At last, Türkiye changed infamous 301 law article

[white-wolf]

At last, Türkiye changed infamous 301 law. It was a staple for Turkey's EU negotations.

The Goverment did changed the law after very long discussions at the Parliment. Please note; the goverment (which makes the most modern and democratic reforms in the Turkey for EU) is accused for bringing "Sheria Law" and "to try to change the democratic and secular regime". It is in the stage for try by Instutional Judge(sp?) for closure.

Link :
bbc

from the link:
"Under the reformed law:

• It will be a crime to insult the Turkish nation, rather than Turkishness. (so the term is clear now - note by me)
• The justice minister will be required to open each case. (hopefully the law will be cease to be a toy under Ulusalcis' hands - note by me)
• The maximum sentence will be two years (6 months to 2 years - note by me) in jail, rather than three (Judges can change the punishment to money or can freeze punishment if the punisment is less than 2 years - note by me)"

[Shaun]

I still don't see why a state which has laws against insulting the nation has any business in being in the EU.

[Crimson Scythe]

I still don't see why a state which has laws against insulting the nation has any business in being in the EU.

Don't European countries have anti-defamation laws? Because that's exactly what Article 301 was supposed to be, albeit a fairly harsh one. The problem was that ambiguity in its wording allowed it to be exploited by nationalist lawyers for their own purposes. A problem that has now hopefully been corrected (especially given the second bullet in the first post here).

[danzig]

Well as shown in the Chinese thread one can flip it quite easily to make an "insult to Turkish government " mean anything anyone wants it to mean...so bottom line not nearly enough to clear a hurdle for EU membership. I also wish my own government would stop pushing for Turkey to be admitted into it, they dont belong in the EU.

[Georgy Zhukov]

" . . . and another one bites the dust"

[Kiljan Arslan]

Thanks for changing the law but why do you want to join the EU anyways?

[white-wolf]

Thanks for changing the law but why do you want to join the EU anyways?

For a better future for our children?

[danzig]

For a better future for our children?

And that is going to start at home not from joining an organization/group that for better or worse doesnt really want Turkey to join anyway.

[white-wolf]

And that is going to start at home not from joining an organization/group that for better or worse doesnt really want Turkey to join anyway.

Actually I do not want EU membership. What I want is EU laws and infrastructure will be implemented to my country. I do not believe EU will accept Turkey's membership anyway, because in the backs of their brain they still think Turkey is "the other" to be afraid.

[danzig]

Actually I do not want EU membership. What I want is EU laws and infrastructure will be implemented to my country. I do not believe EU will accept Turkey's membership anyway, because in the backs of their brain they still think Turkey is "the other" to be afraid.

Well it is partially justified since Turkey would be 2nd largest country in the EU instantly and from a country that despite being a NATO ally has a rather different culture, society then the rest of Europe people are going to be wary.

[Erik]

I do not believe EU will accept Turkey's membership anyway, because in the backs of their brain they still think Turkey is "the other" to be afraid.

(Many) European citizens are afraid of Turkey, think they are "different", and don't want them in the EU.
But the vast majority of bureaucrats at the EU really do want Turkey to join because it will make the EU more powerful, especially military.

And guess what: EU Citizens have no say in this matter.

Can't actually remember the name of the countries that have it but there was an article about laws in various European countries that have the same kind of laws. Turks are not the only ones to have such a law.

I think these countries have:

Germany: Article 90-b
Holland: Article 111, 113, 131, 132, and 137
Italy: Article 290, Criminal Code
Austria: Article 248, Criminal Code

As for Holland:
Atricle 111 and 113 are about insulting the King/Queen and his/her husband/wife.
Article 131 and 132 are about inciting other people to commit a (violent) crime.
And article 137 provides an exception to article 135/136: the obligation to report any planned terrorist attack, military treason, murder or kidnapping you know of to the police/officials. (this has nothing to do with this debate)

Nothing about insulting the country or "Dutchness".
The law against insulting our Queen/King is perhaps silly and archaic, but the Monarchy has no political power in the Netherlands anymore, so this law doesn't have anything like the impact on society that the Turkish "301" has.

Christianity, other than what is in our culture, plays no role in other parties than the Christian Democrats. There are some large CD parties in Europe, Germany being the most obvious example. Anyway the faith it self matters little or not at all for most of our heathen politicans.

Christian Democrats are the largest party in many, if not most, EU members.
And they are usually a lot more religion orientated than the Turkish "AK" party.

Yeah, but then again... why would you want to be something your not? Your not european and you dont have to be european. Do turks really want to be recognized as europeans? And Im talking about the average turk, living in turkey.

The Kemalist want Turkey to be European.
And speaking against them and their ideals is still illegal in Turkey ('cos that's what 301 is really about), so who cares what the average Turks wants?

Like the EU citizens, the Turkish people have no vote in this.
This is between Kemalist military commanders and EU bureaucrats.

[Каие]

And that is going to start at home not from joining an organization/group that for better or worse doesnt really want Turkey to join anyway.

Hardly seeing as only Austria and recently France don;t want them in.

[removeduser_487563287433]

Doesn't seem to go far enough at all.

[Turk]

everything what we do for EU is unecessary and useless

[Duke_of_Bavaria]

I still don't see what business Turkey has in the EU...

[Last Roman]

well, technically, part of it IS in Europe.

[Duke_of_Bavaria]

A minor part, and they aren't Europeans anyway so gg bye.

[Kiljan Arslan]

A minor part, and they aren't Europeans anyway so gg bye.

Why arn't they "Europeans"?

[Duke_of_Bavaria]

Why arn't they "Europeans"?

lol? Are you serious?

[Holger Danske]

Why arn't they "Europeans"?

Because only a minor part of their land is geograhpicly part of Europe, and their culture is very dissimilar from the rest of Europe... It would make a lot more sense for them to establish a union with their fellow muslims, but I guess Turks and Arabs don't mix very well either.