and then), and then they stayed part of my armed forces till I reached Armenia. They are my only unit to have full gold chevrons, and they have saved my men on countless occasions.

Mainly, I use AOR units for garrison. Playing as Romans, AOR troops also provided me with my spearmen. I used them till they were down around half numbers then merge them and garrison them.

If you play as Carthage, then you pretty much have to use AOR.

AOR units can also be useful for storming a settlement. Send them in first and spare your own troops the attention of the defences.

Also as Romans, you are pretty limited when it comes to cavalry. AOR troops can provide very good heavy cavalry and light cavalry.

[SuleymanGroznii]

Also as Romans, you are pretty limited when it comes to cavalry. AOR troops can provide very good heavy cavalry and light cavalry.

Understatement of the decade...I'd always wondered why both Equites and Italian Cavalry always routed so easily (even when DOUBLE TEAMING another cavalry unit!), and while messing around with my edu file, I figured it out. Or should I say, it smacked me in the face. Funny thing is, even after I adjusted their stats, they STILL SUCK!

[Jamey]

Understatement of the decade...I'd always wondered why both Equites and Italian Cavalry always routed so easily (even when DOUBLE TEAMING another cavalry unit!), and while messing around with my edu file, I figured it out. Or should I say, it smacked me in the face. Funny thing is, even after I adjusted their stats, they STILL SUCK!

Equites are light cavalry. That makes them faster but dramatically less effective when charging. That combined with their low attack value makes them iffy at best for serious combat. The Italians are just generally low attack and defense for heavy cavalry.

In short, neither of these units are a general purpose heavy cavalry. Try recruiting Gallic Nobles instead. The mercs with 2 experience are normally the best cavalry that Rome gets access to early on.

[fourganger]

In short, neither of these units are a general purpose heavy cavalry. Try recruiting Gallic Nobles instead. The mercs with 2 experience are normally the best cavalry that Rome gets access to early on.

Later on in the game, you can also recruit them in Boronia and Mediolanium (and probably the other Northern Italy cities), which is only a single journey to Rome (for cavalry at least).

You can also recruit Numidian skirmish cavalry in Sicily. I always attach a unit or two of these fellas to any legion. Great for disrupting advancing formations, great for drawing away enemy heavy cavalry, great for chasing down fleeing troops. If you use them right then you also don't need to replenish them as they shouldn't be taking casualties. I had a couple of gold chevron Numidian units in my armies by the time I took on the Seleucid heartlands. And these guys also make great phalanx killers...

[Jamey]

Later on in the game, you can also recruit them in Boronia and Mediolanium (and probably the other Northern Italy cities), which is only a single journey to Rome (for cavalry at least).

You can recruit AOR Gauls of all types both as mercenaries and via recruitment in any territory in Cisalpine Gaul (Bononia on north). I like to conquer Bononia early as Rome and build it up as a recruitment center. It doesn't do a lot of naval trade (at least in ExRM - it may be a better trade center in RTRPE).

Gallic slingers are also a very solid addition to most armies if you recruit them as mercs. The two experience make them much more effective than anything you'd recruit in a settlement for a while. Rome has to go pretty far afield to get Balearics, Cretans, Rhodians, Sarmatians, or Cyrtians if you want better missile troops. Then again, I've been known to make naval expeditions to Crete and Rhodes just to recruit the 3 experience missile troops.

You can also recruit Numidian skirmish cavalry in Sicily. I always attach a unit or two of these fellas to any legion. Great for disrupting advancing formations, great for drawing away enemy heavy cavalry, great for chasing down fleeing troops. If you use them right then you also don't need to replenish them as they shouldn't be taking casualties. I had a couple of gold chevron Numidian units in my armies by the time I took on the Seleucid heartlands. And these guys also make great phalanx killers...

I love the Numidian cavalry. It is most decidedly not heavy cavalry, however.

It's also a much longer series of conquests to take a settlement that produces Numidians.

[AqD]

Understatement of the decade...I'd always wondered why both Equites and Italian Cavalry always routed so easily (even when DOUBLE TEAMING another cavalry unit!), and while messing around with my edu file, I figured it out. Or should I say, it smacked me in the face. Funny thing is, even after I adjusted their stats, they STILL SUCK!

It's understandable - Romans cannot even ride horses inside the city! It's good enough that your Equites don't randomly fall from horseback

Perhaps it should be made a skirmisher cavalry? It would fit their stats much better...

[AqD]

I don't use phalangites. They're the most useless unit ever invented IMO.
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[brutaymagnus]

Ditto. Those phalanxes are so cumbersome. They're like sitting there and saying" "When are you going to outflank me with your cavalry and hit me in the rear?" LOL!

Yep. How naval battles are sorted out are a mystery to me too.

[Jamey]

Ditto. Those phalanxes are so cumbersome. They're like sitting there and saying" "When are you going to outflank me with your cavalry and hit me in the rear?" LOL!

I find that phalanxes are fun because of their one dimensional strength. They require more thought in deployment and protection. You cannot make a successful army with only phalanxes, but you can make a very successful army whose core is phalanxes.

Yep. How naval battles are sorted out are a mystery to me too.

Essentially, naval units were designed with low defense in RTR. Doing so causes them to take much higher casualties in autoresolve, resulting in more fleets sinking instead of skittering around the Med like waterbugs. Play a vanilla game sometime and experience the frustration of 10+ battles to eliminate a single bireme with a fleet of 10 stronger ships. However, because of the low defense, the stronger fleet is more likely to take heavy damage. It's a trade off that is occasionally annoying but the best compromise I've seen to deal with the RTW autoresolve engine for fleets.

[Mikail Mengsk]

I use phalangites to hold my center, with good units on the flanks and keeping the cavalry initiative, they are immovable, holding the line and suffering very little losses. Just have to use them wisely, the AI simply doesn't, that's why it's very easy to beat them.

[GraaEminense]

I love phalangists, both the Macedonian 'true' phalanx and the Greek. If possible I like to have 2-4 (preferably Mack style) in almost any army.

They have a very direct use, to be the anvil in the centre of my line. They take far less casualties than comparably costed units in the first few moments of contact, especially against other phalangists (and there's a lot of them!). Hopefully, that's all that's needed to flank with swordsmen.

Personally, there are one unit I hardly ever see any use for: skirmishers.
Like archers, only worse. Meh. Only ever used if I expect elephants, or for garrisons if they're the cheapest men-per-gold/upkeep available.

[Tiberius Tosi]

Personally, there are one unit I hardly ever see any use for: skirmishers.
Like archers, only worse. Meh. Only ever used if I expect elephants, or for garrisons if they're the cheapest men-per-gold/upkeep available.

Put them behind your main line. They inflict a good number of casualties, and I believe lower the morale of the enemy making them easier to route.

[Jamey]

Put them behind your main line. They inflict a good number of casualties, and I believe lower the morale of the enemy making them easier to route.

Skirmishers are extremely effective as flanking units. If you bring them behind engaged enemy infantry and fire a volley of javelins into the enemy's back, you will almost always trigger a rout. You do have to protect your skirmishers from other enemy units, though.

If you want to learn to use skirmishers, I recommend playing a Numidian campaign and avoiding hiring mercenaries for a while. Berber Javelinmen and Numidian Cavalry are among the best skirmish infantry and cavalry in the game. Desert infantry are like high defense warbands, so they make a great line for pinning enemies while your javelins do the work.

[AqD]

I use phalangites to hold my center, with good units on the flanks and keeping the cavalry initiative, they are immovable, holding the line and suffering very little losses. Just have to use them wisely, the AI simply doesn't, that's why it's very easy to beat them.

But what if AI doesn't send anything to the center? I noticed with ALX.exe they always try to flank me first, and their own pikemen/spearmen or heavy infantry usually form maniple formation rather than a single line - making my phalanx center line useless because there are always 1/3 to 2/3 of them are idle, but I cannot move them forward or do other things, because they'd be flanked.
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[Mikail Mengsk]

But what if AI doesn't send anything to the center? I noticed with ALX.exe they always try to flank me first, and their own pikemen/spearmen or heavy infantry usually form maniple formation rather than a single line - making my phalanx center line useless because there are always 1/3 to 2/3 of them are idle, but I cannot move them forward or do other things, because they'd be flanked.

Well, it depends on what kind of flanking is the AI doing.

Anyway, Just keep your main line face to face with the enemy, countering every enemy move.

For example, we could slow them by missile fire (archers, horse archers are the best for this), then order the pikemen to switch to non-phalanx formation (so they could run and if the enemy engage them, they will suffer lower combat malus), and reform them, facing the new menace.

Meanwhile, the cavalry units and the "normal" infantries would control enemy moves until the pikemen have completed their reforming manoeuver.


Even if the enemy succesfully outflank them, the phalanxes will hold the line anyway thanks to their numbers for some minutes, and you can use your unengaged units to take the upper hand on another point of the battlefield.

[AqD]

Well, it depends on what kind of flanking is the AI doing.

Anyway, Just keep your main line face to face with the enemy, countering every enemy move.

For example, we could slow them by missile fire (archers, horse archers are the best for this), then order the pikemen to switch to non-phalanx formation (so they could run and if the enemy engage them, they will suffer lower combat malus), and reform them, facing the new menace.

Meanwhile, the cavalry units and the "normal" infantries would control enemy moves until the pikemen have completed their reforming manoeuver.


Even if the enemy succesfully outflank them, the phalanxes will hold the line anyway thanks to their numbers for some minutes, and you can use your unengaged units to take the upper hand on another point of the battlefield.

But how are they any better than imitation legionaries or galatian swordsmen, except for gate defense?? Basically I could use those units without any micro-management - tell them to engage and they just work, also they're much better when defending on walls And I don't really have extra time to keep watching on phalanx lines because they're not offensive units; Instead I would personally take care of the cavalry and hypaspists or other elite peltasts/swordsmen - these are the real units that can get me victory.
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[Mikail Mengsk]

But how are they any better than imitation legionaries or galatian swordsmen, except for gate defense?? Basically I could use those units without any micro-management - tell them to engage and they just work, also they're much better when defending on walls And I don't really have extra time to keep watching on phalanx lines because they're not offensive units; Instead I would personally take care of the cavalry and hypaspists or other elite peltasts/swordsmen - these are the real units that can get me victory.

Sure, phalanxes are not better (legionary-style: this is the enemy: destroy it! I love legionaries ), they are simply different

I like to make armies with a good range of different units, so i always have some phalanx inside. As long as i could micromanage them, i will use them. . It's not easy and you have to pay them a lot of attention, but i like their sight (it looks very historical ), so....

[brutaymagnus]

The only situation where I can find a phalanx useful is in defending a bridgehead or a breach in a seige situation. But in open field they are very vulnerable - yes, they suffer low casualties in frontal battles but once they are out flanked they are almost always wiped out.

I once wiped out a full stack of Macedonian phalanxes with a general and two units of principes. I had my guys run all over the battlefield and as one phalanx closes in I destroyed it in a hammer & anvil operation before another one arrives to help it. Now repeat 20 times. Man! That was FUN!!

[Quinn Inuit]

A phalanx army can be quite flexible, actually, if you have sufficient melee troops to do the dirty work. Phalanxes are a great way to box up troops.

This battle, from TIC, is a good example of how I use my phalangites. The key is to have wing lines of phalangites behind and to the right and left of your main line, which can usually be quite thin. If the computer attacks your main line and actually threatens to break through, you can always reinforce it with some of your reserve troops.



The key is to let them start to flank, then pivot each half of your main line to deal with the flankers, while boxing them in with the wing lines. Then you send your cav and swordsmen around the back and/or up the center and beat the crap out of their troops which are by now futilely engaged against your phalanx.