Barbarian ancillaries?

[Schwarzenegger]

I may be wrong here, but I think I remember reading something about negative traits/retinues for barbarian family members to be removed.
I'm playing a Gaul campaign and at least half of my family members have several bad traits and ancillaries. It's hard enough keeping order in cities as a barbarian, but having all these traits that make your family members worthless doesn't help at all.
I think something should be done to at least balance it out, perhaps give them some type of school building to get some positive traits and ancillaries. I've been having a great campaign so far but I feel it may not go on too much longer if I can't keep any kind of order in my empire.

[Stilgar CG]

Well, this one of the beauties of playing a barbarian faction Such generals appear from time to time, but in my experience not that often. I do not think removing those funny ancilaries and traits will help you much in keeping order in your settlements. Build temples from the very beginning.

Had such a general in my Thrace compaign: ugly, drunk, crazy witches as ancilary. I sent the guy to war, hoping he would die, but the guy came back alive, with some stars and decent ancilaries and traits.

Just make the guy to do some fighting, at least you will be able to use his bodyguards. If he dies, so be it. Most importantly, do not let such guys to reproduce (let them die young ).

[Rule_Brittania]

When I have generals with bad traits, who seem to be no use to me I just send them on a suicide mission in battle. A head on charge into some pikes always seems to do the trick.

I think the bad ancilaries and traits are a good thing, its realistic imo. We cant have a family of super generals, it just would be no fun!

[Unknown Soldier]

As I stated inanother thread I had a bad general Caradoc the Mad - totally bonkers - charged him headlong in every battle to start with - ended up conquering the indi gauls, Iberia and half of Germany before dying of old age with 10 stars and a shed load of traits from fighting which compensated for all the bad things he had at the start.

Never fought pikes though - I think the enemy were more scared of him than his own men.

[Stilgar CG]

I remember in Shogun for the generals unit to attack in wedge formation meant almost instant death of the general: the general was the tip of the wedge, apparently.

I am not sure if the generals' bodyguard unit in RTW can form wedge (I guess not). If they can, then try wedge + charge into wall of pikes/spears, or just stay under the shower of arrows/spears/javelins for a while, or stay till you are hit by catapult/onager missile (those have the general-seeking mechanism), or send him on a long journey on one small ship and attack a large rebel fliet

Well, it's a kind of "how to kill your own general" thread now

[LucretiusTC]

As I stated inanother thread I had a bad general Caradoc the Mad - totally bonkers - charged him headlong in every battle to start with - ended up conquering the indi gauls, Iberia and half of Germany before dying of old age with 10 stars and a shed load of traits from fighting which compensated for all the bad things he had at the start.

Never fought pikes though - I think the enemy were more scared of him than his own men.

With that kind of glorious results you should honour the late great Caradoc, not to disgrace his memory....bad, mad, and dangerous to know....

Luc.

[Unknown Soldier]

With that kind of glorious results you should honour the late great Caradoc, not to disgrace his memory....bad, mad, and dangerous to know....

Luc.

I do. He was awsome at the end and it was a sad day on earth and the afterlife the day he shed his mortal coil

Now the Gods have to deal with him.

[Suppanut]

If you want better experience in traits and ancillaries for barbarians then you should try "ethnic Traits Project" modules from submod forum. I hope this module would ease your problem with new ability traits for barbarians and some good ancillaries(although most of them are for Gauls and Germans).

[Scutarii]

In my last game as Gaul half my family member were insane... I had so many "the mad"'s I could fill a half stack with them.... Unfortunately they're all completely useless, no Caradoc's for me. 0 everything, the buggers.

[Unknown Soldier]

You should have charged them en mass as one big heavy cavalry army vs every enemy you could = death or glory

Then follow up with a decent army to mop up whatever wasn't killed by "da mad mob" (WH 40K Epic Ork ref.)

[rogergargantua]

Thats rite...if a general has bad traits, send em to battle to give em a few lessons about "life"

He will come back as a much wiser person probalby.....or end up dead

[Schwarzenegger]

Well I suppose sacrficifing generals is fun, but that doesn't explain why there are so many (easy to get) negative traits and ancillaries for barbarian civilizations.

[Scutarii]

Barbarian factions have no academy, which means no good retinue, and there culture spreading buildling (taverns) give plenty of bad traits for everything. Try not building taverns.

[Unknown Soldier]

Er..they are barbarians - you the player are a 'civilised' person - what you think of as bad is possibly admirable in barbarian 'society' - different world views - just from a 'Roman' perspective these things do not aid in the governing and running of cities - clumps of 'civilisation'.

Play them for what they are - drunks, rogues and mad men, Hurrah! Shut up! Pass me another roast boar and jug of ale! Cos tomorrow we may die in battle!

[Schwarzenegger]

I understand the point of them not having good management, but shouldn't they have good command bonuses?
What the heck is up with those traits that give like -4 morale or -3 command or some crap like that.
It just feels like the barbarians are meant to play a short campaign not expanding much beyond your starting borders. I mean, you build temples you get bad traits, you try converting the culture, you get bad traits. It is as if I'm supposed to shoot straight for Rome and then quit once I'm done with that.
Owning (and keeping order) over half the game map is already hard enough as a civilized faction, as a barbarian faction it is basically impossible.

[DimeBagHo]

I'll take a look at the barbarian trait and ancillary triggers when I get back. I think a reasonable system would be something like this: Young barbarian family members should make bad governors. The only way for a young barbarian to gain standing should be through winning battles. But once a general has achieved enough fame and age, it should be OK for him to settle down as a governor, without the risk of gaining crippling traits and ancillaries.

[Unknown Soldier]

I'll take a look at the barbarian trait and ancillary triggers when I get back. I think a reasonable system would be something like this: Young barbarian family members should make bad governors. The only way for a young barbarian to gain standing should be through winning battles. But once a general has achieved enough fame and age, it should be OK for him to settle down as a governor, without the risk of gaining crippling traits and ancillaries.

Thats exactly how it should be.

I feel a Gallic AAR coming on

[Suppanut]

I'll take a look at the barbarian trait and ancillary triggers when I get back. I think a reasonable system would be something like this: Young barbarian family members should make bad governors. The only way for a young barbarian to gain standing should be through winning battles. But once a general has achieved enough fame and age, it should be OK for him to settle down as a governor, without the risk of gaining crippling traits and ancillaries.

How about let's barbarian with aging traits gains some kind of better companions in tavern better to drank with than all those useless drunkard(Good liquor based on those to drank with, If you drinking with your best friend, even the plain water still can be as good as the best wine.(This is chinese saying which use a lot in xia(subtype of KungFu novel) literature). Something like "Old battle Companion"(good ol' band of brothers), "Long Separated Childhood Friend"(have a lot of stories/knowledge to shared) would be better choice to drink with if you get older and should be replace as option for barbarian which already get DBH' trait for anti bad traits/ancillaries.(While the young who still not learn about life and responsibilty still get old brainless drunkard as option.)

DimeBagHo: Will you released the barbarians anti-trait before released of XGM 5.8? If not, May I work on them to in Ethnic Traits Project for you to include in XGM 5.8 as now my brain began to load with idea about it and potential ideas serrounding it?

[Suppanut]

As what Dime state above, I have some idea about those traits to proposed. This new traits should count as anti-traits and anti-ancillaries for many vice of barbarians. If anyone have and idea please give it in.

{Cool} Cool

{Cool_desc}
Experience in battles taught him that, it would be more cool if he think about the result of actions a bit before act.

{Cool_effects_desc}
+1 Command

{Prudent} Prudent

{Prudent_desc}
As time passing by, now he could no longer life in pointless life and grow more prudent as now he has more responsibility for all his family as well as those who follow him.

{Prudent_effects_desc}
+1 Command, +1 Management

{Elder} Elder

{Elder_desc}
Many winters have passed since the day he fought mindlessly with passion of the youngs and gradually he grew older and jaded with his thoughtless acts of the past. Now he must use his own lifetimes experience to serves and guides the youngs of his community as one of the elder.

{Elder_effects_desc}
+1 Management, +1 Influence

;------------------------------------------
Trait Prudent
    Characters family
    ExcludeCultures eastern, carthaginian, egyptian, greek, roman
    NoGoingBackLevel  2 
    AntiTraits Drink, Girls, Slothful, Berserker, Ignorance, Gambling, Corrupt, Anger, FearsCarthaginian, FearsGreek, FearsEgyptian, FearsEastern, FearsSlave, FearsRoman, Perverted, ExpensiveTastes

    Level Cool
        Description Cool_desc
        EffectsDescription Cool_effects_desc
        Threshold  2 

        Effect Command  1 

    Level Prudent
        Description Prudent_desc
        EffectsDescription Prudent_effects_desc
        Threshold  4 

        Effect Command  1 
        Effect Management  1

    Level Elder
        Description Elder_desc
        EffectsDescription Elder_effects_desc
        GainMessage Elder_gain_desc
        Threshold  8 

        Effect Management  1
        Effect Influence  1

[Scutarii]

Could stand for a spellcheck, but good ideas Suppanut. And Dime, Ifyou can get barbarian factions to work like that it would be fantastic. I steer clear of barbarian factions a lot of the times because of all the useless family members you get, no matter what you do.