The Linux Thread

[Code_Knight]

The Linux Thread

Everything you need to know about Linux, news, updates, etc..

What's Linux?

Linux is a kernel based off an original operating system called Unix. Unix was first made in the 1960's and was adopted for it's portability. A man named Linus Torvalds decided to make a kernel for the GNU operating system (which is based off of Unix) called Linux. Linux is open source and comes in many different “flavors”. It has different distributions that handle the software differently and ultimately changes the experience of the user. These distributions use desktop environments, which is simply the setup of the GUI (Graphical User Interface) and how it works.

Linux Distributions

There are several main distributions that other distributions are based off of. But here is a list of the most common ones:

• Ubuntu (Debian Based)
• Kubuntu (Debian Based)
• Gentoo
• Fedora
• Red Hat
• Slackware
• Knoppix
• Debian
• SUSE

For more distributions, check out this link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of..._distributions

Desktop Environments

Here are the most common desktop environments:

• KDE
• GNOME
• Xfce
• Xpde
• Enlightenment
• ROX

The Two Major Desktop Environments of Linux

Both KDE and GNOME are some of the most popular desktop environments out there. They are user friendly, and make software easy to install. GNOME uses a default window manager called “metacity” and KDE uses a default window manager called Kwin. The great thing about these two is that if you like the KDE feel, but you hate the window manager, you can easily change to metacity and same goes for GNOME, they are interchangable. One desktop environment isn't better than the other in this case, it's just the look and feel the user likes.

KDE 4

KDE 4 is what some call, the next generation in desktop environments. It uses a toolbar called plasma. Plasma doesn't function like most toolbars, it is made so that anything that can go on the toolbar can be dragged to the desktop and vise versa. Plasma uses a new widget system that allows you to add applications to the desktop such as clocks, notepads, and image frames, and has a very similar look to the Vista desktop (Windows Operating System).

Here is a picture of my KDE 4 desktop:




KDE 4 is still in development and is only beta, some features have been left out of the beta, but will be coming soon.

I love my Windows, why switch to Linux?

You Shouldn't! Linux is a great operating system that provides many features for it's users and is open source. It comes with many applications, but it cannot run windows programs. There are programs for Linux (WINE, Cedega) that allow you to run programs for Windows, but It's always better to run programs on the OS it was intended for. I have two hard drives in my computer, one hard drive is for Windows, the other is for Linux. The only time I use windows is for gaming (even though I play my TW games using Cedega on Linux).

Code_Knight's Comments

I use Kubuntu personally, I like the look and feel of it. I use the KDE 4.04 desktop (as you can see in the picture above). The Ubuntu based distributions are the best ones to use for people new to Linux and even people that are experienced. Kubuntu is Ubuntu with KDE as it's default desktop environment and Ubuntu uses GNOME as its desktop environment. Gentoo is also a very good distribution, but it is considered very difficult for people that aren't experienced in computers and the Linux kernel. Even though KDE 4 has a very nice feel and is without a doubt the most beautiful desktop environment I have ever seen, it is still beta (very unstable) and I would not recommend to beginners until the full version comes out. This thread was intended for people to get to know what Linux is and experience for themselves how an open source OS works. In future posts, I will be providing, news, applications of the week, updates, etc... If you have any questions or comments, feel free to PM me, or post in this thread.

Sources Used

http://linuxreviews.org/software/desktops/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of..._distributions
www.linux.org
www.debian.org
www.gentoo.org
www.ubuntu.com
www.kubuntu.org
www.kde.org

[Thor the Bassist]

Cool. When I get my new computer from Dell they will be forcing me to buy Vista with it. So I thought I would reach for the internet and try Linux.

Two questions:

What is the Linux compatibility like for RTW and BI?

What distribution would you advise for someone who's fairly good with computers (up until tough/hardcore programming kicks in) but who hasn't had any experience of the Linux system yet (I learn fast though)?

[Code_Knight]

Cool. When I get my new computer from Dell they will be forcing me to buy Vista with it. So I thought I would reach for the internet and try Linux.

Two questions:

What is the Linux compatibility like for RTW and BI?

What distribution would you advise for someone who's fairly good with computers (up until tough/hardcore programming kicks in) but who hasn't had any experience of the Linux system yet (I learn fast though)?

I would recommend using Kubuntu, even though it is meant for users new with Linux, it still is very good at letting someone who is good with computers perform expert tasks. Gentoo is another really good distribution, it lets you customize every little detail on how your computer is run, but it is very difficult to set up. There is a general installation how-to on the gentoo website. (I still use kubuntu on my CPU, but I use gentoo on my laptop)

There are two programs that I know of that allow you to run .exe files on Linux. One is free, it is called Wine, the other you have to pay for and it is called Cedega. Wine is very good with programs that don't require much graphics, but it does very poorly with games and it takes hours upon hours to set it up for just one game and sometimes it still doesn't work. Cedega is specilized for gaming and it works very well and is relitively easy to use. You cannot play TW games with WINE, but Cedega works just fine.

A neat thing about Kubuntu (and all debian based distributions) is that you can install anything without having to look for a file all over the internet. so if I wanted to install firefox, I would just type in the console (program is called konsole): sudo apt-get install firefox
and it would install all the dependencies and the firefox.

gentoo uses the emerge system: emerge firefox

If you do end up installing Linux, and you need help, just ask, I'll be happy to help.

[fatsheep]

Good post. I use Ubuntu but I don't care for KDE. It looks too much like Windows. GNOME works great for me.

Ubuntu was frustrating when I first tried it (summer 2006) but it has improved at a fast pace. It now automatically installs proprietary drivers, codecs, has a flash package for 64-bit users, and in general just works well. I haven't even used wine for a long time.

Here are some things I'd like to add to your above post:

1. Wine is great but don't get your hopes up on it. It might not work and if it does work with an application, performance could be a lot worse. To be fair though, sometimes it does work beautifully and the wine producers have an extremely hard job as they don't have access to the Windows source code (it's under lock and key).

2. With WUBI you can now install Ubuntu like a Windows application to try out. That's about as convenient as it gets.

3. Just about all of your applications on Ubuntu are going to come from servers called repositories. This way, your software is free, automatically updated, and guaranteed to be virus free. Just one of the reasons Linux beats Windows in the security department hands down. I don't have a firewall, anti-virus, or anti-spyware software. I just don't need them.

4. Linux needs no defragmenting. The file system (EXT3) works fine without it, you probably won't even see any benefit from a defrag. Linux, in general, just holds together better than Windows. I'm used to Windows being clogged up with crap and slowing down over time. Ubuntu is much more consistent.

5. Ubuntu has a great community over at www.ubuntuforums.org. Those forums are huge and they have tons of knowledgeable people on them. Search them or post on them for answers to any questions about Ubuntu.

What is the Linux compatibility like for RTW and BI?

If you want to play Rome then I'd keep a Windows partition and dual boot. It's not too hard to do and you won't have to deal with WINE. WINE doesn't always run well or at all...

However, if you want to run it under WINE, check out this link: Running RTW with WINE

It looks like it works but not everything in the game does:

What works
Installation
Sound
Menus, campaign map, battles (with noted caveats)

What does not
Videos

What was not tested
Multiplayer

Additional Comments
Tested was version 1.5 from Rome Total War Gold Edition. All of these comments also apply to Barbarian Invasion expansion.

• Loading screens show background image for a split second then turn black.
• In the campaign map screen, moving the mouse to the right side of the screen and the bottom of the screen do not move the campaign map.
• Similarly, in the battle screen, when moving the mouse to the right side of the screen it does not rotate the view, and moving the mouse to the bottom of the screen does not move the view. This might seem small but makes battles too annoying to play.
• Battles crash immediately unless "Battlefield Shadows" are disabled.
• Menus act strangely.
• If I move in and out of menu options too much without starting a game, the "Historical Campaign" and "Provincial Campaign" options disappear, after which starting a campaign isn't possible. Then when I try starting a game I cannot, and instead get the odd message window that says "Please select an item from the list". Then I have to restart the game in order to play it. An easy way to duplicate this is by selecting "Imperial Campaign" or "Historical Campaign", clicking the back button, and repeating until the historical and provincial options disappear. Selecting "View the credits" simply crashes the game.

What distribution would you advise for someone who's fairly good with computers (up until tough/hardcore programming kicks in) but who hasn't had any experience of the Linux system yet (I learn fast though)?

Ubuntu. I'd recommend Ubuntu for virtually anybody. It's easy, it's fast, it's stable, and it is has a great community. I've tried other distributions but I think Ubuntu is simply the best.

If you are a serious programmer then you might want to check out Gentoo or some other distrobution that allows you more control. However, you'll have to spend a lot more time making your operating system work for you.

[Zapp]

I'd say Ubuntu. It'll be quite frustrating in the beginning, but when you realise how it works, it kicks ass, and is really easy to use.

I haven't tried RTW on linux, but Wine works fairly good for many games at least, so I don't think there should be any bigger problems.

[Thor the Bassist]

That sounds good. With Cedega can I just get 3 months subscription or do I need to go for the full year? The website was rather confusing on whether the 3 months subscription meant you had to renew the subscription after the 3 months and keep going all year or whether you could just cancel after 3 months. Seeing as WINE is free I'll try that first though.

PS:

I love my Windows, why switch to Linux?

I dont know anyone who loves their windows. Mine is currently insistent that it needs to restart (WHY???).

[Code_Knight]

That sounds good. With Cedega can I just get 3 months subscription or do I need to go for the full year? The website was rather confusing on whether the 3 months subscription meant you had to renew the subscription after the 3 months and keep going all year or whether you could just cancel after 3 months. Seeing as WINE is free I'll try that first though.

I don't know, I personally use WINE (because I'm cheap), but it takes forever to setup TW games. If I were you I would seriously look into Cedega.

PS:
I dont know anyone who loves their windows. Mine is currently insistent that it needs to restart (WHY???).

Who knows? Ya, some people like GNOME and others like KDE, I like KDE, , fatsheep said KDE is like windows but I would have to disagree, but then again the diferent desktop distros are really made for different peoples taste, so go with whatever you like.

[fatsheep]

Who knows? Ya, some people like GNOME and others like KDE, I like KDE, , fatsheep said KDE is like windows but I would have to disagree, but then again the diferent desktop distros are really made for different peoples taste, so go with whatever you like.

The start menu is the main reason. Who ever thought up making people click on "start" to shut down the computer? GNOME is a refreshing change for me. You've got the Applications, Places, and System menus in the top left. You've got the time and system bar to the top right. The show desktop button is in the bottom left and workspaces are in the bottom right. That seems like a very reasonable setup to me.

Also, I like Gnome's look better than KDE. KDE has some neat visual effects but GNOME has a more welcoming and friendly interface IMHO. Both are great though.

That sounds good. With Cedega can I just get 3 months subscription or do I need to go for the full year? The website was rather confusing on whether the 3 months subscription meant you had to renew the subscription after the 3 months and keep going all year or whether you could just cancel after 3 months. Seeing as WINE is free I'll try that first though.

I've never used Cedega so I'm not sure. You could try posting or searching in the gaming forum of www.ubuntuforums.org. I'm sure they'd know. However, I'd recommend keeping Windows on the computer. It's simply the only way to run some applications well.

PS:
I dont know anyone who loves their windows. Mine is currently insistent that it needs to restart (WHY???).

Yet another advantage of Linux: you don't have to restart very often. If something goes wrong, instead of restarting you can press Ctrl+Alt+Backspace to restart the graphical interface (X). This just shoots you back to the login screen and allows you to start a new session.

[Thor the Bassist]

My main gripe with Windows is that 6 months in the fragmentation means your looking at a OS stuck in a digital bog. So if its run on WINE (or Cedega) with some small problems or endure a dual boot Windows I think I'll choose WINE/Cedega.

[Code_Knight]

My main gripe with Windows is that 6 months in the fragmentation means your looking at a OS stuck in a digital bog. So if its run on WINE (or Cedega) with some small problems or endure a dual boot Windows I think I'll choose WINE/Cedega.

I wouldn't recommend a dual boot, but have two hard drives seems to work just fine with me.

btw, the next article is on this thursday.

[Freddie]

How to make a Linux OS Bootable Flash USB Stick


Before I start there is one golden rule 1. Don’t just remove the USB stick by pulling it out the socket, you MUST use the Safely remove hardware tool in the system tray!


1) Download a copy of Damn Small Lunix from one of these sites. DSL is only 50 MB and is designed to run all manor of computer configurations all the way down to a 486. Unzip the contents into a temp folder (just create a folder on the desktop called DSL)

2) In windows go into your main hard drive (normally C: ) and create a new folder called syslinux. Now download syslinux 3.36 and unzip the contents into the folder you just created.

3) Plug in your USB stick and Format it to Fat32. If windows doesn’t give you this option use this tool to do it with.
When windows picks it up open up Windows explorer and move all the files in the DSL folder onto the USB stick.

4) Now click on Start>Run>CMD

5) In the command window type cd \syslinux\win32 press enter


******WARNING****** This next step is VERY important. Pay attention to the last letter X, X is the USB key what ever you do DON’T put C: in there otherwise you could ruin your hard drive. Do Not type C: or what ever your master Windows Hard drive is letter is (normally is C: )

6) Now type syslinux.exe -ma X: (replace X with your USB drive letter,) and press enter to make the drive bootable. This take 1 second it may seem it hasn’t done anything but trust me it has. Leave the USB key where it is!

7) Leave the USB key in the USB socket and shut down windows.

8) Turn your computer on again and enter the BIOS (normally by pressing Delete) and find the menu that deals with the boot order. You need to set the Boot order so it will boot from the USB stick.

9) Save and exit. Reboot, in about a minutes time you will have your very own Linux desktop and you didn’t have to create a new hard drive partition to do it.

[thebigbossnahhh]

Ubuntu has been nothing but trouble since I started trying it. lol

I've even separated my Hard Drive Space 110 GB for Windows and 110 GB for trying Linux.
But it wont let me just install Ubuntu (Dev) on the 110 GB Partition that I have free for Linux.

I just want to Install it. Last time I installed it, it took all my Space from my Windows Side.
Many formats of C: Drive I have had to endure.

[Code_Knight]

Ubuntu has been nothing but trouble since I started trying it. lol

I've even separated my Hard Drive Space 110 GB for Windows and 110 GB for trying Linux.
But it wont let me just install Ubuntu (Dev) on the 110 GB Partition that I have free for Linux.

I just want to Install it. Last time I installed it, it took all my Space from my Windows Side.
Many formats of C: Drive I have had to endure.

you didn't set up the partitioning right, it should be pretty easy, if Ubuntu has an install anything like Kubuntu, then it's all GUI.

[fatsheep]

Ubuntu has been nothing but trouble since I started trying it. lol

I've even separated my Hard Drive Space 110 GB for Windows and 110 GB for trying Linux.
But it wont let me just install Ubuntu (Dev) on the 110 GB Partition that I have free for Linux.

I just want to Install it. Last time I installed it, it took all my Space from my Windows Side.
Many formats of C: Drive I have had to endure.

Make sure you set up the partitioning right on the Ubuntu installer. You have to select the option to install over the partition you have set up for Linux. By the way, Linux doesn't uses EXT3 so if you set up a partition in a different file format then it probably won't work.

[Freddie]

Ubuntu has been nothing but trouble since I started trying it. lol

I've even separated my Hard Drive Space 110 GB for Windows and 110 GB for trying Linux.
But it wont let me just install Ubuntu (Dev) on the 110 GB Partition that I have free for Linux.

I just want to Install it. Last time I installed it, it took all my Space from my Windows Side.
Many formats of C: Drive I have had to endure.

Ubuntu is bootable from the disk, trying running it from disk and see how you get on.

[Simetrical]

A neat thing about Kubuntu (and all debian based distributions) is that you can install anything without having to look for a file all over the internet. so if I wanted to install firefox, I would just type in the console (program is called konsole): sudo apt-get install firefox
and it would install all the dependencies and the firefox.

gentoo uses the emerge system: emerge firefox

The same is true of all Linux and BSD systems, and probably other Unix-likes (Solaris, etc.). Red Hat-based systems use yum/rpm. You generally don't have to use the command line, though. For instance, in Ubuntu, "Add/Remove Programs" works very nicely, and I'm sure other GUI-friendly distros have similar.

Linux needs no defragmenting. The file system (EXT3) works fine without it, you probably won't even see any benefit from a defrag.

Perhaps more to the point, you can't defrag ext3. It provides no system calls that allow live defragmentation, so the only way to do it is to unmount it; and I don't think there's any program to defragment ext3 even unmounted, without converting it to ext2 first. Last I heard, the recommended method of defragmentation is tarring the filesystem, deleting it, recreating it, and then unpacking the tar file.

If you are a serious programmer then you might want to check out Gentoo or some other distrobution that allows you more control. However, you'll have to spend a lot more time making your operating system work for you.

You can exert just as much control with Ubuntu. It has no objections if you run a custom kernel or whatever.

Yet another advantage of Linux: you don't have to restart very often. If something goes wrong, instead of restarting you can press Ctrl+Alt+Backspace to restart the graphical interface (X). This just shoots you back to the login screen and allows you to start a new session.

You generally don't ever have to restart the entire computer, except for kernel updates. You do occasionally have to restart X, though, which effectively means restarting all applications (except possibly for non-graphical background processes). It's a lot quicker than restarting the computer, however, like ten seconds.

I've sometimes restarted the computer using Linux, but generally I realized afterwards that there was some other way out of the problem. Sometimes the computer locks up (starts thrashing) if too much RAM is used, but Alt-SysRq-F will kill the process using the most memory, stopping the thrashing and giving you control again.

na, dual booting is when you have two different OS on the same hard drive, have two different hard drives is the best way to go (for stability reasons).

Both are called dual booting.

The Windows bootloader can only boot Windows. The Linux bootloader, GRUB, can boot both Windows and Linux. If you're going to dual boot you need GRUB.

There are other Linux boot loaders as well, most notably lilo.

By the way, Linux doesn't uses EXT3 so if you set up a partition in a different file format then it probably won't work.

I assume you mean "uses not "doesn't uses". Linux will work with other filesystems, such as FAT32 and NTFS, but non-Unix filesystems may be a bad idea to use, because they won't necessarily support Unix permissions and other important things.

The Ubuntu installer does a very nice job of repartitioning automatically.

[fatsheep]

Perhaps more to the point, you can't defrag ext3. It provides no system calls that allow live defragmentation, so the only way to do it is to unmount it; and I don't think there's any program to defragment ext3 even unmounted, without converting it to ext2 first. Last I heard, the recommended method of defragmentation is tarring the filesystem, deleting it, recreating it, and then unpacking the tar file.

Really? I downloaded a perl script that did defragment. However, it was pretty pointless.

You can exert just as much control with Ubuntu. It has no objections if you run a custom kernel or whatever.

Well all the applications are pre-compiled in Ubuntu. In Gentoo you get to compile everything yourself. I guess you could do that on Ubuntu too but you'd have to delete just about everything and start over to have a compiled system.

You generally don't ever have to restart the entire computer, except for kernel updates. You do occasionally have to restart X, though, which effectively means restarting all applications (except possibly for non-graphical background processes). It's a lot quicker than restarting the computer, however, like ten seconds.

Yeah, I think kernel updates are the only time you really need to restart. They

There are other Linux boot loaders as well, most notably lilo.

True. GRUB seems to be the standard though. What distributions use Lilo now (by default)? Red Hat?

I assume you mean "uses not "doesn't uses". Linux will work with other filesystems, such as FAT32 and NTFS, but non-Unix filesystems may be a bad idea to use, because they won't necessarily support Unix permissions and other important things.

Yeah that's what I meant. I didn't realize you could run Linux with NTFS or FAT32. EXT3 is the most commonly used that I know of though.

[Simetrical]

Really? I downloaded a perl script that did defragment. However, it was pretty pointless.

Well, one approach to "defragmenting" ext3 is to copy the file and delete the old copy, check if the new version is less fragmented, and if not, try again. I suppose you could call that defragmenting, but it's kind of roundabout.

Well all the applications are pre-compiled in Ubuntu. In Gentoo you get to compile everything yourself. I guess you could do that on Ubuntu too but you'd have to delete just about everything and start over to have a compiled system.

In Gentoo things aren't precompiled by default, but they're still compiled automatically. Installing just takes a bit longer.

In Ubuntu, you don't have to delete anything to compile things. For instance, I compile Wine nightly from git rather than using packages. Things you compile yourself go into /usr/local/bin instead of /usr/bin, and since that comes earlier in $PATH, they silently override the packaged version if you have that installed. I've also compiled a version of gparted to test a fix for a bug I was seeing, and that worked the same. Compiled and packaged copies of a program will happily coexist.

Yeah, I think kernel updates are the only time you really need to restart. They

They what?

True. GRUB seems to be the standard though. What distributions use Lilo now (by default)? Red Hat?

Well, the TWC server (RHEL 5) uses GRUB, it seems. LILO is the older one, you're right. My Linux Administration Handbook says Debian still uses LILO.

Yeah that's what I meant. I didn't realize you could run Linux with NTFS or FAT32. EXT3 is the most commonly used that I know of though.

The Linux has read/write support for NTFS as of the 2.6 kernel, and FAT32 has been supported forever. However, I'm not sure if Unix permissions will work properly on those if you use them as your basic filesystem. Certainly you can use ReiserFS or XFS, and others like UFS and the Minix filesystem are supported and probably usable.

[Tankbuster]

Well, I think Linux is a really good operating system, but frankly, Windows XP does everything I want it to do, and does it fast enough, so that's why I'm not taking the plunge into Linux...

But I do wonder whether I should take the plunge into Linux or Vista on my new laptop.

[Thor the Bassist]

But I do wonder whether I should take the plunge into Linux or Vista on my new laptop.

My new laptop is going to dual boot Linux and XP. I'd recommend that as you can use the quicker Linux for work/school etc but still boot up for games.