most annoying

**~~candle_86~~** · March 20, 2008, 09:39 PM

I was ordered by the pope to stop aggression verse denmark, so i sent a diplomat to there king to request a cease fire, he turned me down, then seiged one of my cities and when i fought back to defend i was excomunicated. And then 3 turns later a Crusade was called on Edinbourgh. I dont freakin understand this at all. I tried to stop the war. I need 3 more cities this campign to win.

**gambit** · March 20, 2008, 09:42 PM

If you only fight in self defense (attacking a besieging enemy) he shouldn't excommunicate you. As long as you're the defender, the pope's agression should be focused on denmark.

**NobleNick** · March 24, 2008, 02:29 PM

Originally Posted by Gambit

If you only fight in self defense (attacking a besieging enemy) he shouldn't excommunicate you. As long as you're the defender, the pope's agression should be focused on denmark.

Hmm... I thought I saw a thread a ways back which was started because someone sallied against an enemy which the Pope had said he should not attack, and he got excommunicated for it. IIRC, the advice given was that a sally was seen by the Pope as an offensive gesture.

Well, no worries now, as the Byzantine empire does not need to kiss up to the Pope.

**~~candle_86~~** · March 20, 2008, 09:44 PM

well i did get it. I think its cause i sent my stack from hamburg over to Antwerp where they where seiging and attacked there flanks. Im wonder if it has something to do with a Danish pope

**Ruprecht** · March 20, 2008, 09:50 PM

Hey,

When you get the ''cease hostilities'' mission from the pope, That doesen't mean you should send a diplomat to arrange a ceasfire. Just don't attack them for the remainder of turns.

I have found it quite common for the pope to ask me to take a settlement of a faction that he also told me to cease hostilities with at the same time.

Even if they still attack you, just let them sally forth and you will not be considered breaching the cease hostilities mission/contract.

Hope that is of some help

**~~candle_86~~** · March 20, 2008, 10:02 PM

well im about to end the problem once and for all, the last papal state is rome. I checked the map to make sure, and ive got 5 stacks sitting right outside it, time to kill the pope and end this foolishness.

**BlackBart213** · March 20, 2008, 10:06 PM

Originally Posted by candle_86

well im about to end the problem once and for all, the last papal state is rome. I checked the map to make sure, and ive got 5 stacks sitting right outside it, time to kill the pope and end this foolishness.

I suggest first giving him the island of Ajaccio or some worthless territory before taking Rome. Don't kill the Pope, let him escape. But take Rome, and leave him in Ajaccio. He'll leave you alone then.

**Ruprecht** · March 20, 2008, 10:19 PM

Originally Posted by candle_86

well im about to end the problem once and for all, the last papal state is rome. I checked the map to make sure, and ive got 5 stacks sitting right outside it, time to kill the pope and end this foolishness.

It sounds like you really hate the guy after all the shanadigans he put you through and i can't blame you. ^^

But if this is not the case, maybe just give him any surplus regions you have and a modest amount of florins for rome and let the old bugger go in peace.

**Big E** · March 21, 2008, 11:39 PM

Originally Posted by candle_86

well im about to end the problem once and for all, the last papal state is rome. I checked the map to make sure, and ive got 5 stacks sitting right outside it, time to kill the pope and end this foolishness.

Well if you kill him...everyone hates you and the Pope comes back anyway. Next time the pope calls this mission do this:

1. Wait till the time is up (Be like Gandhi and use peace instead of hate lol)
2. During your wait build up a huge army and send spies into the enemies bases to find out which settlement is the most valueable that you can reach in a couple of turns beofre they can predict a attack.
3. After the time is up send the army is as quick as possible and take their valueable settlement. Your enemy will be enraged and the Pope will of course call a ceasefire between the two of you again. What most people dont realize is your enemies can also be excommincated if they dont listen. So chill out and get ready to defend against your anrgy neighbor.
4. As he is attacking you and you repel him eventually the pope will have to excommincate him. (A better way to get on the Pope's good side also is to send a diplomat and give Papal States money....even 500 florines would put you on the top of the Pope Bff's list lol)
5. SO once the pope favors you, your enemies will look bad to him for attacking you. They get excommincated and you are able to legally attack them without disruption (keep in mind you can call crusade against them also which ruins everything for your enemy....and you get brownie points for winning a crusade also)

Its a long process but once you get the hang of it, you won't even notice the whole process you have to go through

**Vision1984** · March 22, 2008, 10:12 PM

I am using LTC right now with version 1.2. It makes no sense when I am France and Spain, Denmark and Milan keeps sieging me and I keep defeating them but as soon as I siege them the pope threatens to excommunicate me. I hope this gets fixed soon. This even happens when I have higher papal points than the enemies. I also lose points when I attack a besieging army. It really angers me sometimes as it happens all the time. Rarely do other factions get excommunicated for attacking me.

The good thing is though is that I took Rome, immediately got excommunicated and then won the new papal election as I had about 9 cardinals and got full papal points.

**~~candle_86~~** · March 21, 2008, 12:45 AM

no i took rome, the papal states cease to exist. I also took spain and The Holy Roman Empire while ive been away, me saking rome seemed to piss them off

**BlackBart213** · March 21, 2008, 02:06 PM

Originally Posted by candle_86

no i took rome, the papal states cease to exist. I also took spain and The Holy Roman Empire while ive been away, me saking rome seemed to piss them off

If you play long enough, the Pope will return.

**Kennylz** · March 21, 2008, 01:05 AM

The papal states as a political force never cease to exist. There is always a pope, no matter how many you kill.

Also, you were excommunicated for sending a stack outside the beseiged city to attack the attackers. The Pope, with his lack of reason, doesn't see this as a defensive move and instead sees an army on the offensive, so you were excommed.

If you had otherwise just defended with the army you had inside, and just positioned that flanking army right beside the enemy so that they would be on the battle-map as reinforcements, then you'd of been fine.

Also, you don't need ceasefires for cease hostilities. You can also send a diplomat with a butt load of coin to the pope to request reconciliation, but it doesn't reverse war with whoever attacked you by joining the crusade.

But, to answer that one question of the pope being Danish, I'm not so sure that it was a direct correlation, but more of a round about cause. You are enemies with the popes home nation so that lowers your papal standing. When your papal standing is higher you can get away with more warnings and etc, but it seems that it caused your papal standing to be so low that you got threatened with excom right off the bat.

Still, you can have perfect papal standing with a pope of a faction you are warring with. Just counts to balance it with other pious deeds.

Roleplay why don't you.

**~~candle_86~~** · March 21, 2008, 04:15 AM

well im done there, just started on a byzantine campign and i must say its fun. I never would have guessed they started so stong, im 50 turns in and am about to march on rome, with the Turks gone, Hungry gone, Egypt pushed back to cario, and Jurselm in my hands. I also note that England, France, Portugal and Denmark are my allies, while the Holy Roman Empire has just decleared war and the Papal States are nutral towards me, i guess the stack sitting outside of rome waiting for next turn to besige means im friendly lol

**Sith_Lord** · March 21, 2008, 03:15 PM

kinda the same thing happened to me, I was attacking milan when he told me to stop, and they attacked me in the open field, and the got excommed, but he seemed pissed at me 2, started giving me rediculous missions, and since i was sicily, i was right beside Rome, so i tried to kill him with m=y best assassin, but that failed now im excommuinicated... So i have a stack outside rome, gonna attac once my best gneral gets there

**Hoplite_Harry** · March 21, 2008, 09:04 PM

Best way to solve the pope - Go non-catholic/orthodox..
Then KILL, KILL, KILL!

**Kennylz** · March 23, 2008, 12:38 AM

There is no 'fixing' it. You beat back the enemy 'THEN' you 'attacked' them by seiging. The Pope told you not to. You got excommed. It doesn't matter what the enemy just did to you the last 50 turns before.

Best case scenario they get excommed for continuously attacking you, then you get a free run of them.

**~~candle_86~~** · March 23, 2008, 12:58 AM

one thing that should have been done is being allowed to change faith, this era of time was very common for that. The Lutran chuch for instance was founded, and if i belive the Anglacan chuch also towards the end of the game, yet this is not covered, i played past the end date and these events never happened.

**General Nuisance esq** · March 23, 2008, 05:31 PM

Yeah that's the most annoying thing for me too, after all if you play as England or Scotland you should be able to form the Protestant church if the old buggar in Rome annoys you, after all King Henry did