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  1. #1

    Default yin & yang ~ universal principles?

    yin yang ~ universal principles?

    do all things go by opposites, mainly yes i would think but not always. in some ancient traditions everything was thought of as being of male or female form, and from this perhaps the yin and yang notion was formed. we see that reproduction in nature is always [? or nearly always] based on these opposites in some way even if both are present in the same creature.

    we may move from there to the more metaphoric meaning; i can imagine that the ancients would have seen male and female in all shapes and forms in existence and e.g. the cup and the sword is used to illustrate this in celtic traditions. we often use metaphor as analogous to sexual activity and behaviour like train-tunnel, nut-bolt, then we can also think of things like a cave as a feminine space and entering it would be similar to the sexual act. perhaps the very idea of a sacred space eminated from caves which were used as temples in ancient times.

    in science we can perhaps think of laws like ‘each action creates its equal and opposite’ as a metaphoric form of yin and yang/male-female? this is if we think of it so; in a spiritual sense a force penetrates the womb or entity of ‘space’ [a space to be moved into rather than space itself] which reacts producing or giving birth to the opposite. or in more simple terms an arrow representing the primary force can be considered as male, its recepticle being female.
    mm perhaps that is not the best explanation, can you see any other laws that may be seen as yin-yang like?

    the universe itself may in a sense also be considered as male and female entities, where space is feminine, then points and forces within that space are masculine. when we move into this realm of metaphor the sexual connotations become less apparent although still relevant as i see it. this then is probably why the chinese taoists developed the notion of yin-yang, as it takes the idea to its most universal context.

    here is an explanation of yin and yang principles...
    http://www.wsu.edu/~dee/CHPHIL/YINYANG.HTM
    quote
    The essentials of the yin-yang school are as follows: the universe is run by a single principle, the Tao, or Great Ultimate. This principle is divided into two opposite principles, or two principles which oppose one another in their actions, yin and yang. All the opposites one perceives in the universe can be reduced to one of the opposite forces. The yin and yang accomplish changes in the universe through the five material agents, or wu hsing , which both produce one another and overcome one another.

    ok so do you think yin and yang represent universal principles?
    Formerly quetzalcoatl. Proud leader of STW3 and member of the RTR, FATW and QNS teams.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: yin & yang ~ universal principles?

    i'd say so,
    consider the yin yang symbol:


    the main thing to realise is that both yin and yang are interchangeable like matter and energy, hence the little spots of yin and yang in both greater yins and yags in the symbol

  3. #3

    Default Re: yin & yang ~ universal principles?

    exarch, hi

    the main thing to realise is that both yin and yang are interchangeable like matter and energy, hence the little spots of yin and yang in both greater yins and yangs in the symbol
    that is what makes them 'universal' as opposed to 'distinct' i would have thought. you have two principles which belong to the greater third i.e. the tao.
    Formerly quetzalcoatl. Proud leader of STW3 and member of the RTR, FATW and QNS teams.

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    Default Re: yin & yang ~ universal principles?

    hey quetz
    interesting thing i've found when studying ancient china, is that the philosophy of yin and yang is constant whether it be in martial arts, medicine, science or philosophy.

  5. #5

    Default Re: yin & yang ~ universal principles?

    Opposites attract, and opposites have a way of transcending things together and ending up being not that opposite but actually one and the same. Or if I can remember this one quote correctly..
    But mark me well; Religion is my name;
    An angel once: but now a fury grown,
    Too often talked of, but too little known.

    -Jonathan Swift

    "There's only a few things I'd actually kill for: revenge, jewelry, Father O'Malley's weedwacker..."
    -Bender (Futurama) awesome

    Universal truth is not measured in mass appeal.
    -Immortal Technique

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    Default Re: yin & yang ~ universal principles?

    daskinna
    yin and yang are not complete opposites becuz each still retains an 'impurity' of the other within it, not dissimilar to how some famous artists will purposely make a mistake in their masterpiece to create a contrast to the perfection inherant within that work.
    i've heard some ppl make the idiotic leap and declare, (as that author, matthew reilly has alluded to) that yin and yang are like 'good' and 'evil'.
    yin and yang are not subjectively 'good/evil'
    they are matters of state, or states of matter, whichever u prefer it.

  7. #7

    Default Re: yin & yang ~ universal principles?

    They are juxtapositions in my mind. Ones in which there is a balance of harmony between the two.
    But mark me well; Religion is my name;
    An angel once: but now a fury grown,
    Too often talked of, but too little known.

    -Jonathan Swift

    "There's only a few things I'd actually kill for: revenge, jewelry, Father O'Malley's weedwacker..."
    -Bender (Futurama) awesome

    Universal truth is not measured in mass appeal.
    -Immortal Technique

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    Roman Knight's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: yin & yang ~ universal principles?

    I think Ying and Yang is true for everything we experience, because for us to notice something, it has to have an opposite. For example, if religion had never been invented, there would be no concept of Atheism.

  9. #9

    Default Re: yin & yang ~ universal principles?

    Quote Originally Posted by RomanKnight990 View Post
    I think Ying and Yang is true for everything we experience, because for us to notice something, it has to have an opposite. For example, if religion had never been invented, there would be no concept of Atheism.
    Not religion, but God. Religion is the institution built up around His concept, not Him Himself.

    But I think Voltaire said if we God didn't exist, it would be necessary for us to create him.
    But mark me well; Religion is my name;
    An angel once: but now a fury grown,
    Too often talked of, but too little known.

    -Jonathan Swift

    "There's only a few things I'd actually kill for: revenge, jewelry, Father O'Malley's weedwacker..."
    -Bender (Futurama) awesome

    Universal truth is not measured in mass appeal.
    -Immortal Technique

  10. #10

    Default Re: yin & yang ~ universal principles?

    ok let us look at possible universals involved in the idea...

    1. laws of attraction.

    2. balance and harmony.

    3. polarities and unity.

    there isn’t a lot that doesn’t come under these principles, so i would presume they can be considered as universal.

    so sexuality is a product of yin/yang, although we can see it moving through from the ultimate forms of yin/yang down to the more apparent physical side in nature.

    yin/yang and tao then are principles unto themselves?

    does the tao need god? i can see the original notions of god being an original cause but there is no beginning for such a thing to arise, so god may be a vague interpretation of other universals including tao? certainly i think creation is a flawed concept, whilst things like tao are fluid and match what we see in the worls, but we dont see creation anywhere at all.
    Formerly quetzalcoatl. Proud leader of STW3 and member of the RTR, FATW and QNS teams.

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    Roman Knight's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: yin & yang ~ universal principles?

    Quote Originally Posted by Da Skinna View Post
    Not religion, but God. Religion is the institution built up around His concept, not Him Himself.

    But I think Voltaire said if we God didn't exist, it would be necessary for us to create him.
    Two things:

    1. I am an Atheist

    2. If there was no institution, there wouldn't be any way to realise god if he did exist.

  12. #12

    Default Re: yin & yang ~ universal principles?

    Quote Originally Posted by RomanKnight990 View Post
    Two things:

    1. I am an Atheist

    2. If there was no institution, there wouldn't be any way to realise god if he did exist.
    One thing:

    Our realization of God would be personal, not decided for us in some group setting. God is a spiritual bond between us and everything around us, religion sets the terms and people have to go by those terms, and therein lies the vulnerabilities to all our human frailties.

    Is that not better than mass realization of a single entity? The personal experience and realization of a power greater than our own?
    But mark me well; Religion is my name;
    An angel once: but now a fury grown,
    Too often talked of, but too little known.

    -Jonathan Swift

    "There's only a few things I'd actually kill for: revenge, jewelry, Father O'Malley's weedwacker..."
    -Bender (Futurama) awesome

    Universal truth is not measured in mass appeal.
    -Immortal Technique

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    Default Re: yin & yang ~ universal principles?

    Yin and yang, yes and no, right and wrong (or left), hot and cold.. To push it a step to far, there is two sides to every coin (sorry). I guess it is just part of our rationalisation on certain things, we couldn't cope with a totally grey world, It's black and white sometimes.. (these phrases are everywhere!).

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    Default Re: yin & yang ~ universal principles?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ummagumma View Post
    Yin and yang, yes and no, right and wrong (or left), hot and cold.. To push it a step to far, there is two sides to every coin (sorry). I guess it is just part of our rationalisation on certain things, we couldn't cope with a totally grey world, It's black and white sometimes.. (these phrases are everywhere!).
    agree with everything except the right and wrong, good and evil thing.
    A lot of westerners confuse yin and yang with good and evil, because of the judeo-christian belief in a dualistic good (god) and evil (satan).
    yin and yang are merely forces of nature like solids and liquids (yin) and the light and effervescent (yang).
    attempting to seek some sort of divine will behind yin and yang is like trying to find some sort of divine will behind homeostasis-you'll see what you want to see. if u want to see some sort of divine being commanding everything, then that's the conclusion your mind will arrive at.
    i've felt what christians call the 'power of the lord' by balancing out my yin and yang via taichi; in effect i actually think christians confuse a sense of balance and wellbeing with 'being one with god' and in order to continue feeling this way, they adhere quite closely to the closeminded narrow teachings of their church.
    Feeling blissful and feeling at one with the universe is a natural part of growing up. it's jsut a pity christians would rather exploit that basic instinct for new converts.

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