vassal (2 masters?)

**nakago** · June 13, 2008, 03:31 PM

playing 6.1, byg 3, and rr.

As teuton i got Novogrod to become my vassal,
after a few turn they became the vassal of Cuman Khanate.
on diplo. screen they are both Cuman and my vassal ..

how can this be??? bug?

**Maniacal** · June 13, 2008, 03:35 PM

They're paying tribute to two realms, I say declare on them again and show them who's boss! YEAH! *pumps air with fist*

**Schweizergarde** · June 13, 2008, 03:43 PM

Meh, its not secret CA developed a diplomacy engine independent of actual logic.

I couldn't give away a 1300 florin/turn settlement for 100 florin.

**DeaDBolT** · June 13, 2008, 05:56 PM

Originally Posted by Schweizergarde

Meh, its not secret CA developed a diplomacy engine independent of actual logic.

I couldn't give away a 1300 florin/turn settlement for 100 florin.

That reminds me of the time i was playing Venice, i offered 10000 florins, trade rights, map information and for my daughter to marry the their heir to the HRE.

And then o got counter offered like: "oh we dont want any money or map information, just give your daughter and we'll toss in the trade rights for free"

**strife1013** · June 13, 2008, 06:00 PM

Originally Posted by DeaDBolT

That reminds me of the time i was playing Venice, i offered 10000 florins, trade rights, map information and for my daughter to marry the their heir to the HRE.

And then o got counter offered like: "oh we dont want any money or map information, just give your daughter and we'll toss in the trade rights for free"

**Aldwen** · June 14, 2008, 01:30 AM

Originally Posted by DeaDBolT

That reminds me of the time i was playing Venice, i offered 10000 florins, trade rights, map information and for my daughter to marry the their heir to the HRE.

And then o got counter offered like: "oh we dont want any money or map information, just give your daughter and we'll toss in the trade rights for free"

Oh I've seen worse. I've offered the AI Map Info, and Trade Rights in exchange for their Map Info only to get a counter offer of "Yeah we don't want any of that but here, take 2000 florins for nothing in return..." >.>

**moosey** · June 14, 2008, 05:01 AM

I think one of the problems with the AI is that they dont take diplomatic offers that sound too good, as in say you are trying to suck up to the pope with a few bribes, he likes that and accepts but if you were to offer him that same amount for map info, he wont, same for giving away settlements

**tup** · June 14, 2008, 05:26 AM

Yup, they should say "We have nothing to offer in return and must refuse" or so, which is just stupid.

**Schweizergarde** · June 13, 2008, 06:46 PM

I got a noble mission to negotiate a deal with Papacy to gain Florence, which they refuse to do for Prague + 50000 florin * 999999 turns (not kidding). Relation was perfect, reputation was very trustworthy.

**-Amon-** · June 16, 2008, 02:34 AM

Originally Posted by Schweizergarde

I got a noble mission to negotiate a deal with Papacy to gain Florence, which they refuse to do for Prague + 50000 florin * 999999 turns (not kidding). Relation was perfect, reputation was very trustworthy.

**shenryyr** · June 15, 2008, 05:05 PM

This 'too good to be true' part is obvious if you try to buy a settlement --- offering 1000 florins for 10 turns is the most you can give that will result in improving your chances of sealing the deal. If you try to give 1000 for 20 turns, or 2000 for 10 turns, it actually hurts the deal.

Logically this doesn't make sense, however I believe it was done to prevent people from cheating the system. For instance, if you had 10k in your wallet you could offer 10k x 100000000 turns and that amount of money would buy you any settlement. Next turn, cancel the payment, then haggle to buy another settlement for the same amount. Next turn, cancel that payment, etc, etc...

This way you're stuck with a maximum offer, and if that's not good enough to buy a settlement, then you simply cannot buy it. Period.

At least that's how it works on vh/vh

**Quixote** · June 15, 2008, 06:36 PM

Originally Posted by shenryyr

This 'too good to be true' part is obvious if you try to buy a settlement --- offering 1000 florins for 10 turns is the most you can give that will result in improving your chances of sealing the deal. If you try to give 1000 for 20 turns, or 2000 for 10 turns, it actually hurts the deal.

Logically this doesn't make sense, however I believe it was done to prevent people from cheating the system. For instance, if you had 10k in your wallet you could offer 10k x 100000000 turns and that amount of money would buy you any settlement. Next turn, cancel the payment, then haggle to buy another settlement for the same amount. Next turn, cancel that payment, etc, etc...

This way you're stuck with a maximum offer, and if that's not good enough to buy a settlement, then you simply cannot buy it. Period.

At least that's how it works on vh/vh

Tried to +rep you but wouldn't take!

Thanks for the info, I will try to rep you later...

EDIT: Gotcha now...

**rob-a-dogg** · June 15, 2008, 06:31 PM

i always wondered how that worked. *goes away to try it out*

**Maniacal** · June 16, 2008, 03:09 AM

The AI does not understand that a huge amonut of money is a good thing, I once offered 5 million (or is 999,999 the max?) for a freaking MAP and they refused!

**Aldwen** · June 16, 2008, 09:41 PM

One thing I've wondered is if people know how getting Map Info works? I've never had an issue getting map info from the AI unless I have a bad reputation, even then I can it just cost more.

The AI will hand out it's map info ONLY if your map info of their nation is out of date. So if you have spies wandering around all over the place you usually have the most current map information so the AI won't accept anything you offer. However if their national boarders have changed in some form and you no longer have to most current map information they don't have an issue when it comes to giving it away.

When one first starts collecting map information how much "information" the AI has to fill in on your map changes the cost of how much they charge. I've gotten map info off small countries like Genoa for as little as 500 florin, and paid up to 3 grand for the Cumans map info. Just depends really.