Hoplites Guard Mode Question

[Phalanx300]

I was wondering why the hoplites are standard in guard mode?? It only gives them less pushing power and makes them less likely to win a fight. And with guard mode on your units will be pretty easily envelloped. Any chance that it will be standard off for RS2??

[century x]

Do you mean the AI will have it in guard mode or your units.
If its your units. Just click the guard mode button off.

[Phalanx300]

Well, mostly the AI since I could probably change it myself . But I noticed that with guard mode off that the hoplites fight much better, they push better and are more deadly.

[MarcusTullius]

Well, mostly the AI since I could probably change it myself . But I noticed that with guard mode off that the hoplites fight much better, they push better and are more deadly.

Although they wont hold their lines as strong and so leave the line vulernable to gaps in the formation

[Nellup]

In general, if you are attacking, you want guard mode off, if you are defending, you want guard mode on.


The exception is if you are attacking more than one stack, in which case it is more of a case of an aggressive defense. So I'd put guard mode on.

[Phalanx300]

Although they wont hold their lines as strong and so leave the line vulernable to gaps in the formation

Well, thats a possibility but now its almost a guarantee that you got these unit blocks forming which are facing the wrong way and will be envelopped and it will only be a matter of time before they will be broken from the front, with guard mode off they atleast stand a chance and theres less chance of being envelopped. And not to say that they kill more men then .

[MarcusTullius]

Well, thats a possibility but now its almost a guarantee that you got these unit blocks forming which are facing the wrong way and will be envelopped and it will only be a matter of time before they will be broken from the front, with guard mode off they atleast stand a chance and theres less chance of being envelopped. And not to say that they kill more men then .

When i fight with hoplite units, i tend to use guard mode first when being engaged, or even when engaging to intially hold the line. Then i turn it off to turn my forces into a more potent attacking force. Also gives me time to flank the enmey and manoveur with other troops.

[Phalanx300]

Yeah that would be best as the human player, but the AI isn't that clever , so I think that it would be best to make the AI using hoplites deadlier by turning guard mode off by default .

[Lucius Tiberius Vorenus]

I always start all my troops, other than cavalry, in guard mode. In my opinion you want all your troops to remain in formation, until you "release" them(by taking guard off) to actively engage and or pursue.

Granted, guard mode is mostly geared for defending, however, when the fog of war kicks in, and you can't effectively see what every single unit is doing, you dont want unobserved troops breaking formation early in the battle to pursue cavalry or fleeing enemies:

EX:
In the attack your flanking enemy archers/peltasts from the far left with your cavalry and general, meanwhile out of view, your right flank gets hit by enemy cavalry, you cannot always see what the rest of the line is doing... you want those troops on your right flank to remain in formation, especially if they repel or route the attacking cavalry, thus guard mode.

This is especially key for the center of your line. You dont want to be off on the flank dealing with enemy cav or infantry, only to feturn to your center and find your center line is pursuing broken enemy, thus leaving your center totally exposed.

I only take guard mode OFF if i'm directly commanding those units, or if I command a unit or units to attack.



Another effective use of guard mode when in the defense. If your entire line is engaged and flanks are relatively stable, leave your troops in guard mode until the enemy line becomes fatigued. If you will notice while in guard mode, usually only your front rank is fighting. You will usually find your troops still "fresh" even after being engaged for quite some time, while the enemy is fatigued. If you can wait until that moment, then release your entire line at once, direct them to attack specific units, all along the line, your troops will usually surge and start a savage push with fresh troops into a fatigued and wavering enemy. At this moment move your cav or fast moving infantry to the flanks and rear, many enemy at this point will break.

Guad mode is totally situational, but it's best in my opinion to have it set as default before every battle for all infantry. There's nothing worse then coming back to your center, or flank, after dealing with a critical situation elsewhere, only to find 3 or 4 of your infantry units one to two hundred meters away from your army pursuiing fleeing enemy.

If you've ever tried a major battle using the General Cam view, you'll learn to love guard mode in a vast majority of situations.

[Phalanx300]

Yeah, as a player you can make good use of guard mode but if it stays on all time then its quite worthless, as the AI can't turn it of while in the battle, can it??? =/

[The God of War]

Phalanx300 ..... a Spartan lover ..... at last a companion amidst all the Romans !!!!! I also notice that it is better to use Spartans in columns of 7 men width and on a loose formation ..... this doesn't not change their appearance but allows them to turn and face the enemy instead of dutifully standing in the formation no matter what !!!! This tactic is a great offensive and the 7 men width lowers casualties caused by missile troops and at the same time give a greater depth to the ranks which not only gives greater pushing ability but also protect the so-called vulnerable flanks !!!

I used the tight formation button when the safety of my flanks are assured and on a defensive role !!!!! true Spartan strength is in the depth of its ranks, but believe me a column of 7 men wide is the ideal width you don't want any less nor any more !!!! With the above mentioned loose formation I managed to beat the Praetorian cohort with about 13 hoplites remaining and 8 cured leaving a total of 20 !!! A very good result as Spartans normally get whooped (biased of course) by the Romans !!!!

If you have gained any knowledge from Spartans from your side please do share !!! I am looking forward to improving the performance of Spartans !!!!

[Oli]

Phalanx300 ..... a Spartan lover ..... at last a companion amidst all the Romans !!!!! I also notice that it is better to use Spartans in columns of 7 men width and on a loose formation ..... this doesn't not change their appearance but allows them to turn and face the enemy instead of dutifully standing in the formation no matter what !!!! This tactic is a great offensive and the 7 men width lowers casualties caused by missile troops and at the same time give a greater depth to the ranks which not only gives greater pushing ability but also protect the so-called vulnerable flanks !!!

I used the tight formation button when the safety of my flanks are assured and on a defensive role !!!!! true Spartan strength is in the depth of its ranks, but believe me a column of 7 men wide is the ideal width you don't want any less nor any more !!!! With the above mentioned loose formation I managed to beat the Praetorian cohort with about 13 hoplites remaining and 8 cured leaving a total of 20 !!! A very good result as Spartans normally get whooped (biased of course) by the Romans !!!!

If you have gained any knowledge from Spartans from your side please do share !!! I am looking forward to improving the performance of Spartans !!!!

For underlined problem, this, i think, is caused by leaving your troops on guard mode, switch off that and they'll react to the danger. However, it sounds like loose formation is working for you so maybe just stick with it and take my advice with a pinch of salt

[The God of War]

13+8=21!
Enough of maths,
For underlined problem, this, i think, is caused by leaving your troops on guard mode, switch off that and they'll react to the danger. However, it sounds like loose formation is working for you so maybe just stick with it and take my advice with a pinch of salt (apart from the maths advice, im sure its sounds, if not just ask nellup he knows his maths!)

dude all i m tryin to do is share my knowledge wid u folks u want it take it u dont have too !!! i m not forcin u !!! hope u look at the bright side of my advice or just overlook it !!!

later man !!!

[Oli]

gez man should i apologize to u for a small miscalculation !!! i m sorry Oli my miscaculation could have shut down this forum ... geez what was I thinking (observe note of sarcasm) !!! And apparently 8 and 7 are next to each other on the keyboard, so my fingers simply slipped okay??? dude all i m tryin to do is share my knowledge wid u folks u want it take it u dont have too !!! i m not forcin u .... why the offenses man .... chill !!! hope u look at the bright side of my advice or just overlook it rather than scrutinize the math!!!

Oh and for your sake professor:

13+8 =21
13+8 =21
13+8 =21
13+8 =21
13+8 =21
13+8 =21
13+8 =21
13+8 =21
13+8 =21
13+8 =21

I have even submitted my imposition .... happy now dude !!! I hope the next time we'd be chatting on this forum not as enemies !!! later man !!!

hmmm ok kindly take note of your own advice, for as you can see i ended the maths debate on the second line of my post and then offered my advice. im sure most people here would agree that u were being more offensive in what you posted. However as you clearly feel i have offended you, i have edited my post so u no longer feel belittled.

Also as you can tell i used the edit, which also helps to deal with double posting

[The God of War]

hmmm ok kindly take note of your own advice, for as you can see i ended the maths debate on the second line of my post and then offered my advice. im sure most people here would agree that u were being more offensive in what you posted. However as you clearly feel i have offended you, i have edited my post so u no longer feel belittled.

Also as you can tell i used the edit, which also helps to deal with double posting

so have I, I may be a spartan lover but I am not that aggressive !!! I apologize for taking the fight to another level and have edited my post as well !!! so I guess we're friends now !!!

[Phalanx300]

Ah, another Spartan fan . I also search for the improvement of the Spartans, as the Spartans will now get their own faction I just want that everything is right . Thanks for that information, so 7 ranks deep and loose formation with guard mode on?? I'm gonna try that, sry but I don't haven't gained some serious knowledge. I'm just getting into this mod to get a bit of a feel how it is since I'm waiting for RS2 to play as Sparta . I have only noticed that hoplites do better and have more pushing power when off of guardmode.

[The God of War]

oh the loose formation is just for fights on the offensive and against the legions of rome .... gives spartans better manouverability !!!

[The God of War]

no i was just wondering when the next version of rs would release !!! i m a true addict !!!

[century x]

no i was just wondering when the next version of rs would release !!! i m a true addict !!!

Well so AM I. But that has been a heated debate amoung this forum. One of the members of the team has said it will be out on April 31.

[The God of War]

Well so AM I. But that has been a heated debate amoung this forum. One of the members of the team has said it will be out on April 31.

thanks mate