Trouble getting started - βοήθετε με;

[Cipher Highwind]

χαίρετε,

I am having some trouble with general strategy; it has been awhile since I played RTW, so I am not sure if it is a general issue of acclimation or (for the engineers) boundary phase. In either case:

Playing as the Seleucids, I go bankrupt and lose the more profitable areas to the Egyptians

Playing as the Egyptians, apparently the AI is better at managing the Seleucids than I.

Playing as the *cough*ing Romans, it is all I can do to resist the initial onslaught of Greeks, and I cannot raise an army quickly enough to repel the rebels to the south.

Has anyone else had these problems, and what do ye think is the cause thereof?

χάριτες ὑμῖν!

[supeerme]

it is your skills that is the main reason why you are being beaten so fast. you should look at try to match the same things that is posed on you. that way, you will live for a few more years and you can then start on conquering the world.

[Kara Kolyo]

Welcome to these forums.
Have you checked the factions guydes in the readme? there are some general tips how to get started with each faction.
As the seleucids my first priority is to capture in the first turn Cyprus and than quikly Side - the ptolemaic town in anatolia. Then the priority is to build as fast as you can roads, traders and temples of Tyche in the regions with trade resources. With this strategy you should start to make money soon.
Do check some of the older advice treads and the aars, they are quite helpful too.

[Cipher Highwind]

I managed to turn a profit, with literally a handful of drachmae left in the coffers as I did so. Unfortunately, for some reason, the Armenians and Pontus decided it would be fun to pick off my possessions in the middle just when I had trouble around Antioch and Tarsus.

Seriously, the come out of nowhere with a full army when I'm still grouping units from Asia Minor and waiting on the POS units I can muster from the west to arrive.

What I am thinking of doing next game is simply abandoning the unprofitable positions in the west early-on, and focusing on picking off the troublesome easterners in Asia Minor and Palestine as per the guide. The only downside to this would be the lost revenue from the silk road trade, and that it would fall into the hands of the western factions. However, what use is investing in something I cannot defend it?!

[DimeBagHo]

The Seleucids have a difficult start. Early on I do very little recruiting - I spend most of my money on economic infrastructure.

In the west: (1) Take Salamis as soon as possible, (2) Break the starting Ptolemaic armies as quickly as you can. They will manage to send maybe one or two decent stacks early on, and then it will be lower quality stuff for a while. (3) Focus on capturing Side, Sidon, and Jurusalem.

Good use of your elephants is key in beating the early Ptolemaic stacks - use your cavalry to run off any skirmishers, flank with your elephants, engage the enemy line with your phalanx, and then immediately hit the enemy line in the side or back with your elephants. As soon as one enemy unit routes, move your elephants on to the next one, until the whole line routes.

If you succeed in doing all that your income will improve considerably, and you should be able to hold back the Ptolemies without too much trouble while you turn your attention to Asia Minor and Armenia.

In the east: Either (1) fight a slow retreat with the forces you have there, until you gain control in the west, or (2) hire some mercenary elephants and capture Bactria - which will then serve as an anchor for the eastern side of your empire. Don't expand further east. Try to capture the Parthian capital as soon as you can.

If you decide on the slow retreat, consider giving regions to Bactria to keep the peace with them, and to cut off the Parthians. The Bactrians make much better neighbours.

[Cipher Highwind]

I do not think it would be wise to extend further in the west, so Salamis, as it is not part of Asia Minor, would be difficult to hold. Would the levy phalangites work as phalanx along with militia cavalry? Also, would thureophoroi be any good, or are they dead weight?

As for the slow retreat, which regions should I try to hold onto as long as possible i.e. which ones have the most trade-goods?

[DimeBagHo]

I do not think it would be wise to extend further in the west, so Salamis, as it is not part of Asia Minor, would be difficult to hold.

I meant Salamis on Cyprus - the island near Antioch. It requires little defense and the sea trade with your cities on the mainland will make it well worth having (taking it also deprives the Ptolemies of the income).

Would the levy phalangites work as phalanx along with militia cavalry? Also, would thureophoroi be any good, or are they dead weight?

Levy Phalangites will work fine - just don't expect them to win a fight without the help of cavalry or elephants hitting the enemy from behind. Militia cavalry can be useful - see the thread about Carthage. Obviously they are not as good as Numidians but you can use them in a similar way. Thureophoroi are also very useful - they can inflict a lot of pain with their javelins, especially if they hit the enemy from behind. They are very effective against elephants and chariots. They will do well against light cavalry and skirmishers. But don't expect them to win any fights against heavier infantry unless they are flanking a unit that is already engaged.

As for the slow retreat, which regions should I try to hold onto as long as possible i.e. which ones have the most trade-goods?

The most valuable regions are the ones on the silk road. Those regions have paved roads at the campaign start, and you can also see the silk and textile resources. The most important thing is to keep Selucia and Media. The rest don't matter much as long as you are making gains fast enough in the west.

[Unknown Soldier]

What difficulty are you playing?

Try on medium/medium.

Do you have AI bonuses on?

You could always 'cheat' a little by using 'force diplomacy' on the Armenians/Pontics to keep peace.

Also What is your army composition?

Do you build walls on every unwalled city on turns 1 and 2?

Have you moved your capital to Selucia and then upped tax rates as high as possible?

Replace you greek garrisons with sabara spearmen they are cheaper.
2 Units = saving of 100 denari per season.
Move Non-Garrison from East and Selucia to asia minor/egypt (pikemen/cavalry and theurophori(sp)).

[Cipher Highwind]

I did not move the capital to Seleucia, it remained in Antioch. I should have done so in retrospect, though I did not see the need for such a move if I would be consolidating in Asia Minor. I shall do so next time.

As for 'force diplomacy', it's tilde, then force_diplomacy accept the next time I send a diplomat? This could be quite useful to keep the Egyptians off my Levant holdings.

As for walls, I always build roads first, the 'Roman Strategy', especially as I'd need to for commerce sooner or later. It's useful for transporting extra units west anyway, especially where the pernicious Armenian is concerned.

I do not recall any option for 'AI bonuses', and I've been playing on easy/easy.

[Balikedes]

As for 'force diplomacy', it's tilde, then force_diplomacy accept the next time I send a diplomat?

Force diplomacy; how to use it, When you enter into negotiations you get the screen where you can offer money or trade rights or whatever. After you've selected the terms you wish to offer, you hit the '?' in the top right corner and the advice chick will pop up in the left corner, hit the 'show me how' button, the chick will go away...now submit your request and your terms will be accepted!

(i hope that's clear, it's 7:30am here and i just got in to work)

DBH installed this to give the player more control over the bad diplomacy inherent in the RTW engine. I usually only use it if the AI is making incredibly bad decisions.

[Kara Kolyo]

The ai bonuses are checked when you install. if you have them on it will make the game harder. For the force diplomacy - see the readme because Dimebagho enabled it in the diplomacy scren, you just need to press the show me how button there. it's easy.

[Cipher Highwind]

I shall reinstall a bit later in that case.

This time around, I've annexed Side, Cyprus, and the Levantine provinces and 'convinced' the Egyptians to cease fire, moved the capital to Seleucia, and am now preparing to stick Pontus on Armenia, and shall do so once the spies are in position

I shall let ye know how it goes when both factions are extinct, and after I get back from the orgy in Scythia.

EDIT: it looks like the Parthians had other plans; three big stacks out of nowhere when I have next to nothing as garrisons. I'll re-install the mod without 'AI bonuses'. Is it advisable to start out as the Seleucids to begin with, or should I chose an easier faction?

[Scutarii]

I would choose an easier faction to start out with.... Although no campaign is easy, TSE's is one of the hardest. Try the Greek City States or Germania if you like barbarians.

[Hurlbut]

And remember to keep your elephants charging, if they halt in middle of an unit they become more easier to hit. You want to keep them moving anyway as they do more damage that way on a larger number of units in a short time.

[Cipher Highwind]

The Greek City States offer no room to expand. Could you advise another civilized faction that has a relatively straight-forward start? I've written off the Seleucids; even Wikipedia says they were over-extended! οἰμοί...

[Scutarii]

Rome. Its challenging because of Pyrrhus and the Carthaginians, but it is straightforward in that you just need to win a few hard battles at the start and then can get on the road, unlike the Seleucids start, where you must endure many turns of economic hardship before bringing the East to your will.

Or Macedon, similar roster to the Greeks, but all their cities are concentrated in Greece (the GCS are a bit spread thin, making it harder at the start). Straghtforward, but by no means easy. 2-3 gallic horde stacks will assault your 1 1/2 stacks you start with at the beginning (if you concentrate all troops). So a tough start, but like Rome after a few tough battles you can begin to consolidate Greece, a real money maker.

If you want a campaign that is very easy, try Parthia. AI doesn't know how to handle HA's, and the start is basically bringing some rebel cities to heel for cash, taking some Selecucid cities and then takign Baktria and heading deeper into TSE. Good luck with whatever you choose.

[Cipher Highwind]

I gave the Greeks another shot; I just planted a few spies and waited until Macedon over-extended itself...and few turns later, wondered why they let their southern holdings came into my possession

ὁ βασιλεὺς Μακεδονίας οὐ σοφός

It worked out from there, now I just have to deal with TSE, this should be interesting.