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  1. #1
    Vampire's Avatar Semisalis
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    Default French extremists islamists go to jihad in Iraq

    French extremists dream of jihad in Iraq

    By ANGELA CHARLTON, Associated Press Writer
    Sun Mar 30, 7:39 PM ET

    PARIS - Boubakeur el Hakim traded his Paris neighborhood of boulangeries and halal butcher shops for the insurgent camps of Iraq. When he came home, he told his war stories to other young men on the forgotten edges of French society, allegedly persuading some to follow in his footsteps.

    His younger brother did, and died fighting U.S. forces.

    After years of investigation by French authorities, el Hakim, 24, went on trial this month in a case exposing how the Iraq war has sucked radical youths from Europe to a battlefield where they have learned skills that officials fear may one day be used in domestic terror attacks.

    Along with four other young Frenchmen, a Moroccan and an Algerian, el Hakim is accused of funneling French Muslim fighters to Iraq. All the Frenchmen except suspected ringleader Farid Benyettou, 26, have acknowledged going to Iraq or planning to go. All deny inciting others to go.

    All seven men are accused of criminal association with a terrorist enterprise, a vague charge that carries a maximum 10-year sentence, though the prosecutor only asked for between three and eight years.

    The case is a delicate one in France, which strongly opposed the U.S.-led campaign in Iraq but has long struggled against homegrown terrorism. It also highlights a dilemma in many European nations with growing Muslim populations: Cracking down hard risks alienating or radicalizing moderate Muslims and betraying western ideals of tolerance.

    The suspected nucleus of the network, janitor-turned-street preacher Benyettou, told the court the case against him was "fantasy" and an affront to his freedom of speech. He told the judge he had served only as a friendly ear to young people in his neighborhood, answering questions about Islam that went ignored by France's secular schools and institutions.

    In one interrogation session with anti-terrorist agents, however, Benyettou said: "I taught that suicide attacks are legitimate under Islam."

    "Jihad is justified," he said in another session in the days following his January 2005 arrest, according to the depositions viewed by The Associated Press.


    El Hakim described placing and detonating roadside bombs with equipment that resembled a cordless phone, the transcript of one deposition says. He claimed 10 American troops were killed in the last three operations he took part in, it says.

    In a French radio interview broadcast from Baghdad in 2003, he urged Parisian friends to join him on the battlefields. "I'm ready to set off dynamite and boom! Boom! We kill all the Americans!" he said on RTL radio.

    In court, while he didn't deny his radio appeal, el Hakim said some of his statements to police were made under duress and that his role in Iraq was primarily "humanitarian."

    Investigators say the alleged network funneled about a dozen French fighters to camps linked to al-Qaida in Iraq head Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, and sought to send more before he was killed in a U.S. airstrike in 2006. At least seven French insurgents have died, some in suicide bombings, police say.

    The classified case file could fill a suitcase. It includes transcripts of taped phone conversations; suspects' family trees; extremist Islamic sermons; excerpts from a Web site explaining how to use Kalashnikov rifles; and grainy images of dozens of people questioned in the case.

    Since the group was dismantled in 2005, young French Muslims wanting to fight abroad have largely steered clear of such organized cells, according to a senior French police official not authorized to be named publicly because of agency policy. Instead, youths are heading to war zones individually, to better avoid detection.

    The key concern for French police is not where the fighters go but what they do when they come back to France, home to Europe's largest Muslim population, nearly 10 percent of its 62 million people.

    There has been no mention in the Paris trial of any plan to attack French sites, but officials say they remain worried about the possibility — and that fear bolsters the prosecutor's case.

    The so-called 19th arrondissement network is named for the Paris district where it was based, a multi-national neighborhood where families with roots in one-time French colonies in North Africa crowd into housing projects that rise above street markets offering Moroccan melons and pungent French cheese.

    Frustration among youth of immigrant backgrounds over discrimination and bleak job prospects helped fuel riots in suburban housing projects around France in 2005. That same frustration, defense lawyer Dominique Many said, pushes some toward Islamic extremism.

    Benyettou practiced a strict Salafist interpretation of Islam, and enjoyed credibility among radicals because his brother-in-law was a convicted member of an Algerian insurgency movement.

    Benyettou exhibited little charisma during the trial, his gaunt frame hunched on the bench, occasionally brushing back his chest-length hair or nudging up his oversized glasses.

    But back in the 19th arrondissement, he persuaded — by his own admission to investigators — about 10 young people to leave France for Iraq. In court, he acknowledged he had had "a role" in helping fighters who wanted to go to Iraq, but said there was no organized network.

    "I really believed in the idea," said one of his students, defendant Cherif Kouachi, 25. He said he was motivated by his outrage at television images of torture of Iraqi inmates at the U.S. prison at Abu Ghraib.

    Another alleged member of the group, Peter Cherif, was arrested by U.S. authorities and his mother says he was held in Abu Ghraib. He faces a separate trial in France.

    Another, 25-year-old Mohammed El Ayouni, who lost an arm and an eye in 2004 in a U.S. tank shelling near Fallujah, described administering IVs and shots to injured fighters and keeping watch for American troops. He said Iraqi families welcomed the French fighters, preparing their meals and laundering their clothes.

    The fighters said they traveled through Syria first, taking Arabic lessons and getting basic weapons training.

    When Boubakeur's brother Redouane el Hakim was killed in July 2004 — found in an insurgent hideout in Fallujah bombarded by U.S. forces — his mother organized a memorial celebration of her son's martyrdom, according to court documents and two defense lawyers on the case.

    It was American authorities who first confirmed the presence of French citizens among Iraqi insurgents, judicial documents show.

    Other European countries have also fed fighters to Iraq.

    Two men considered linked to Europe's deadliest Islamic terror attack, the 2004 bombings in Madrid, are believed to have later killed themselves in suicide attacks in Iraq. Spanish authorities have arrested dozens of people suspected of recruiting Islamic fighters for the Iraq insurgency.

    Italian courts have convicted several North Africans of recruiting militants for Iraq in Italy in recent years.

    ____

    Associated Press writers Ingrid Rousseau in Paris and Daniel Woolls in Madrid contributed to this report
    I would say this is somewhat a good news in the meaning that we get rid of some idiots but also it make me wander if we don't face a future danger like the French police says:
    The key concern for French police is not where the fighters go but what they do when they come back to France, home to Europe's largest Muslim population, nearly 10 percent of its 62 million people.
    To the end this make me wonder if Geert Wilders is somewhat right in his movie, to the end he is just pointing to the parts from Koran on which the terorists are basing their ideology.
    None are so blind as those who refuse to see!
    None are so deaf as those who refuse to hear!
    None are so hopelessly enslaved as those who falsley believe they are free!

  2. #2
    boofhead's Avatar Dux Limitis
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    Default Re: French extremists islamists go to jihad in Iraq

    where they have learned skills that officials fear may one day be used in domestic terror attacks.
    FFS you don't need to join Al-Qaeda to learn how to blow up, that's ridiculous. I know how to make all sorts of bombs, napalm, and how to have someone's car explode when they turn the ignition, and I'm just a country boy from Australia. I even know how to turn your exhaust pipe into a flame-thrower.

    But yes indeed, Wilders IS 'somewhat right' in his movie, as long as one is aware that he speaking of the Koranic interpretation radicals like that al Hakim :wub: have.

  3. #3
    Heinz Guderian's Avatar *takes off trousers
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    Default Re: French extremists islamists go to jihad in Iraq

    at OP@: silly jihadi kids, always up to some sort of shenanigans, little scamps.

    Terrorism. Terrorism. Terrorism. Terrorism. Terrorism. Terrorism. Al Aqaeda. Terrorism. Terrorism. Terrorism. Terrorism. Terrorism. French. Terrorism. Rape. Terrorism. Terrorism. Brown People. Terrorism. Terrorism.

    Now i'm good for the day. Better check up under my Beemer before i set off mind.
    Last edited by Heinz Guderian; April 01, 2008 at 02:32 AM.




  4. #4

    Default Re: French extremists islamists go to jihad in Iraq

    Cracking down hard risks alienating or radicalizing moderate Muslims and betraying western ideals of tolerance.
    lol

    10 years max is a joke

  5. #5

    Default Re: French extremists islamists go to jihad in Iraq

    So long as they dont go and kill innocent civilians in Iraq I encourage more of them to go and free the country. But, sadly Im very sure they are just gonna cause more civilian deaths there. So no more amateur freedom fighters wannabes please.


    "When one person suffers from a delusion it is called insanity. When many people suffer from a delusion it is called religion." -- Robert Pirsig

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  6. #6

    Default Re: French extremists islamists go to jihad in Iraq

    So long as they dont go and kill innocent civilians in Iraq I encourage more of them to go and free the country. But, sadly Im very sure they are just gonna cause more civilian deaths there. So no more amateur freedom fighters wannabes please.
    Already as free as it is going to get, but if they will go to Iraq and protect the civilians from themselves...

    Let's just hope they were fascist communist kittens who were on their way to international fascist communist fair.

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    boofhead's Avatar Dux Limitis
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    Default Re: French extremists islamists go to jihad in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by jankren View Post
    So long as they dont go and kill innocent civilians in Iraq I encourage more of them to go and free the country. But, sadly Im very sure they are just gonna cause more civilian deaths there. So no more amateur freedom fighters wannabes please.
    Can I ask what you are doing enjoying the benefits of American society while seemingly simultaneously cheering for the killing of it's citizens, i.e. troops?

  8. #8
    Lawrence of Arabia's Avatar Citizen
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    Default Re: French extremists islamists go to jihad in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by boofhead View Post
    Can I ask what you are doing enjoying the benefits of American society while seemingly simultaneously cheering for the killing of it's citizens, i.e. troops?
    I would wonder the same thing since he's in Indonesia.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vampire
    To the end this make me wonder if Geert Wilders is somewhat right in his movie, to the end he is just pointing to the parts from Koran on which the terorists are basing their ideology.
    He is right only in that there are people who use the Qur'an to justify atrocities. Little else, if nothing, was true.
    Quote Originally Posted by Empi Rapper View Post
    Go on Farnan, go and help those despicable thugs you call our soldiers to kill some of the poorest people on the planet.
    Quote Originally Posted by Empi Rapper View Post
    Don't you realize that it is a good thing that so many British soldiers have already been killed as punishment for the invasion?


  9. #9
    boofhead's Avatar Dux Limitis
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    Default Re: French extremists islamists go to jihad in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Lawrence of Arabia View Post
    I would wonder the same thing since he's in Indonesia.
    Wrong. He's studying in the US now.

    If you don't like it jankren, go home.

  10. #10

    Default Re: French extremists islamists go to jihad in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by boofhead View Post
    Wrong. He's studying in the US now.

    If you don't like it jankren, go home.
    What? You aint making no sense yo.

    Yes, it is a fact unlike the occupation of Afghanistan, I dont like the illegal occupation of Iraq. And even countless American citizens themselves share similar opinion.

    By the way, I did not call for the killing of American troops. But I do support the liberation of Iraq and anyone who intends to help to make that come true they have my support so long as it wont cause even more civilian deaths than right now thoug Im sure these stupid French kids are probably just gonna do exactly that, which is killing even more innocent lives.

    After 5 years, the presence of foreign troops in Iraq only cause more and more deaths. Its time for them to either go back home to their families or get deployed to Afghanistan where liberation in the true meaning is needed.
    Last edited by jankren; April 03, 2008 at 01:09 AM.


    "When one person suffers from a delusion it is called insanity. When many people suffer from a delusion it is called religion." -- Robert Pirsig

    "Feminists are silent when the bills arrive." -- Aetius

    "Women have made a pact with the devil — in return for the promise of exquisite beauty, their window to this world of lavish male attention is woefully brief." -- Some Guy

  11. #11

    Default Re: French extremists islamists go to jihad in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by jankren View Post
    So long as they dont go and kill innocent civilians in Iraq I encourage more of them to go and free the country.
    wtf so youre encouraging the deaths of US troops
    Last edited by misfitsfiend138; April 01, 2008 at 12:37 PM.


  12. #12
    Lawrence of Arabia's Avatar Citizen
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    Default Re: French extremists islamists go to jihad in Iraq

    Ah, my mistake then. Even so, he's welcome to his opinion even though, if what you and I interpreted is what he meant, I vehemently disagree with it. Especially considering that I might very well be one of those soldiers over there.
    Quote Originally Posted by Empi Rapper View Post
    Go on Farnan, go and help those despicable thugs you call our soldiers to kill some of the poorest people on the planet.
    Quote Originally Posted by Empi Rapper View Post
    Don't you realize that it is a good thing that so many British soldiers have already been killed as punishment for the invasion?


  13. #13
    kambiz's Avatar Ordinarius
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    Default Re: French extremists islamists go to jihad in Iraq

    jankren I think the biggest threat to Iraqies are themselves ! Can you tell me what Iraqies need that they don't have now?




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    boofhead's Avatar Dux Limitis
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    Default Re: French extremists islamists go to jihad in Iraq

    I may have made an error of judgment in that statement beforehand.

    I apologize, jankren.

  15. #15

    Default Re: French extremists islamists go to jihad in Iraq

    And? There were Frenchmen who Participated in Rwandan genocide, no one group is really innocent.

  16. #16

    Default Re: French extremists islamists go to jihad in Iraq

    DAMN MUSLIMS! GOOD FOR NOTHING!

    Of the approximately 5 million Muslims in France, a good dozen have fought for Iraqi terrorists. But this is one of Vampire's threads, so what more can you expect than mass stereotyping and xenophobia.
    Last edited by removeduser_426582376423734; April 01, 2008 at 06:26 AM.

  17. #17

    Default Re: French extremists islamists go to jihad in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Shyam Popat View Post
    DAMN MUSLIMS! GOOD FOR NOTHING!

    Of the approximately 5 million Muslims in France, a good dozen have fought for Iraqi terrorists. But this is one of Vampire's threads, so what more can you expect than mass stereotyping and xenophobia.
    I might add that 100s of 1000s fought for, and indeed died for France in two World Wars and a Franco-Prussian War.



    There does seem to be a lot of obscure anti-Muslim porn about, do people get paid for writing this stuff?
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  18. #18

    Default Re: French extremists islamists go to jihad in Iraq

    Burnum : There were Frenchmen who Participated in Rwandan genocide
    Really ? Tell me more.

    I thought France was the only country that cared enough to try to do something with the Turquoise Operation. Granted, late, but that's still better than nothing.

  19. #19

    Default Re: French extremists islamists go to jihad in Iraq

    @Shyam Its 3 millions, and its including people just born from muslim parents.
    Most muslims in france are as secular as jewish or christians (and sometimes more ...) so i'm 100% with you

    @Krips2 its not very clear what happened, but France is accuses of being accomplice to the genocide in Rwanda. We still dont really know what happened (and since both sides tried to exterminate the other side then anyone engaged there would be an accomplice)

  20. #20

    Default Re: French extremists islamists go to jihad in Iraq

    Sub-standard ansaar are not what the ummah requires.

    Qaidat al-jihad fi al-Iraq are NOT well trained, they are, infact, lacking in innovation and common sense, as well as any concept of morality and possibly, literacy as well.

    If the French join the Jihad we'll loose our street cred and have to surrender in a few days .

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