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  1. #1
    Lawrence of Arabia's Avatar Citizen
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    Default Age of Muhammad's Wife Aisha

    One of the more common criticisms of Islam is that Muhammad married Aisha, who is usually thought to be nine year olds at the time or marriage.

    However, I started researching this on the internet and came upon an interesting take on the issue. I would especially like the insight of Muslims on this subject.

    A great misconception prevails as to the age at which Aisha was taken in marriage by the Prophet. Ibn Sa‘d has stated in the Tabaqat that when Abu Bakr [father of Aisha] was approached on behalf of the Holy Prophet, he replied that the girl had already been betrothed to Jubair, and that he would have to settle the matter first with him. This shows that Aisha must have been approaching majority at the time.

    Again, the Isaba, speaking of the Prophet’s daughter Fatima, says that she was born five years before the Call and was about five years older than Aisha. This shows that Aisha must have been about ten years at the time of her betrothal to the Prophet, and not six years as she is generally supposed to be. This is further borne out by the fact that Aisha herself is reported to have stated that when the chapter [of the Holy Quran] entitled The Moon, the fifty-fourth chapter, was revealed, she was a girl playing about and remembered certain verses then revealed. Now the fifty-fourth chapter was undoubtedly revealed before the sixth year of the Call.

    All these considerations point to but one conclusion, viz., that Aisha could not have been less than ten years of age at the time of her nikah, which was virtually only a betrothal. And there is one report in the Tabaqat that Aisha was nine years of age at the time of nikah. Again it is a fact admitted on all hands that the nikah of Aisha took place in the tenth year of the Call in the month of Shawwal, while there is also preponderance of evidence as to the consummation of her marriage taking place in the second year of Hijra in the same month, which shows that full five years had elapsed between the nikah and the consummation. Hence there is not the least doubt that Aisha was at least nine or ten years of age at the time of betrothal, and fourteen or fifteen years at the time of marriage.
    So, what are your opinions upon on this subject? (Muslims and non-Muslims alike)

    If Aisha was at least 13 at the time of marriage as Maulana Muhammad Ali argued, wouldn't that totally dismantle the argument that Muhammad is a "pedophile" or "child molestor"?
    Last edited by Lawrence of Arabia; March 02, 2008 at 06:50 AM.
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  2. #2

    Default Re: Age of Muhammad's Wife Aisha

    no but it would dismantle the idea that he was some sort of hideous freak, in history 13 year old brides are hardly uncommon or immoral, people lived far shorter llives and young mariages made sense.
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    Lawrence of Arabia's Avatar Citizen
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    Default Re: Age of Muhammad's Wife Aisha

    Quote Originally Posted by Gary88 View Post
    no but it would dismantle the idea that he was some sort of hideous freak, in history 13 year old brides are hardly uncommon or immoral, people lived far shorter llives and young mariages made sense.
    Well, most people who have a hobby of bashing Islam criticize Muhammad for marrying a 9 year-old girl. However, if instead she was at least 13, she would be the age of many European brides up until modern times.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blau&Gruen
    The argument has about the value of the ancestors of westeuropeans have practized cannibalism in preroman times, ergo westeuropeans are cannibals. The values of tradtional contextes are certainly not necessary exemplary for a modern lifing context. Should we tolerate ancient westeuropean cannibalism?
    I'm not entirely sure I understand your point/argument. Could you please elaborate for me? I've been up all night and am not at the height of my comprehension ability.
    Last edited by Lawrence of Arabia; March 02, 2008 at 06:52 AM.
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    Blau&Gruen's Avatar Civitate
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    Default Re: Age of Muhammad's Wife Aisha

    Quote Originally Posted by Lawrence of Arabia View Post
    I'm not entirely sure I understand your point/argument. Could you please elaborate for me? I've been up all night and am not at the height of my comprehension ability.
    Hey get a sleep man!
    It is basically Humes is-ought problem. You may say in this case "had been (acceptable, right, exemplary)"-"ought (to be acceptable, right, exemplary)".
    Last edited by Blau&Gruen; March 02, 2008 at 05:41 AM.
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    Default Re: Age of Muhammad's Wife Aisha

    According to Islam both men and women can get married once reached puberty.


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    Default Re: Age of Muhammad's Wife Aisha

    The argument has about the value of the ancestors of westeuropeans have practized cannibalism in preroman times, ergo westeuropeans are cannibals. The values of tradtional contextes are certainly not necessary exemplary for a modern lifing context. Should we tolerate ancient westeuropean cannibalism?
    Last edited by Blau&Gruen; March 02, 2008 at 05:16 AM.
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    Default Re: Age of Muhammad's Wife Aisha

    Very much true. Times change, customs changes.
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    Default Re: Age of Muhammad's Wife Aisha

    Quote Originally Posted by Blau&Gruen View Post
    The argument has about the value of the ancestors of westeuropeans have practized cannibalism in preroman times, ergo westeuropeans are cannibals. The values of tradtional contextes are certainly not necessary exemplary for a modern lifing context. Should we tolerate ancient westeuropean cannibalism?
    Some Western Europeans practice cannibalism in modern times.

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/2569095.stm

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    boofhead's Avatar Dux Limitis
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    Default Re: Age of Muhammad's Wife Aisha

    She was a little girl, no matter what revisionist spin you may like to put on it.

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    Default Re: Age of Muhammad's Wife Aisha

    Quote Originally Posted by boofhead View Post
    She was a little girl, no matter what revisionist spin you may like to put on it.
    She was able to be married according to what has been common hence, which does not mean she was able to be married here and now.
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    Default Re: Age of Muhammad's Wife Aisha

    Well, most people who have a hobby of bashing Islam criticize Muhammad for marrying a 9 year-old girl. However, if she was 13 instead, she would be the age of many European brides up until modern times.
    in Spain the age of consent is 13, now seeing as marriage in itself isn't the hideous thing people are concerned about here its the sex the fact that she would be the same age as modern day spanish girls who can legally consent to sex would hardly give the prophet the same paedophilic conotations.
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    Default Re: Age of Muhammad's Wife Aisha

    Quote Originally Posted by Gary88 View Post
    in Spain the age of consent is 13, now seeing as marriage in itself isn't the hideous thing people are concerned about here its the sex the fact that she would be the same age as modern day spanish girls who can legally consent to sex would hardly give the prophet the same paedophilic conotations.
    Though, a 13 year young would not be given to marriage by her parents in modern day Spain.
    Last edited by Blau&Gruen; March 02, 2008 at 05:51 AM.
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    Default Re: Age of Muhammad's Wife Aisha

    but even so its not the marriage bit that is the concern is it?
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    Default Re: Age of Muhammad's Wife Aisha

    Quote Originally Posted by Gary88 View Post
    but even so its not the marriage bit that is the concern is it?
    It is the argument's structure (that was just an unnecessary remark; my bad).

    "A being may exist but it is not necessarily the case".
    Last edited by Blau&Gruen; March 02, 2008 at 06:06 AM.
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    Default Re: Age of Muhammad's Wife Aisha

    I would very much like to see a source, before I further develop my opinion of something that seems to be little more than a piece of attempted historical apologeticism/revisionism. The hadith concerning this matter are pretty explicit about Aisha's age.

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    Default Re: Age of Muhammad's Wife Aisha

    Quote Originally Posted by Torment View Post
    I would very much like to see a source, before I further develop my opinion of something that seems to be little more than a piece of attempted historical apologeticism/revisionism. The hadith concerning this matter are pretty explicit about Aisha's age.
    Yes, but what historically might ever have been the case, it is not transformable into a general practical rule. Such would at least be missunderstandable.
    Last edited by Blau&Gruen; March 02, 2008 at 06:48 AM.
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    Lawrence of Arabia's Avatar Citizen
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    Default Re: Age of Muhammad's Wife Aisha

    Quote Originally Posted by Torment View Post
    I would very much like to see a source, before I further develop my opinion of something that seems to be little more than a piece of attempted historical apologeticism/revisionism. The hadith concerning this matter are pretty explicit about Aisha's age.
    It was written by the Indian Muslim scholar Maulana Muhammad Ali in his booklet Prophet of Islam, in the 20's and Muhammad, the Prophet in the 30's, and published again in his book Living Thoughts of the Prophet Muhammad in the 1948.

    Unless he was clairvoyant, this is not an attempt of revising Islam. He's been dead for over 50 years.

    Here is a link to Muhammad, the Prophet
    http://www.aaiil.org/text/books/mali...eprophet.shtml

    It's in Chapter 12.



    And to an Urdu Translation and Commentary of Bayan-ul-Quran which also contains the passage I quoted.
    http://aaiil.org/urdu/hq/pdf/holyquranpdf.shtml

    No idea where it is in here. The pdf files for this book are also 50-100 mb.
    Last edited by Lawrence of Arabia; March 02, 2008 at 06:43 AM.
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  18. #18
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    Default Re: Age of Muhammad's Wife Aisha

    Had Jesus turned water into wine a few centuries later he would probably be persecuted as an alchemist and if he tried that **** today he would be less famous than David Copperfield.

    Although I agree with B&G's take on the logic of the argument we must not forget the trollish nature of it, especially when taken out of context.

    Because pedophilia pales in front of sex slavery:

    When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are. If she does not please the man who bought her, he may allow her to be bought back again. But he is not allowed to sell her to foreigners, since he is the one who broke the contract with her. And if the slave girl's owner arranges for her to marry his son, he may no longer treat her as a slave girl, but he must treat her as his daughter. If he himself marries her and then takes another wife, he may not reduce her food or clothing or fail to sleep with her as his wife. If he fails in any of these three ways, she may leave as a free woman without making any payment. (Exodus 21:7-11 NLT)


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    Default Re: Age of Muhammad's Wife Aisha

    Quote Originally Posted by Garbarsardar View Post
    Although I agree with B&G's take on the logic of the argument we must not forget the trollish nature of it, especially when taken out of context.
    What you mention with full right has my undivided sympathy.
    Last edited by Blau&Gruen; March 02, 2008 at 12:27 PM.
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    Default Re: Age of Muhammad's Wife Aisha

    Quote Originally Posted by Lawrence of Arabia View Post
    It was written by the Indian Muslim scholar Maulana Muhammad Ali in his booklet Prophet of Islam, in the 20's and Muhammad, the Prophet in the 30's, and published again in his book Living Thoughts of the Prophet Muhammad in the 1948.

    Unless he was clairvoyant, this is not an attempt of revising Islam. He's been dead for over 50 years.

    Here is a link to Muhammad, the Prophet
    http://www.aaiil.org/text/books/mali...eprophet.shtml

    It's in Chapter 12.



    And to an Urdu Translation and Commentary of Bayan-ul-Quran which also contains the passage I quoted.
    http://aaiil.org/urdu/hq/pdf/holyquranpdf.shtml

    No idea where it is in here. The pdf files for this book are also 50-100 mb.
    The fact the author was a Muslim himself makes this extra interesting. It means that he either thought the Hadith were incorrect, which would make him a Qur'anic Muslim, or he's treading on very thin ice. Orthodox Islam forbids any kind of innovation, so these issues are rarely investigated among traditional Muslim scholars. The hadith concerning Aisha have been dubbed authentic, so he's basically arguing against his own religion.

    Or perhaps Muslims were just more inquisitive a century ago. Too bad so few Muslims today really reflect on their own religion and recognize its flaws and fallacies.

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