MTW II VS RTW

[Squiddy]

Hi Guys,

I just got MTW2 and have been playing an English campaign.

I played RTW for years and loved it..... And Ive noticed in game combat even on easy settings is a lot harder in MTW2.

eg.
In RTW if you had a unit of archers and you told them to attack another unit, they would fire and the other unit would drop. Combat effectiveness of units in MTW2 seems a lot less effective. Especially when ordering a charge of nights, footmen etc....

I find that to win a battle I need overwhelming superiority in numbers, rather than flanking, using archers as defence and cavalry charges.

Has anyone else experience similar issues coming from playing RTW?

[dr_guerra]

No, I disagree. Flanking the enemy successfully will make them route. Especially with a heavy cavalry charge.

[Squiddy]

Yeah but even things like a cavalry charge - the cavalry seem slow and dont attack the enemy as a single wall of steel, like they did in RTW. If you rammed a group of heavy cav into archers in RTW they cleaned them up, in M2 the archers hold their own a lot better against cavalry.

[Wheelchair]

It is because MTW engine is more sophisticated, meaning theres more problems

Download a Mod and it should help all your issues. preferably Stainless Steel 3.2

[Theseus1234]

Yeah but even things like a cavalry charge - the cavalry seem slow and dont attack the enemy as a single wall of steel, like they did in RTW. If you rammed a group of heavy cav into archers in RTW they cleaned them up, in M2 the archers hold their own a lot better against cavalry.

well thats because now, in the medieval ages, the charge is more important than the attack

the lance became imperative to heavy cav as it allowed more kills while charging

when you used cavalry, was it heavy or light? also, did you form the charge before attacking?

[Squiddy]

"when you used cavalry, was it heavy or light? also, did you form the charge before attacking?"

Mounted Feudal Knights - double clicked, charged, and got owned by a bunch of rebel scottish archers.

In general they dont seem to form up and attack as a single unit well. Is there a way to regroup them, without clicking loose and tight formation in the middle of battle?

[Kolaris8472]

Nitpicking here, but charging a unit with cavalry won't make it route.

It'll make it insta-die. I hate cav in this game....

[RollingWave]

you must have either charged uphill and/or woods, or you clicked something at the very end (or you only double clicked when very close)

because in the normal situation you described, the archers would usually lose 2/3 of their men on impact.

in the current game, it is important to make sure the charge is fully carried through, a full charge is ridiculasly powerful and even most spearmans will take pretty heavy casaulty on impact.

[Squiddy]

Hmmmmm...... Is this all because Im using the original version of the game?

Do I need to download a patch? Ive looked at patching, but it looks like everyone has had problems doing so. I dont even know if my game is a Euro, asia pacific or US version (ebay).

[Viking Prince]

Hmmmmm...... Is this all because Im using the original version of the game?

Do I need to download a patch? Ive looked at patching, but it looks like everyone has had problems doing so. I dont even know if my game is a Euro, asia pacific or US version (ebay).

Patch! If you do not know the version, how did you acquire it? Perhaps experiment with various patch versions. If ou are remotely US, then try US (includes military). If it is a download such as steam, you need to go back to steeam. The updates are not compatible with retail.

[Exarch]

M2:TW vs Rome?

the music in rome was more epic i felt
the music in medieval was lacking i'm afriad

[Leutrim]

Use the 'lock & hammer' technique. Engage infantry with enemy and the flank, works everytime even if you have a small number of cavelry. Plus, keep charging and returning, getting into a line formation and charge again and again if it doesnt work first time round.

[Ex Tenebris Lux]

in mtw2 give the cav unit plenty of ground between them and the enemy unit you're charging, let them sit still for a few seconds to settle down and form, then double-click and let them fly. i used to wonder why my cav charges weren't very good... it was because i would just charge them from wherever they happen to be, without giving them room to form and really CHARGE. one thing to remember is, cav (and this is for heavy cav, dont use light cav for frontal assaults) need a certain amount of time not just to build momentum but they also take a few short moments to actually ready their lances.

do a custom battle of a nice heavy cav unit vs some silly peasants, start them at what you think is a good distanc but not TOO far... charge them and see what i mean. you'll like it i promise.

[Ummagumma]

MTW > RTW > M2TW

Shiny graphics are all well and good, but the AI for both battles and on the campaign went from ok to bad to totally insane.

[bodkin]

The battles in RTW were alot more challenging, probably because the cavalry was not as powerful and the Battle AI performed better.

In M2TW you only need a few units of heavy cav knights and used correctly you can destroy an army of dismounted knights three times your size with little difficulty.

And yes I've tried every BAI out there but it's just still too easy to defeat the enemy on the battlefield or in sieges playing M2TW. On the very rare occasion I lose a battle in M2TW I'm actually happy, I think maybe the AI has some fight in it but then I go on to win the next 20 battles comfortably.

[Dr. Croccer]

Battles in RTW are simply more epic and fun. Less bugged as well. If I got a dime for every failed cavalry charge or musketmen with apparantly jamming rifles in M2TW....

[Ex Tenebris Lux]

Battles in RTW are simply more epic and fun. Less bugged as well. If I got a dime for every failed cavalry charge or musketmen with apparantly jamming rifles in M2TW....

completely agree

[Junius]

I find it the other way around. In Rome you could win a battle, even a big, important one, easily and fast. Heavy Infantry was alot better in Rome. I find the game/battle more balanced in M2, the battles take longer, there is more emphasis on terrain, and you have other considerations than just cav charge.

Though, some of my generals in Rome were very good. Dodonis the Mighty, conquerer of Gaul and Northern Italy, defeated the Julii at every turn, and wish he would 'reincarnate' himself as a HRE general, continue the German Empire.

[Clodius]

RTW was vastly more enjoyable - but I think that was more to do with the sheer variety of opponents (even when that variety was completely unhistorical as in the case of The Mummy Returns Egyptians and the fantasy barbarians).

However once you'd built the perfect stack it was every bit as easy to win battles as M2TW.

My Seleucid elephant, chariot, pike, cataphract, archer and peltast combo could reliably take down late era Roman full stacks with a 10:1 casualty ratio.

I've yet to find any M2TW combo (other than those bloody Mongols) that consistently wins like that battle after battle.

The strategic AI seems considerably less dumb now - you no longer get diplomats paying vast sums of money for ceasefires and then attacking you - not once but over and over again.

Plus no siege bug in M2TW.

[Clodius]

In RTW if you had a unit of archers and you told them to attack another unit, they would fire and the other unit would drop.

You using longbowmen yet?

The first thing you should do playing the English is build bowyers and then practice ranges at both Caen and Nottingham - if necessary disband all your other starting units so you can afford it.

Then recruit 5 or 6 units of longbowmen, have them put down stakes at the deployment stage, turn off skirmish mode - and if the enemy is good enough to attack (one of the patches forces them to attack if they have fewer missile troops than you), you'll see that they they are every bit as effective as RTW archers - more so given that enemy cavalry won't usually charge through the stakes.

While you can win early campaign battles with just longbows and a general, bringing some militia or levy spearmen along is usually a good idea as enemy infantry will sometimes survive long enough to reach your archers.