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  1. #1
    christof139's Avatar Protector Domesticus
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    Default Mount Shasta glaciers growing, despite warming

    This article shows how armospheic warming can create more snowfall and glacial in some areas of the world, and is indicative of what happens during a warming period, which can become a cooling/glacial period due to incresed snowfall and ice formation in polar and other regions. This seems to be cyclic in nature throughout Earth's Geologic History.

    Chris

    http://www.comcast.net/articles/news...wing.Glaciers/

    Mount Shasta glaciers growing, despite warming
    7-8-08

    A truck moves past Mt. Shasta, background, on Highway 97 near Weed, Calif., ...
    2 hours ago, 7-8-08

    Loading... 29 RecommendationsMOUNT SHASTA, Calif. — Global warming is shrinking glaciers all over the world, but the seven tongues of ice creeping down Mount Shasta's flanks are a rare exception: They are the only long-established glaciers in the lower 48 states that are growing.

    Reaching more than 14,000 feet above sea level, Mount Shasta is one of the state's tallest peaks, dominating the landscape of high plains and conifer forests in far Northern California. Nearby Indian tribes referred to its glaciers as the footsteps made by the creator when he descended to Earth. Hikers flock to Shasta every summer to scale them.

    With glaciers retreating in the Sierra Nevada, the Rocky Mountains and elsewhere in the Cascades, those on Mount Shasta — a volcanic peak at the southern end of the Cascade range — are actually benefiting from changing weather patterns over the Pacific Ocean.

    "When people look at glaciers around the world, the majority of them are shrinking," said Slawek Tulaczyk, an assistant professor of earth sciences at the University of California, Santa Cruz, who led a team studying Shasta's glaciers. "These glaciers seem to be benefiting from the warming ocean."

    Climate change has cut the number of glaciers at Montana's Glacier National Park from 150 to 26 since 1850, and some scientists project there will be none left within a generation.

    Lonnie Thompson, a glacier expert at Ohio State University, has projected the storied snows at Africa's Mount Kilimanjaro might disappear by 2015.
    But for Shasta, about 270 miles north of San Francisco, scientists say a warming Pacific Ocean means more moist air. On the mountain, precipitation falls as snow, adding to the glaciers enough to overcome a 1.8 degree Fahrenheit rise in temperature in the last century, scientists say.

    "It's a bit of an anomaly that they are growing, but it's not to be unexpected," said Ed Josberger, a glaciologist at the U.S. Geological Survey in Tacoma, Wash. By comparison, the glaciers in the Sierra Nevada, more than 500 miles south of Mount Shasta, are exposed to warmer summer temperatures and are retreating.

    The Sierra's 498 ice formations — glaciers and ice fields — have shrunk by about half their size over the past 100 years, said Andrew Fountain, a geology professor at Portland State University. He inventoried glaciers in the contiguous U.S. as part of a federal initiative. He said Shasta's seven glaciers are the only ones scientists have identified as getting larger, with the exception of a small glacier in the shaded crater of Washington state's
    Mount St. Helens. It formed after the 1980 eruption blasted away slightly more than half the mountain's ice, and scientists believe it will not grow in area once it stretches outside the shade of the crater.

    Glaciologists say most glaciers in Alaska and Canada are retreating, too, but there are too many to study them all. Although Mount Shasta's glaciers are growing, researchers say the 4.7 billion cubic feet of
    ice on its flanks could be gone by 2100. For the glaciers to remain their current size, Shasta would have to receive 20 percent more snowfall for every 1.8-degree Fahrenheit increase in temperature, Tulaczyk said.

    The Shasta glaciers have been advancing since the end of a drought in the early 20th century. The mountain's smallest glaciers — named Konwakiton, Watkins and Mud Creek — have more than doubled in length since 1950.

    Hikers seeking to cross Shasta's glaciers — marked with crevasses as deep as 100 feet — say they are much larger than the boundaries drawn on geological maps. "I noticed I was traveling down farther than the maps were showing it," said Eric White, a U.S. Forest Service ranger who has climbed Shasta for 23 years.

    Four glaciers at Washington's Mount Rainier are staying about the same size. Those glaciers — shielded from the sun on the mountain's north and east sides — have received just enough snow to keep them from shrinking.
    The added ice on Mount Shasta might be good for the state's water supplies. Hydrologists believe the glaciers feed springs and aquifers, though they say it's unclear precisely how the water travels underground.

    Until recently, the same phenomenon that is benefiting Shasta's glaciers was feeding glacier growth in southern Norway and Sweden, the New Zealand Alps and northern Pakistan, according to the U.N. Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change.

    In each area, scientists say, more snowfall temporarily offset warming temperatures in the 1990s and early 2000s. But rising temperatures since then have begun to shrink the ice.

    Climate change is causing roughly 90 percent of the world's mountain glaciers to shrink, said Thompson, the Ohio State glacier expert. "Best that we keep our eye on the big picture," Thompson said in an e-mail about Shasta's
    unique position. "The picture points unfortunately (to) massive loss of ice on land, which has huge implications for future sea level rise."

    Global forecasts show temperatures warming from 2 degrees to 11.5 degrees Fahrenheit by the end of the century if no major efforts are undertaken to reduce greenhouse gas emissions. At that rate, California's snowpack and its remaining glaciers are among the most vulnerable of its natural resources.

    Even without global warming, another threat to Shasta's glaciers could come far more quickly. A volcanic eruption could melt them, creating mud flows that could bury the surrounding small communities.

    Over the last 4,000 years, Shasta has erupted about every 250 to 300 years, and did so most recently about 200 years ago, said William Hirt, a geology instructor at the College of the Siskiyous.
    ___
    On the Net:
    Shasta-Trinity National Recreation Area:
    http://www.fs.fed.us/r5/shastatrinit...ra/index.shtml
    (This version corrects that Shasta is at the southern end of the Cascade Range but not the
    range's southernmost volcano.)
    Copyright 2008 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be
    published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

  2. #2
    Aetius's Avatar Vae victis
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    Default Re: Mount Shasta glaciers growing, despite warming

    I know, I go to college near there. Whenever my geography teacher said Shasta's glacier was growing (Lassen as well) people are like wha?...Global Warming..polar bears...
    Blut und Boden

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    CtrlAltDe1337's Avatar Praepositus
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    Default Re: Mount Shasta glaciers growing, despite warming

    GLOBAL WARMING WILL CREATE THE NEXT ICE AGE ZOMG ITS A RUSSIAN CONSPIRACY!2!21@!!!!@@2!!2!11111!1!!1@11







    [/nubspeak]

    Seriously, when will people learn? The earth goes through climate changes every few hundred/thousand years; its not because of people (I'm sure ppl affect it a tab bit but nothing substantial...). Besides, we've only warmed 0.7 degrees C. Thats hardly anything and well within the range of earth's temp changes.


  4. #4

    Default Re: Mount Shasta glaciers growing, despite warming

    Quote Originally Posted by Crucifix View Post
    GLOBAL WARMING WILL CREATE THE NEXT ICE AGE ZOMG ITS A RUSSIAN CONSPIRACY!2!21@!!!!@@2!!2!11111!1!!1@11







    [/nubspeak]

    Seriously, when will people learn? The earth goes through climate changes every few hundred/thousand years; its not because of people (I'm sure ppl affect it a tab bit but nothing substantial...). Besides, we've only warmed 0.7 degrees C. Thats hardly anything and well within the range of earth's temp changes.

    yup, in one of my classes we did a global warming report, and I was the sole guy pointing to the cooling warming trends the earth goes through like the little ice age. Everyone was highly confused, they seem to think that things only can get warmer....just think of it like a roller coaster. sometimes your at the peak and sometimes your at the summit. but most of the time your in between.

  5. #5
    christof139's Avatar Protector Domesticus
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    Default Re: Mount Shasta glaciers growing, despite warming

    Quote Originally Posted by CtrlAltDe1337 View Post
    GLOBAL WARMING WILL CREATE THE NEXT ICE AGE ZOMG ITS A RUSSIAN CONSPIRACY!2!21@!!!!@@2!!2!11111!1!!1@11

    [/nubspeak]

    Seriously, when will people learn? The earth goes through climate changes every few hundred/thousand years; its not because of people (I'm sure ppl affect it a tab bit but nothing substantial...). Besides, we've only warmed 0.7 degrees C. Thats hardly anything and well within the range of earth's temp changes.
    Yeah, many cyclic cold and warm periods in Eath's Geologic history, probably related to cyclic solar flare activity mainly, and/or periods of intense and lengthy volcanic activity. So, and .7C or so warmup is not enough for people living in nortnern regions with cold winters. I want palm trees in Detroit, Michigan and date palms to be exact, royal palms from Florida are OK and so are Pacific region coconut palms.

    Chris

  6. #6

    Default Re: Mount Shasta glaciers growing, despite warming

    Far too many people do not know enough science and yet form highly arrogant opinions on what are most probably natural events.

    The same can be said of history. We have over 4000 years of humans making the same mistakes over and over again, and WHY do we still commit the same mistake over and over?

    Ignorance is appalling - and I consider myself very ignorant, in case anyone is wondering.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Mount Shasta glaciers growing, despite warming

    Quote Originally Posted by CtrlAltDe1337 View Post
    GLOBAL WARMING WILL CREATE THE NEXT ICE AGE ZOMG ITS A RUSSIAN CONSPIRACY!2!21@!!!!@@2!!2!11111!1!!1@11







    [/nubspeak]

    Seriously, when will people learn? The earth goes through climate changes every few hundred/thousand years; its not because of people (I'm sure ppl affect it a tab bit but nothing substantial...). Besides, we've only warmed 0.7 degrees C. Thats hardly anything and well within the range of earth's temp changes.
    And yet scientists by and large agree that current trend is both alarming and has unnatural traits.

    Forget not, we have ice records that go back millenias which can be used to determine accurately enough temperature variations.

    0,7 degrees but is it on top of normal temperature changes or not?

    By the way, about that glacier. If you have 3 glaciers, let us name them A B and C...

    A and B both diminish at rate of X, while C grows at rate of X. Do you have glaciers diminishing or growing?

    Exactly.

    Inidividual cases of opposite activity are always possible and actually expectable. It is total trend which has to be looked at.

    Even if Shasta is growig twice as fast as it today is, if other glaciers are diminishing faster than Shasta grows, it doesn't matter.


    Everyone is warhero, genius and millionaire in Internet, so don't be surprised that I'm not impressed.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Mount Shasta glaciers growing, despite warming

    Whatevers happening Global Warmings changing the usuall weather patterns e.t.c faster than nature can adapt or move, and that's bad.
    Not to mention that stuff on the gulf stream and water currents.

  9. #9
    christof139's Avatar Protector Domesticus
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    Default Re: Mount Shasta glaciers growing, despite warming

    I didn't post the Shasts Glacier info. to say that Global Warminhg is not occurring and the article I posted clearly explains what is happening. The Shasta Glacier(s) are simply in an area of the mountain protected by shade that is accumaulating more snow due to the increased snowfall, which increased snowfall is due to the atmosphere's increase in temp. and changes in wind urrents that are producing more snowfall in the area of the Shasta Glacier(s). IOTW, the rate of snowfall and resultant ice accumaulation has become higher than the melt rate due to the increased snowfall in the area which snowfall increase is eaxplained in the preceding sentence.

    The Geologic record records many time periods of cooling and warming in Earth's history, and it seems that increases and decreases in volcanic activity and probably solar flare (storm) activity are the main causes, along with the positions of the continents and wheter they are closely groupped together or not. In temperate climes, the central areas of a landmass can be cooler than the outer areas near the sea because the sea gnerally has a moderating and even warming affect on the temps. and land areas adjoing it. The upper central part of Michigan's lower Penninsula, the Mit or Mitten or hand, is colder in the Winter (-30F at times) than the coastal areas of Michigan that border lakes michigan in the west and Huron in the eats as these large bodies of water help moderate the temps. and raise the air temps. of the atmosphere above and near them. Western lower Michigan is ideal for growing grapes for wine, although much of all lower Michigan has wild grapes, due to the insulating effects of Lake Michigan.

    The ancient supercontinent of Gondwana seems to have been colder near its center for the same reasons, and huge glaciers once existed there as evidenced by glacial straiation marks in the rock of today's continents that was once near the center of Gondwana.

    I have a degree in Geology, but am a bit rusty, but what I and the article have stated is true.

    Chris

  10. #10

    Default Re: Mount Shasta glaciers growing, despite warming

    Quote Originally Posted by christof139 View Post
    I didn't post the Shasts Glacier info. to say that Global Warminhg is not occurring and the article I posted clearly explains what is happening. The Shasta Glacier(s) are simply in an area of the mountain protected by shade that is accumaulating more snow due to the increased snowfall, which increased snowfall is due to the atmosphere's increase in temp. and changes in wind urrents that are producing more snowfall in the area of the Shasta Glacier(s). IOTW, the rate of snowfall and resultant ice accumaulation has become higher than the melt rate due to the increased snowfall in the area which snowfall increase is eaxplained in the preceding sentence.

    The Geologic record records many time periods of cooling and warming in Earth's history, and it seems that increases and decreases in volcanic activity and probably solar flare (storm) activity are the main causes, along with the positions of the continents and wheter they are closely groupped together or not. In temperate climes, the central areas of a landmass can be cooler than the outer areas near the sea because the sea gnerally has a moderating and even warming affect on the temps. and land areas adjoing it. The upper central part of Michigan's lower Penninsula, the Mit or Mitten or hand, is colder in the Winter (-30F at times) than the coastal areas of Michigan that border lakes michigan in the west and Huron in the eats as these large bodies of water help moderate the temps. and raise the air temps. of the atmosphere above and near them. Western lower Michigan is ideal for growing grapes for wine, although much of all lower Michigan has wild grapes, due to the insulating effects of Lake Michigan.

    The ancient supercontinent of Gondwana seems to have been colder near its center for the same reasons, and huge glaciers once existed there as evidenced by glacial straiation marks in the rock of today's continents that was once near the center of Gondwana.

    I have a degree in Geology, but am a bit rusty, but what I and the article have stated is true.

    Chris
    Except you fail to take into account that single glacier growing is irrelevant to total reflection of heat if other areas are reduced.

    Glaciers elsewhere are receding, their reduction is more than enough to offset any increase in size of Shasta glacier. That is problem, you always find exceptions but it is general trend you must observe.

    Also, you have to realise that scientists know all this periodic changes as well. But current change does not fit into variations of those changes. It is too rapid. It may very well be periodic increase in temperature, but human interference is causing it to take place at far too fast rate, causing problems as lifeforms on the globe do not have ability to react to such rapid change.


    Everyone is warhero, genius and millionaire in Internet, so don't be surprised that I'm not impressed.

  11. #11

    Default Re: Mount Shasta glaciers growing, despite warming

    Wow, this is interesting. Thanks for posting christof

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