Something doesn't seem right

[Banzai!]

Alright, so your FAQ tells us to play on M/H. We must play on M so enemy units don't get attack/defend/morale bonuses because apparently you have perfectly balanced all unit stats.

However then you give all rebel leaders/enemy leaders extra command stars. Guess what command stars do? Give units extra attack/defend/morale.

....

[Admetos]

The AI has command stars. You have brains.

[gaius valerius]

Yep, auto-calc is the easy way out and mosly fails, against rebels you need to use your brains, this is meant to make the game - in its initial stages - more interesting (or so I believe as I'm no developper ). The AI is always on the lose against human brains, this needs some compensation, especially for the rebels as they don't have an empire to back them up and continuously wage war on you.

[Banzai!]

What I'm saying is this: why put in all the effort to give the AI extra command stars (extra script overheads, etc.) when you could just play on VH?

[Watchman]

Well, for one thing taking out the general is usually easy enough. For another, even a ten-star guy still doesn't make his levy skirmishers into blood-mad demons from Hell, ten foot tall and farting fire, like VH battle diff does.

[QuintusSertorius]

What I'm saying is this: why put in all the effort to give the AI extra command stars (extra script overheads, etc.) when you could just play on VH?

VH affects battles you run yourself as well as auto-calc. Command stars are meaningless when you're not auto-calc-ing.

[mcantu]

VH affects battles you run yourself as well as auto-calc. Command stars are meaningless when you're not auto-calc-ing.

Actually thats not quite right...it applies in the battle screen as well. This is what Jerome of CA said over at the EB .org boards

Originally Posted by JeromeGrasdyke
Just to clear this up ( as requested ;-) ), from the old code on my machine at CA the General's command modifier on attacks is still there in the last version, but it only applies to melee attacks and it is -inverted- so the quality of the defender's general is applied as bonus directionless defense for the defending soldier. It is also rescaled to range from -6 to +6, changing quickly at low bonus levels and then slowing down towards the top of the range. The idea was to limit the number of stacking bonusses which speed up the battles, i vaguely remember.

Also, the bonus is not limited by physical distance, and is supposed to represent a good general's ability to get superior performance from his troops through training in small scale maneuvers. The only way for this bonus to result in faster combat death rates rather than slower ones is if the defender's general has bad command traits...

If you want to test it, I would suggest a battle between some big peasant units, fighting the units 1v1 and timing the length of time to rout; then repeat giving each army a 10 star general. You should see a slower time-to-rout with the generals. In the end though 6 pts is not enough to make up huge troop quality differences, so don't expect to see miraculous differences.

stars provide a defense bonus not an attack bonus

[florin80]

Do you have a link to that discussion please?

[mcantu]

Do you have a link to that discussion please?

Sure...Jerome's post are #'s 19 and 41

http://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showth...94#post1805294

[Dominatrixx]

Command stars is a good compensation for rebel armies, and VH battles just will make ALL battles stupid...

[ThePianist]

I thought someone else wrote that the general only affect troops within a certain radius (i.e. it'd take much micromanagement to move the general unit constantly throughout the battlefield to give extra attack/defense to whichever unit needed it). Glad to find out otherwise, now it's much more of a motivation to increase the command stars of generals.

[mcantu]

I thought someone else wrote that the general only affect troops within a certain radius (i.e. it'd take much micromanagement to move the general unit constantly throughout the battlefield to give extra attack/defense to whichever unit needed it). Glad to find out otherwise, now it's much more of a motivation to increase the command stars of generals.

distance from the general is for the morale bonus...

[Sh3rpa]

Command stars is a good compensation for rebel armies, and VH battles just will make ALL battles stupid...

no, VH just makes every battle verrrrryyy looooonnnnnggggg.

no mass routings, but your casualties will be very high if you don't play it near flawlessly. I am enjoying a H/VH roman campaign very much right now.

[QuintusSertorius]

Do those bonuses vanish the moment the general dies?

I ask because there's been a few hard battles I've had recently, where things were a straight draw, then I killed the enemy general and within moments the entire tide turned in my favour.

[mcantu]

Do those bonuses vanish the moment the general dies?

I ask because there's been a few hard battles I've had recently, where things were a straight draw, then I killed the enemy general and within moments the entire tide turned in my favour.

yup...

[King Arthur]

Do those bonuses vanish the moment the general dies?

I ask because there's been a few hard battles I've had recently, where things were a straight draw, then I killed the enemy general and within moments the entire tide turned in my favour.

Most certainly, especially the Celtic factions. Many a time my Romani Legions have been fighting the Auedi and barely holding the line against massed ranks of warrriors; then the enemy General falls and the Auedi begin to route en masse!

[Papal_Knight]

very realistic that way, when you think about it.

[Korlon]

I rather like the extra command stars system. This invariably means fights against captains will be easier than that of a fight with a general. Once the general dies, almost everybody routs. I had a fight yesterday against approximately an army of 2000 with reinforcements of 3000. The first army already routed and my front line was fighting the army of 3000. The enemy general seemed to want to charge sideways into my maneuverable troops at the side, who happened to have spears. My general was also preparing to charge the enemy general. Enemy general with 9 stars died on the charge and the army chain routed within 3 seconds. Just about every enemy had exhausted stamina status which contributed.

Now, if you consider rather than that, you play on very hard battles. Such a thing would not happen. Even if the general dies, the army, without their leader giving up commands, would still fight on for a very long time, which seems a little unrealistic. Their extra attack also gives quite a bit of an advantage to them. With that kind of extra attack, it's just about impossible to beat larger numbers with a smaller army using greater tactics. Such battles are all about the enemy killing faster than mine are. Really, only way to beat them are larger cavalry forces and another unit hitting them in the rear. Otherwise, it's just isn't possible to win.

Very hard battles is probably ok with the Romans since they're fairly rich to start with and can field all those armies, or for horse archer factions like that of Pahlava and Saka Rauka, but it doesn't fit for other, more harsher factions. You can consider the extra difficulty fun, but I find it strictly more of an annoyance.

[QuintusSertorius]

Besides which, I personally find there's a very fine line between battles that have a satisfying length, and those that just turn into a boring grind. When your heavy troops are struggling to rout skirmishers in a toe-to-toe fight, there's a problem.

[ThePianist]

So does every command star of the general add a +1 to the defense stat of every unit (and is it + the defense skill, shield or armor)? I'd like to be able to know so I can add the stats before a battle.