As a Norse and Byzantine player, many of my infantry units have shieldwall. I put them in this because it looks cool and it must do something good, but what exactly does it do? Is it simply a defense bonus against ranged fire? Thanks!
Tiro
Shieldwall-What does it do?
As a Norse and Byzantine player, many of my infantry units have shieldwall. I put them in this because it looks cool and it must do something good, but what exactly does it do? Is it simply a defense bonus against ranged fire? Thanks!
"The dark giant lay sprawled on the sands of Tunis. Far to the north the new champion of the arena lifted his arms in triumph. The galleys passed upon the sea, the soldiers laid down their arms, cities were rebuilt and peace was everywhere welcomed. The supine giant was unconscious, but not dead. Slowly he began to raise himself upon his elbows."
~Hannibal, by Ernie Bradford
Biarchus
Re: Shieldwall-What does it do?
I was wondering that to. I would assume that it would protect the unit from missle fire and direct infantry charges because that was its purpose in real life. Game mechanics wise Im not real sure.
Re: Shieldwall-What does it do?
After having used it a couple of times, it seems to dramatically reduces the damage enemy infantry can do to your men as their flanks are never exposed. I line my men up, put em in shield wall with 'defend' on and let the enemy infantry line engage. I know they'll hold and meanwhile I flank with cav or other infantry.
Tiro
Re: Shieldwall-What does it do?
I also like it because it seems to get more men into combat. Never did like in M2TW how five guys fight and the rest of the unit sits back and watches. Even worse when you're charging into an existing fight.
"The dark giant lay sprawled on the sands of Tunis. Far to the north the new champion of the arena lifted his arms in triumph. The galleys passed upon the sea, the soldiers laid down their arms, cities were rebuilt and peace was everywhere welcomed. The supine giant was unconscious, but not dead. Slowly he began to raise himself upon his elbows."
~Hannibal, by Ernie Bradford
Re: Shieldwall-What does it do?
The more men fight might be caused by "defend" alone, though.
Tiro
Re: Shieldwall-What does it do?
I actually never put my shielders in defend.
It just seems that as they are more tightly packed together, more of them fight, at least initially before the unit spreads out.
"The dark giant lay sprawled on the sands of Tunis. Far to the north the new champion of the arena lifted his arms in triumph. The galleys passed upon the sea, the soldiers laid down their arms, cities were rebuilt and peace was everywhere welcomed. The supine giant was unconscious, but not dead. Slowly he began to raise himself upon his elbows."
~Hannibal, by Ernie Bradford
3D modeler - Animator
Re: Shieldwall-What does it do?
Just check the pics of the shield wall here , it´s in the darkages that was commonly use by almost every nation or tribe, The mod will make a use of shield walls as the may type ability is in development though a lot of work to do!Originally Posted by Lord Raneus
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...&highlight=vll
Praepositus
Re: Shieldwall-What does it do?
the spear's whatever formation seems to be weird too. i mean sometimes it makes them almost ungodly in a large melee but occasionally they just drop like flies for no reason
Miles
Re: Shieldwall-What does it do?
How well do they stand up to calvalry beyond the usual spear effect?
Tiro
Re: Shieldwall-What does it do?
Shield wall is very good when fighting cavalry. This was the way how I usualy killed enemy general without casualties on my side. Horses just cant break trough shield wall and are jibing in front of it and are killed one by one.
Decanus
Re: Shieldwall-What does it do?
The jibbing is just an AI flaw i guess, it also happens in a siege where the enemy tries to poor all his units through the gate. If you block them with your own units they will just keep pushing until they succeed or die....Shield wall is very good when fighting cavalry. This was the way how I usualy killed enemy general without casualties on my side. Horses just cant break trough shield wall and are jibing in front of it and are killed one by one.
Last edited by DeaDBolT; June 15, 2008 at 05:33 PM.
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Decanus
Re: Shieldwall-What does it do?
One thing about shield wall is you need to make sure you don't group together a bunch of units in shield wall formation and order them to cram into a small area. They quite hilariously bend to physics and receive invisible cavalry charges in the middle of the ranks, you'll see soldiers go flying up into the air with the result of some pretty serious casualties.
The strange days are coming.
Ordinarius
Re: Shieldwall-What does it do?
What I know about shieldwall is that Romans used it instead of classical Turtle formation in last centuries of their Empire. It was fine protection against missile fire and probably against charges of infantry, but it would be suicide to have this formation against cavalry charge without pikes. I say pikes for what I hate about spearwall formation made by regular spearmen in M2TW this formation is able to stonecold HC charge what wouldnd be possible without pikes. For HC had armoured horses and when in full charge spearmen wouldnt be much better than swordsmen unlike pikemen.
Decanus
Re: Shieldwall-What does it do?
Horses of any sort do not like to charge into a stationary wall full of shiny pointy things, pikes or not. William's cavalry was useless at Hastings against the Saxon shield wall. Unless the line is very thin the horses would likely break the charge and veer off.
The strange days are coming.
Biarchus
Re: Shieldwall-What does it do?
I hate to get too off topic here but the Saxons had the advantage of sitting on a hill at the battle of Hastings which is why the cavalry wasnt as effective. Also, inventions like the stirrup and the lance turned cavalry into tanks on the medieval battlefield. PETESKTEMPLAR is right. Setting up a shield wall in front of charging heavy cavalry in the 11th-12th century would be like setting up a shield wall in front of a truck. If it works on the game then its because of a flaw in the AI its not realistic.
Vicarius Provinciae
Re: Shieldwall-What does it do?
I think at the time of Hastings the Norman cavalry was not using the couched lance.
Tiro
Re: Shieldwall-What does it do?
Was.
Decanus
Re: Shieldwall-What does it do?
I would like to clarify that I was not disputing that a Shield Wall would render any cavalry charge useless, I was however stating that it would not always be suicide for the infantry. There are situations where a pike would not be completely required to stop a cavalry charge. Of course, the situation also depends on whether or not the cavalry are heavy or light. An armored horse combined with a couched lance is not going to have problems against non-pike infantry on level surfaces. Light cavalry however were known to break off from charging bayonet equipped infantry, let alone a six foot + spear.
Unfortunately, I can't seem to find much information on shield wall effectiveness against any type of cavalry beyond Hastings.
The strange days are coming.
Ordinarius
Re: Shieldwall-What does it do?
But later! Just read text bellow.
Semisalis
Re: Shieldwall-What does it do?
Shield Wall leads to pushing for some reason, which inevitably negates the point of the shield wall (ie. defensive). Try putting a unit with shield wall near a gate in a siege. After the enemy floods in, they shield wall pushes back - and quickly!!
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