Project: victory conditions

[Zarax]

After pwijnands' request I'm opening a new project topic.
As many of you know, currently some XGM factions have mostly outlive x or y objectives or on the other side to conquer a ridiculous number of cities all around.

So, what I propose is to have profiles based on a model:

- what historically the faction tried to achieve

- short campaign victory conditions, aimed to reach what historically would have brought a faction to a long term solid position but not necessarily what their ambition was (I.E, if they have one designed enemy it would be their elimination plus the capture of a few strategic cities)

- long campaign victory would include what a faction would have considered as long term "imperial plan" plus a few culturally important settlements to supplement it where required

To make things clear I'll bring my favorite faction as example.

Carthage:

Historically their aim was to dominate the western african, mediterranean and atlantic trade routes.
Their merchant expeditions went as far as central african coast and the shores of england.
In their history Carthage always battled the greeks for western mediterranean trade dominance and later it engaged the punic wars to defend it from the romans.

Short campaign:
- Outlast the romans and capture at least 30 territories

Long campaign:
- Conquer all western african settlements
- Conquer all of Iberia and southern gallic coast
- Conquer the italian peninsula and sicily
- Conquer western gallic coast and the southern english shore
- Reclaim Sidon

IMHO this

- is challenging (good luck with Rome)
- gives you a fair few enemies to fight
- is historically plausible
- gives you some long term campaign clear objectives

What do you think?

[Javolenus]

Hi There,

I think this is a definite step forward. I like the idea of revised victory conditions and think you are moving in the right direction.

It seems to me that most factions have a 'domestic' goal of unifying territory enclosed within their natural boundaries (e.g. Italian peninsula for Rome) and a 'foreign' goal of expansion and conquest.

But I agree that it would be good to slot victory conditions into a historical context. For example, just remaining free of Roman domination would have been a victory for many factions, historically speaking.

Anyhow, I just wanted to give a positive response.

Finally, just a thought: once a faction has achieved victory conditions for the short campaign, could the next stage - the foreign expansion thing - be linked to the faction leader's traits? I mean, not everyone was an Alexander or a Caesar. This probably is not possible, but the thought just struck me. Actually, this is probably a crazy idea and not practical.

[Suppanut]

This is my proposal

Pontus:

Historically their ruler were Persian Satrap who take advantage from the fall of Alexander's Empire to declared themselves king and survived by powerplay in Diadochi war. Due to their faction's name "Pontus" originally mean Black sea so short term campaign not only need to secured Anatolia but also should controlled Black sea trade and naval power. Their long term goal would be rational to restore Archemenid glory of the past since their ruler were Persian anyway.

Short campaign
- Outlast Armenia
- Outlast GCS
- Conquer all Anatolia
- Conquer all Black Sea coast

Long Campaign
- Conquer all land of former Archemenid Empire(Persia, Baktria, Mesopotamia, Lavant, Armenia, Anatolia and Lower Egypt)
- Outlast Armenia
- Outlast Ptolemios
- Outlast Baktria
- Outlast Seleucid
- Outlast Parthia


Armenia:

Historically their leader had Archemenid blood in their vein so they can truely declared rightful ruler of Archemenid made their long term to restore it. Short term goal shold be their historical sphere of influence and eliminated neighbour threat like Pontus and weakening the superpower like Seleucid.

Short Campaign
- Outlast Pontus
- Conquer Syria
- Conquer Anatolia
- Conquer southern part of Caucasus
- Conquer Media
- Conquer Mesopotamia

Long Campaign
- Conquer all land of former Archemenid Empire(Persia, Baktria, Mesopotamia, Lavant, Armenia, Anatolia and Lower Egypt)
- Outlast Pontus
- Outlast Ptolemios
- Outlast Baktria
- Outlast Seleucid
- Outlast Parthia


Parthia:

Historically Parthia just like adopt son of Archemenid due to they never have concrete link with Archemenid although they are persian speaking language. Their expansion of power just made them had right to inherited Archemnid legacy and champion for all Iranian people. Short term goal should be liberated all Persian kin and eliminated the most rightful pretender like Armenia while long term should be retore the former glory of Archemenid.

Short Campaign
- Outlast Baktria
- Outlast Armenia
- Conquer Persia
- Conquer Baktria

Long Campaign
- Conquer all land of former Archemenid Empire(Persia, Baktria, Mesopotamia, Lavant, Armenia, Anatolia and Lower Egypt)
- Outlast Pontus
- Outlast Ptolemios
- Outlast Baktria
- Outlast Seleucid
- Outlast Armenia


Diadochi

Macedon, Seleucid, Ptolemios, all these three hellenistic faction have one thing in common, they all claimed to be rightful heir of Alexander the Great with some varient in their domestic goal due to the region of their power based.

Macedon

Short Campaign
- Conquer Greek mainland and near by island of Rhodes and Crete
- Conquer Anatolia
- Outlast GCS
- Outlast Thrace

Long Campaign
- Conquer Greek mainland and nearby island of Rhodes and Crete
- Conquer all former Alexander's Empire
- Outlast Seleucid
- Outlast Ptolemios
- Outlast Thrace
- Outlast Pontus
- Outlast GCS


Seleucid

Short Campaign
- Conquer Southern Caucasus
- Conquer Anatolia
- Conquer Baktria
- Outlast Pontus
- Outlast Armenia
- outlast Baktria

Long Campaign
- Conquer Southern Caucasus
- Conquer all former Alexander's Empire
- Outlast Seleucid
- Outlast Ptolemios
- Outlast Armenia
- Outlast Pontus
- Outlast GCS


Ptolemios

Short Campaign
- Conquer Arabia Felix
- Conquer Nubia and Ethiopia
- Conquer Syrenica
- Conquer Lavant
- Conquer Anatolia
- Conquer Mesopotamia
- Outlast Saba

Long Campaign
- Conquer Arabia Felix
- Conquer Nubia and Ethiopia
- Conquer Syrenica
- Conquer all former Alexander's Empire
- Outlast Seleucid
- Outlast Ptolemios
- Outlast Armenia
- Outlast Pontus
- Outlast GCS

[lankylars]

In my opinion, it might not be a good idea to have "outlast faction x" in a short campaign, because while capturing a province can be done in a year, an entire faction takes much longer to disappear.
In fact, I'm not a huge fan of "outlast so-and-so" for most factions as a short or long campaign objective because their goal was probably territory acquisition, not extermination of some race regardless of where that people was situated on the globe.
When the outlasting object is applicable would be for some of the Diadochi campaigns, like GCS versus Macedon.

Of course, this is all my opinion and is subject to change.

[Zarax]

Suppanut, your objectives would be good but you can only have a faction conquering specific territories OR outlast x factions.

[Javolenus]

Hi There,

I just completed a short campaign as GCS - I had to hold 15 settlements and outlast Macedon and Thrace. I really wanted to successfully finish a RTW campaign, so I went all out.

But victory was achieved only by 'total war' methods - e.g. massacres, destruction of cities and looting. I kept getting messages that various other factions were about to win, so that just made me player harder and dirtier. I'm not sure how historical this mode of warfare is, but it seemed the only option to fulfil the victory conditions. In other words, my campaign was partly about territorial conquest and partly about all-out war on rival factions.

In a previous Total War game there was a 'glorious achievements' option for victory, but I guess that is not what RTW is about. It seems to me that the underlying dynamic is imperial conquest and that's it.

Perhaps it's better to have some focus for victory conditions, along historical lines (broadly speaking), which is what you're suggesting.

In other words, instead of saying 'conquer X number of settlements', list them specifically. As for the 'outlive faction' thing, this may become unnecessary once specific territoral goals have been established. A short campaign could have, say, 15 specific settlements as goals and a long campaign 30.

Although I've got nothing against the 'outlive faction' thing as such, it does seem to introduce a 'genocidal' element into the game, more reminiscent of Crusader-type warfare.

[Suppanut]

Here are more specific condition according to Zarax wishes.

Pontus:

Historically their ruler were Persian Satrap who take advantage from the fall of Alexander's Empire to declared themselves king and survived by powerplay in Diadochi war. Due to their faction's name "Pontus" originally mean Black sea so short term campaign not only need to secured Anatolia but also should controlled Black sea trade and naval power. Their long term goal would be rational to restore Archemenid glory of the past since their ruler were Persian anyway.

Short campaign(Lord of Pontus)
- Control all Anatolia (settlement: Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Trapezus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus)
- Control all Black Sea coast (settlement: Tomi, Seutopolis, Byzantium, Panticapaeum, Neapolis_Scythica, Chersonesos, Tanais, Olbia, Kotais)
- Outlast Armenia (optional)
- Outlast GCS (optional)

Long Campaign(Archemenid inheritance of Pontus)
- Control all land of former Archemenid Empire (settlement: Cyrene, Alexandria, Siwa, Memphis, Thebes, Paraetonium, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus, Seleucia, Susa, Charax, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Ecbatana, Merv, Zadracarta, Gabae, Neh, Istakhr, Harmozia, Phra, Asaak, Hecatompylos, Apamea, Arbela, Bactra, Kophen, Buridava, Tomi, Seutopolis, Sardica, Byzantium, Amphipolis, Naissus, Kotais, Phraaspa, Armavir, Mtskheta, Albana, Amida, Satala, Thospia, Pura, Taxila, Alexandropolis, Khiva, Maracanda, Nisa, Kangha, Panticapaeum, Neapolis_Scythica, Chersonesos, Olbia, Meroe)
- Control all Black Sea coast (settlement: Tomi, Seutopolis, Byzantium, Panticapaeum, Neapolis_Scythica, Chersonesos, Tanais, Olbia, Kotais)
- Outlast Armenia
- Outlast Ptolemios
- Outlast Baktria
- Outlast Seleucid
- Outlast Parthia


Armenia:

Historically their leader had Archemenid blood in their vein so they can truely declared rightful ruler of Archemenid made their long term to restore it. Short term goal shold be their historical sphere of influence and eliminated neighbour threat like Pontus and weakening the superpower like Seleucid.

Short Campaign(Lord of Ararat)
- Control Syria (settlement: Hatra, Antioch, Damascus)
- Control all Anatolia (settlement: Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Trapezus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus)
- Control south of Caucasus (settlement: Kotais, Phraaspa, Armavir, Mtskheta, Albana, Amida, Satala, Thospia)
- Control Media (settlement: Ecbatana)
- Control Mesopotamia (settlement: Seleucia, Susa, Charax)
- Outlast Pontus (optional)

Long Campaign(Archemenid inheritance of Armenia)
- Control all land of former Archemenid Empire (settlement: Cyrene, Alexandria, Siwa, Memphis, Thebes, Paraetonium, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus, Seleucia, Susa, Charax, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Ecbatana, Merv, Zadracarta, Gabae, Neh, Istakhr, Harmozia, Phra, Asaak, Hecatompylos, Apamea, Arbela, Bactra, Kophen, Buridava, Tomi, Seutopolis, Sardica, Byzantium, Amphipolis, Naissus, Kotais, Phraaspa, Armavir, Mtskheta, Albana, Amida, Satala, Thospia, Pura, Taxila, Alexandropolis, Khiva, Maracanda, Nisa, Kangha, Panticapaeum, Neapolis_Scythica, Chersonesos, Olbia, Meroe)
- Outlast Pontus
- Outlast Ptolemios
- Outlast Baktria
- Outlast Seleucid
- Outlast Parthia


Parthia:

Historically Parthia just like adopt son of Archemenid due to they never have concrete link with Archemenid although they are persian speaking language. Their expansion of power just made them had right to inherited Archemnid legacy and champion for all Iranian people. Short term goal should be liberated all Persian kin and eliminated the most rightful pretender like Armenia while long term should be retore the former glory of Archemenid.

Short Campaign(Lord under Ahura-Mazda)
- Control Persia (settlement: Ecbatana, Merv, Zadracarta, Gabae, Neh, Istakhr, Harmozia, Phra, Asaak, Hecatompylos, Apamea, Arbela)
- Control Baktria (settlement: Bactra, Kophen)
- Control Silkroad (settlement; Khiva, Maracanda, Gushan, Kashgar, Chighu, Kangha)
- Outlast Baktria (optional)
- Outlast Armenia (optional)

Long Campaign(Archemenid inheritance of Pahlavan)
- Control all land of former Archemenid Empire (settlement: Cyrene, Alexandria, Siwa, Memphis, Thebes, Paraetonium, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus, Seleucia, Susa, Charax, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Ecbatana, Merv, Zadracarta, Gabae, Neh, Istakhr, Harmozia, Phra, Asaak, Hecatompylos, Apamea, Arbela, Bactra, Kophen, Buridava, Tomi, Seutopolis, Sardica, Byzantium, Amphipolis, Naissus, Kotais, Phraaspa, Armavir, Mtskheta, Albana, Amida, Satala, Thospia, Pura, Taxila, Alexandropolis, Khiva, Maracanda, Nisa, Kangha, Panticapaeum, Neapolis_Scythica, Chersonesos, Olbia, Meroe)
- Control Silkroad (settlement; Khiva, Maracanda, Gushan, Kashgar, Chighu, Kangha)
- Outlast Pontus
- Outlast Ptolemios
- Outlast Baktria
- Outlast Seleucid
- Outlast Armenia


Diadochi

Macedon, Seleucid, Ptolemios, all these three hellenistic faction have one thing in common, they all claimed to be rightful heir of Alexander the Great with some varient in their domestic goal due to the region of their power based.

Macedon

Short Campaign(Ruler of Aegean)
- Control Greek mainland and near by island of Rhodes and Crete
- Control all Anatolia (settlement: Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Trapezus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus)
- Outlast GCS (optional)
- Outlast Thrace (optional)

Long Campaign(Diadochus)
- Control Greek mainland and nearby island of Rhodes and Crete
- Control all former Alexander's Empire (settlement: Cyrene, Alexandria, Siwa, Memphis, Thebes, Paraetonium, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus, Seleucia, Susa, Charax, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Ecbatana, Merv, Zadracarta, Gabae, Neh, Istakhr, Harmozia, Phra, Asaak, Hecatompylos, Apamea, Arbela, Bactra, Kophen, Buridava, Tomi, Seutopolis, Sardica, Byzantium, Amphipolis, Naissus, Armavir, Satala, Thospia, Ambracia, Pella, Larissa, Sparta, Athens, Patras, Corinth, Thebes-greek, Thermon, Rhodes, Kydonia, Salamis, Pura, Taxila, Alexandropolis)
- Outlast Seleucid
- Outlast Ptolemios
- Outlast Thrace
- Outlast Pontus
- Outlast GCS


Seleucid

Short Campaign(Ruler of the East)
- Control south of Caucasus (settlement: Kotais, Phraaspa, Armavir, Mtskheta, Albana, Amida, Satala, Thospia)
- Control all Anatolia (settlement: Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Trapezus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus)
- Control Lavant (settlement: Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem)
- Control Mesopotamia (settlement: Seleucia, Susa, Charax)
- Control Persia (settlement: Ecbatana, Merv, Zadracarta, Gabae, Neh, Istakhr, Harmozia, Phra, Asaak, Hecatompylos, Apamea, Arbela)
- Control Baktria (settlement: Bactra, Kophen)
- Outlast Pontus (optional)
- Outlast Armenia (optional)
- outlast Baktria (optional)

Long Campaign(Diadochus)
- Control Southern Caucasus (settlement: Kotais, Phraaspa, Armavir, Mtskheta, Albana, Amida, Satala, Thospia)
- Control all former Alexander's Empire (settlement: Cyrene, Alexandria, Siwa, Memphis, Thebes, Paraetonium, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus, Seleucia, Susa, Charax, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Ecbatana, Merv, Zadracarta, Gabae, Neh, Istakhr, Harmozia, Phra, Asaak, Hecatompylos, Apamea, Arbela, Bactra, Kophen, Buridava, Tomi, Seutopolis, Sardica, Byzantium, Amphipolis, Naissus, Armavir, Satala, Thospia, Ambracia, Pella, Larissa, Sparta, Athens, Patras, Corinth, Thebes-greek, Thermon, Rhodes, Kydonia, Salamis, Pura, Taxila, Alexandropolis)
- Outlast Seleucid
- Outlast Ptolemios
- Outlast Armenia
- Outlast Pontus
- Outlast GCS


Ptolemios

Short Campaign(Ruler of the Niles)
- Control Western Arabia (settlement: Petra, Bostra, Carna, Mariaba, Tamna, Sabata)
- Control Eastern Africa (settlement: Cyrene, Alexandria, Siwa, Memphis, Thebes, Paraetonium, Pselchis, Campus_Blemmye, Meroe, Hibis, Opone)
- Control Lavant (settlement: Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem)
- Control all Anatolia (settlement: Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Trapezus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus)
- Control Mesopotamia (settlement: Seleucia, Susa, Charax)
- Outlast Saba (optional)

Long Campaign(Diadochus)
- Control Western Arabia (settlement: Petra, Bostra, Carna, Mariaba, Tamna, Sabata)
- Control East Africa (settlement: Cyrene, Alexandria, Siwa, Memphis, Thebes, Paraetonium, Pselchis, Campus_Blemmye, Meroe, Hibis, Opone)
- Control all former Alexander's Empire (settlement: Cyrene, Alexandria, Siwa, Memphis, Thebes, Paraetonium, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus, Seleucia, Susa, Charax, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Ecbatana, Merv, Zadracarta, Gabae, Neh, Istakhr, Harmozia, Phra, Asaak, Hecatompylos, Apamea, Arbela, Bactra, Kophen, Buridava, Tomi, Seutopolis, Sardica, Byzantium, Amphipolis, Naissus, Armavir, Satala, Thospia, Ambracia, Pella, Larissa, Sparta, Athens, Patras, Corinth, Thebes-greek, Thermon, Rhodes, Kydonia, Salamis, Pura, Taxila, Alexandropolis)
- Outlast Seleucid
- Outlast Macedon
- Outlast Armenia
- Outlast Pontus
- Outlast GCS


Baktria

Part Indian, part Greek and part Persian. They have spend their time historically conquer eastward into India while hold their western frontier quite firm. Baktrian local know for their loyalty to the Archemenid so control Persia heartland would guranteed that no other persian to claim their loyalty.

Short Campaign(Ruler of the Edge of the World)
- Control Persia (settlement: Ecbatana, Merv, Zadracarta, Gabae, Neh, Istakhr, Harmozia, Phra, Asaak, Hecatompylos, Apamea, Arbela)
- Control Baktria (settlement: Bactra, Kophen)
- Control India (settlement: Pura, patala, Taxila, Alexandropolis)
- Control Silkroad (settlement; Khiva, Maracanda, Gushan, Kashgar, Chighu, Kangha)
- Outlast Parthia (optional)

Long Campaign(Diadochus)
- Control all former Alexander's Empire (settlement: Cyrene, Alexandria, Siwa, Memphis, Thebes, Paraetonium, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus, Seleucia, Susa, Charax, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Ecbatana, Merv, Zadracarta, Gabae, Neh, Istakhr, Harmozia, Phra, Asaak, Hecatompylos, Apamea, Arbela, Bactra, Kophen, Buridava, Tomi, Seutopolis, Sardica, Byzantium, Amphipolis, Naissus, Armavir, Satala, Thospia, Ambracia, Pella, Larissa, Sparta, Athens, Patras, Corinth, Thebes-greek, Thermon, Rhodes, Kydonia, Salamis, Pura, Taxila, Alexandropolis)
- Control India (settlement: Pura, patala, Taxila, Alexandropolis)
- Control Silkroad (settlement; Khiva, Maracanda, Gushan, Kashgar, Chighu, Kangha)
- Outlast Seleucid
- Outlast Ptolemios
- Outlast Macedon
- Outlast Parthia


Gauls& Indy Gauls

Celts people spent times that they not raid other people by powerplay among themselves. Although spread wide but they lack of unity, So their short and long term would be unification than other thing else.

Short Campaign(unification of Gauls)
- Control all Gauls (settlement: Samarobriva, Atuatuca, Cenabum, Darioritum, Vesontio, Vesontio, Avaricum, Lemonum, Iuvavum, Veldideno, Vienna, Gergovia, Burdigala, Massilia, Tolosa, Mediolanium, Patavium, Paetovio, Segesta)
- Outlast another Gauls faction

Long Campaign(Glory of all celts)
- Control all Gauls (settlement: Samarobriva, Atuatuca, Cenabum, Darioritum, Vesontio, Vesontio, Avaricum, Lemonum, Iuvavum, Veldideno, Vienna, Gergovia, Burdigala, Massilia, Tolosa, Mediolanium, Patavium, Paetovio, Segesta)
- Control eastern europe celts (settlement: Carrodunum, Eburonum, Leucaristus, Singidunum, Aquincum)
- Control Britannia (settlement: Isurium, Emain_Macha, Camulodunum, Atauna)
- Control Iberia (settlement: Tyde, Numantia, Oxtraca, Carthago_Nova, Gadir, Bocchoris, Saguntum, Baikor, Iruna, Arsa, Pallantia, Emporion)
- Control Amber Route regions (trade route that transport Amber from Baltic to Mediterranean. Settlement:???)(optional)
- Capture Rome
- Outlast another Gauls faction

Germans

They are overran Roman empire and live everywhere in western europe, Although this will happen late during post-XGM era but every germans' player would like to make it happen early for sure!

Short Campaign(germanic confaderate)
- Control germania and Baltic sea (settlement: Hafnia, Vicus_Aestii, Vicus_Fenni, Rugium, Phabiranum, Teutoburgum, Sumelocenna, Vicus_Venedae, Vicus_Tissagetae, Tulisurgium, Mattium, Burgaz_Sueones, Vicus_Careotae)
- Control eastern europe celts (settlement: Carrodunum, Eburonum, Leucaristus, Singidunum, Aquincum)
- incorperate Bastarnae (settlement: Vibantavarium)
- Outlast Indy Gauls

Long Campaign(germans are everywhere)
- Control germania and Baltic sea (settlement: Hafnia, Vicus_Aestii, Vicus_Fenni, Rugium, Phabiranum, Teutoburgum, Sumelocenna, Vicus_Venedae, Vicus_Tissagetae, Tulisurgium, Mattium, Burgaz_Sueones, Vicus_Careotae)
- Control all Gauls (settlement: Samarobriva, Atuatuca, Cenabum, Darioritum, Vesontio, Vesontio, Avaricum, Lemonum, Iuvavum, Veldideno, Vienna, Gergovia, Burdigala, Massilia, Tolosa, Mediolanium, Patavium, Paetovio, Segesta)
- Control eastern europe celts (settlement: Carrodunum, Eburonum, Leucaristus, Singidunum, Aquincum)
- Control Britannia (settlement: Isurium, Emain_Macha, Camulodunum, Atauna)
- incorperate Bastarnae (settlement: Vibantavarium)
- Outlast Gauls
- Outlast Indy Gauls
- Outlast Thrace
- Outlast Spain
- Capture Rome
- Capture Carthage (optional)

[Unknown Soldier]

Javolenus - EB mod has faction leader specific objectives - but it is a heavily scripted mod.

[Javolenus]

Hi Unknown Soldier - thanks for this.

Yes, now I recall that EB does have that. But you are right, EB is heavily scripted and the beauty of XGM is that it is not! Although EB is great in its own way and there is much to admire, I actually prefer XGM because it's a stable, fast-paced, well-balanced game that doesn't have a script to activate. Also, I really like the look of XGM.

Perhaps if victory conditions are set to specific settlements, with short/long campaign options, that would be good enough?

As for the historical accuracy thing, for me, personally, I like the city/character names to be accurate and also stuff like unit skins and stats. I also like some historical info and enhanced traits, in order to improve game immersion.

But returning to historical victory conditions:

I think that, in the game's timeframe, the Greeks were involved in 'civil wars' - e.g. the Macedonian wars, plus they had invasion by Gauls and Romans to contend with. And so, territorially speaking, all the action takes places in Greece without any big foreign expeditions.

Meanwhile, in the same timeframe, the Romans took control of the whole Italian peninsula, Sicily, Spain, Carthage, Macedonia. And so, in a historical sense, Roman victory conditions look different to those for Greeks.

I think that, either you have a historical scenario, with factions balanced to reflect historical conditions at the start date, and with historical victory conditions; or you have a non-historical territory-grabbing game with realistic character/place names, units skins/stats etc. and victory conditions like 'take 50 settlements'.

Either way, the game has a great deal to offer and XGM is a superb mod.

[Hippias]

Ah Javolenus - you speak many wise words. I am not a fan of the 'outlive faction' conditions, but suppose the 'Capture specific provinces' helps force the AI to start expansion in nice historical direction.

Glorious achievements is sadly missed by me - making x-amount of cash + building a certain Lvl 4 structure whilat surviving in your original lands - that would have been good (as Iberia say)

[Javolenus]

Hi Hippias,

Thanks for this. Yes, successfully maintaining independence and increasing infrastructure are good goals in themselves and it's a shame they can't be included as victory conditions.

I think the 'outlive faction' might be appropriate for Rome v. Carthage, so perhaps should be included in their victory conditions.

Listing specific settlements for victory conditions - like Suppanut has done in his post - should help move campaigns along set lines, with certain cities becoming real hotspots.

In my recent GCS (short) campaign, I took lots of small Thracian settlements, in order to fulfil the victory conditions by taking 15 towns and outlasting Thrace (Macedon had already been destroyed). It didn't really matter which towns I grabbed, as long as I got 15 or more, so I looked for soft targets.

But if the campaign victory conditions had stated that I must take Byzantium, for example, that would have changed the way I played. And if the 'outlive faction' condition had been removed, then I might have tried to make more use of bribery and diplomacy, rather than outright annihilation.

If victory conditions listed specific cities to be taken, then players would have the chance to try out different approaches, knowing that the basic scenario would be the same. Perhaps this would make campaigns more intense and focused? It would be interesting to test a few short campaigns to see how things work out.

[Hippias]

Got to throw yourself into the role-playing aspects Jav to get the full benefit - if it's an outright blitz to take many cities you may as well be playing an arcade shooter.

Now me, if I am playing the Gauls, l load all the neighbourhood pets into a giant wicker badger in the backyard - set fire to it - strip to my skin, which I then paint blue - and drink myself insensible with warm, lumpy beer.

Now THATS what I call role-playing

probably explains why I never do very well as Gaul though....

[Kara Kolyo]

might as well explain my thracian failures with the wine, or the parthian ones.... or i might be revealing too much over internet forum
BTW: most of the factions had more speciffic victory conditions, but DBH decided that they are not working or something. Can't remember why exactly they were removed

[DimeBagHo]

Can't remember why exactly they were removed.

Neither can I.

I agree that we should do away with the "outlast faction x" type conditions. That means the conditions have to be a number of regions, plus a list of required regions.

A long way back XGM had scripted victory conditions, which are a lot more flexible. We could test for the number of regions, specific regions, the existence of buildings, a faction leader with certain traits, and so on. Implementing this sort of victory condition is obviously more complicated though - doing it for every faction would take a while.

[Balikedes]

Neither can I.

I thought it had to do with the requirements being too high, like you had to conquer all four corners or something...:hmmm:...?

I really like the idea.

[Zarax]

Well, I think we wanted to simplify the objectives for AI but we got overboard on that one...
I wanted to deal with that stuff in my slow mod but I never managed to put enough time through it.

[CaesarVincens]

I agree that victory conditions (VCs) should be mainly based on taking so many/certain provinces for the long campaign, and either a shortened version for the short campaign, or just take so many territories.

Certain factions could have a outlive faction x for the short campaign: Rome, Macedon, Carthage, and maybe GCS, others maybe as well, but only if they had a clear historical enemy.

[Suppanut]

In case of outlast factions, I agree that they should in short campaign only if they were mortal enemy. Such as.

Rome vs Carthage
Rome vs Gauls and Indy Gauls
Macedon vs Seleucid vs Ptolemios (Diadochi war should by in long campaign due to very long long fight.)
Gauls vs Indy Gauls
GCS vs Indy Greeks

[Javolenus]

Hi There,

I can see the sense in the comments regarding 'outlive faction' for clear, historical mortal enemies - especially Rome and Carthage.

I also think that the short campaign should be based on taking a limited number of specific settlements, relating to a sort of 'unification of country'-type scenario.

And the long campaign could have VCs where a certain number of settlements need to be taken, including some specific ones, and in the case of historical mortal enemies, 'outlive faction' too.

[Suppanut]

I decided to revised conditions I already proposed by remove "Outlast faction" that not important out of short campaign. and I also add some for new factions.

Pontus:

Historically their ruler were Persian Satrap who take advantage from the fall of Alexander's Empire to declared themselves king and survived by powerplay in Diadochi war. Due to their faction's name "Pontus" originally mean Black sea so short term campaign not only need to secured Anatolia but also should controlled Black sea trade and naval power. Their long term goal would be rational to restore Archemenid glory of the past since their ruler were Persian anyway.

Short campaign(Lord of Pontus)
- Control all Anatolia (settlement: Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Trapezus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus)
- Control all Black Sea coast (settlement: Tomi, Seutopolis, Byzantium, Panticapaeum, Neapolis_Scythica, Chersonesos, Tanais, Olbia, Kotais)

Long Campaign(Archemenid inheritance of Pontus)
- Control all land of former Archemenid Empire (settlement: Cyrene, Alexandria, Siwa, Memphis, Thebes, Paraetonium, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus, Seleucia, Susa, Charax, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Ecbatana, Merv, Zadracarta, Gabae, Neh, Istakhr, Harmozia, Phra, Asaak, Hecatompylos, Apamea, Arbela, Bactra, Kophen, Buridava, Tomi, Seutopolis, Sardica, Byzantium, Amphipolis, Naissus, Kotais, Phraaspa, Armavir, Mtskheta, Albana, Amida, Satala, Thospia, Pura, Taxila, Alexandropolis, Khiva, Maracanda, Nisa, Kangha, Panticapaeum, Neapolis_Scythica, Chersonesos, Olbia, Meroe)
- Control all Black Sea coast (settlement: Tomi, Seutopolis, Byzantium, Panticapaeum, Neapolis_Scythica, Chersonesos, Tanais, Olbia, Kotais)
- Outlast Armenia
- Outlast Parthia


Armenia:

Historically their leader had Archemenid blood in their vein so they can truely declared rightful ruler of Archemenid made their long term to restore it. Short term goal shold be their historical sphere of influence and eliminated neighbour threat like Pontus and weakening the superpower like Seleucid.

Short Campaign(Lord of Ararat)
- Control Syria (settlement: Hatra, Antioch, Damascus)
- Control all Anatolia (settlement: Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Trapezus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus)
- Control south of Caucasus (settlement: Kotais, Phraaspa, Armavir, Mtskheta, Albana, Amida, Satala, Thospia)
- Control Media (settlement: Ecbatana)
- Control Mesopotamia (settlement: Seleucia, Susa, Charax)

Long Campaign(Archemenid inheritance of Armenia)
- Control all land of former Archemenid Empire (settlement: Cyrene, Alexandria, Siwa, Memphis, Thebes, Paraetonium, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus, Seleucia, Susa, Charax, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Ecbatana, Merv, Zadracarta, Gabae, Neh, Istakhr, Harmozia, Phra, Asaak, Hecatompylos, Apamea, Arbela, Bactra, Kophen, Buridava, Tomi, Seutopolis, Sardica, Byzantium, Amphipolis, Naissus, Kotais, Phraaspa, Armavir, Mtskheta, Albana, Amida, Satala, Thospia, Pura, Taxila, Alexandropolis, Khiva, Maracanda, Nisa, Kangha, Panticapaeum, Neapolis_Scythica, Chersonesos, Olbia, Meroe)
- Outlast Pontus
- Outlast Parthia


Parthia:

Historically Parthia just like adopt son of Archemenid due to they never have concrete link with Archemenid although they are persian speaking language. Their expansion of power just made them had right to inherited Archemnid legacy and champion for all Iranian people. Short term goal should be liberated all Persian kin and eliminated the most rightful pretender like Armenia while long term should be retore the former glory of Archemenid.

Short Campaign(Lord under Ahura-Mazda)
- Control Persia (settlement: Ecbatana, Merv, Zadracarta, Gabae, Neh, Istakhr, Harmozia, Phra, Asaak, Hecatompylos, Apamea, Arbela)
- Control Baktria (settlement: Bactra, Kophen)
- Control Silkroad (settlement; Khiva, Maracanda, Gushan, Kashgar, Chighu, Kangha)

Long Campaign(Archemenid inheritance of Pahlavan)
- Control all land of former Archemenid Empire (settlement: Cyrene, Alexandria, Siwa, Memphis, Thebes, Paraetonium, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus, Seleucia, Susa, Charax, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Ecbatana, Merv, Zadracarta, Gabae, Neh, Istakhr, Harmozia, Phra, Asaak, Hecatompylos, Apamea, Arbela, Bactra, Kophen, Buridava, Tomi, Seutopolis, Sardica, Byzantium, Amphipolis, Naissus, Kotais, Phraaspa, Armavir, Mtskheta, Albana, Amida, Satala, Thospia, Pura, Taxila, Alexandropolis, Khiva, Maracanda, Nisa, Kangha, Panticapaeum, Neapolis_Scythica, Chersonesos, Olbia, Meroe)
- Control Silkroad (settlement; Khiva, Maracanda, Gushan, Kashgar, Chighu, Kangha)
- Outlast Pontus
- Outlast Seleucid
- Outlast Armenia


Diadochi

Macedon, Seleucid, Ptolemios, all these three hellenistic faction have one thing in common, they all claimed to be rightful heir of Alexander the Great with some varient in their domestic goal due to the region of their power based.

Macedon

Short Campaign(Ruler of Aegean)
- Control Greek mainland and near by island of Rhodes and Crete (settlement: Ambracia, Pella, Larissa, Sparta, Athens, Patras, Corinth, Thebes-greek, Thermon, Rhodes, Kydonia)
- Control all Anatolia (settlement: Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Trapezus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus)

Long Campaign(Diadochus)
- Control all former Alexander's Empire (settlement: Cyrene, Alexandria, Siwa, Memphis, Thebes, Paraetonium, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus, Seleucia, Susa, Charax, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Ecbatana, Merv, Zadracarta, Gabae, Neh, Istakhr, Harmozia, Phra, Asaak, Hecatompylos, Apamea, Arbela, Bactra, Kophen, Buridava, Tomi, Seutopolis, Sardica, Byzantium, Amphipolis, Naissus, Armavir, Satala, Thospia, Ambracia, Pella, Larissa, Sparta, Athens, Patras, Corinth, Thebes-greek, Thermon, Rhodes, Kydonia, Salamis, Pura, Taxila, Alexandropolis)
- Outlast Seleucid
- Outlast Ptolemios


Seleucid

Short Campaign(Ruler of the East)
- Control south of Caucasus (settlement: Kotais, Phraaspa, Armavir, Mtskheta, Albana, Amida, Satala, Thospia)
- Control all Anatolia (settlement: Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Trapezus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus)
- Control Lavant (settlement: Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem)
- Control Mesopotamia (settlement: Seleucia, Susa, Charax)
- Control Persia (settlement: Ecbatana, Merv, Zadracarta, Gabae, Neh, Istakhr, Harmozia, Phra, Asaak, Hecatompylos, Apamea, Arbela)
- Control Baktria (settlement: Bactra, Kophen)

Long Campaign(Diadochus)
- Control Southern Caucasus (settlement: Kotais, Phraaspa, Armavir, Mtskheta, Albana, Amida, Satala, Thospia)
- Control all former Alexander's Empire (settlement: Cyrene, Alexandria, Siwa, Memphis, Thebes, Paraetonium, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus, Seleucia, Susa, Charax, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Ecbatana, Merv, Zadracarta, Gabae, Neh, Istakhr, Harmozia, Phra, Asaak, Hecatompylos, Apamea, Arbela, Bactra, Kophen, Buridava, Tomi, Seutopolis, Sardica, Byzantium, Amphipolis, Naissus, Armavir, Satala, Thospia, Ambracia, Pella, Larissa, Sparta, Athens, Patras, Corinth, Thebes-greek, Thermon, Rhodes, Kydonia, Salamis, Pura, Taxila, Alexandropolis)
- Outlast Seleucid
- Outlast Ptolemios


Ptolemios

Short Campaign(Ruler of the Niles and Red Sea)
- Control Western Arabia (settlement: Petra, Bostra, Carna, Mariaba, Tamna, Sabata)
- Control Eastern Africa (settlement: Cyrene, Alexandria, Siwa, Memphis, Thebes, Paraetonium, Pselchis, Campus_Blemmye, Meroe, Hibis, Opone)
- Control Lavant (settlement: Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem)
- Control all Anatolia (settlement: Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Trapezus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus)
- Control Mesopotamia (settlement: Seleucia, Susa, Charax)

Long Campaign(Diadochus)
- Control Western Arabia (settlement: Petra, Bostra, Carna, Mariaba, Tamna, Sabata)
- Control East Africa (settlement: Cyrene, Alexandria, Siwa, Memphis, Thebes, Paraetonium, Pselchis, Campus_Blemmye, Meroe, Hibis, Opone)
- Control all former Alexander's Empire (settlement: Cyrene, Alexandria, Siwa, Memphis, Thebes, Paraetonium, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus, Seleucia, Susa, Charax, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Ecbatana, Merv, Zadracarta, Gabae, Neh, Istakhr, Harmozia, Phra, Asaak, Hecatompylos, Apamea, Arbela, Bactra, Kophen, Buridava, Tomi, Seutopolis, Sardica, Byzantium, Amphipolis, Naissus, Armavir, Satala, Thospia, Ambracia, Pella, Larissa, Sparta, Athens, Patras, Corinth, Thebes-greek, Thermon, Rhodes, Kydonia, Salamis, Pura, Taxila, Alexandropolis)
- Outlast Seleucid
- Outlast Macedon


Baktria

Part Indian, part Greek and part Persian. They have spend their time historically conquer eastward into India while hold their western frontier quite firm. Baktrian local know for their loyalty to the Archemenid so control Persia heartland would guranteed that no other persian to claim their loyalty.

Short Campaign(Ruler of the Edge of the World)
- Control Persia (settlement: Ecbatana, Merv, Zadracarta, Gabae, Neh, Istakhr, Harmozia, Phra, Asaak, Hecatompylos, Apamea, Arbela)
- Control Baktria (settlement: Bactra, Kophen)
- Control India (settlement: Pura, patala, Taxila, Alexandropolis)
- Control Silkroad (settlement; Khiva, Maracanda, Gushan, Kashgar, Chighu, Kangha)

Long Campaign(Diadochus)
- Control all former Alexander's Empire (settlement: Cyrene, Alexandria, Siwa, Memphis, Thebes, Paraetonium, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus, Seleucia, Susa, Charax, Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem, Ecbatana, Merv, Zadracarta, Gabae, Neh, Istakhr, Harmozia, Phra, Asaak, Hecatompylos, Apamea, Arbela, Bactra, Kophen, Buridava, Tomi, Seutopolis, Sardica, Byzantium, Amphipolis, Naissus, Armavir, Satala, Thospia, Ambracia, Pella, Larissa, Sparta, Athens, Patras, Corinth, Thebes-greek, Thermon, Rhodes, Kydonia, Salamis, Pura, Taxila, Alexandropolis)
- Control India (settlement: Pura, patala, Taxila, Alexandropolis)
- Control Silkroad (settlement; Khiva, Maracanda, Gushan, Kashgar, Chighu, Kangha)
- Outlast Seleucid
- Outlast Ptolemios
- Outlast Macedon
- Outlast Parthia


Gauls& Indy Gauls

Celts people spent times that they not raid other people by powerplay among themselves. Although spread wide but they lack of unity, So their short and long term would be unification than other thing else.

Short Campaign(unification of Gauls)
- Control all Gauls (settlement: Samarobriva, Atuatuca, Cenabum, Darioritum, Vesontio, Vesontio, Avaricum, Lemonum, Iuvavum, Veldideno, Vienna, Gergovia, Burdigala, Massilia, Tolosa, Mediolanium, Patavium, Paetovio, Segesta)
- Outlast another Gauls faction

Long Campaign(Glory of all celts)
- Control all Gauls (settlement: Samarobriva, Atuatuca, Cenabum, Darioritum, Vesontio, Vesontio, Avaricum, Lemonum, Iuvavum, Veldideno, Vienna, Gergovia, Burdigala, Massilia, Tolosa, Mediolanium, Patavium, Paetovio, Segesta)
- Control eastern europe celts (settlement: Carrodunum, Eburonum, Leucaristus, Singidunum, Aquincum)
- Control Britannia (settlement: Isurium, Emain_Macha, Camulodunum, Atauna)
- Control Iberia (settlement: Tyde, Numantia, Oxtraca, Carthago_Nova, Gadir, Bocchoris, Saguntum, Baikor, Iruna, Arsa, Pallantia, Emporion)
- Control Amber Route regions (trade route that transport Amber from Baltic to Mediterranean. Settlement:???)(optional)
- Capture Rome
- Outlast another Gauls faction

Germans

They are overran Roman empire and live everywhere in western europe, Although this will happen late during post-XGM era but every germans' player would like to make it happen early for sure!

Short Campaign(germanic confaderate)
- Control germania and Baltic sea (settlement: Hafnia, Vicus_Aestii, Vicus_Fenni, Rugium, Phabiranum, Teutoburgum, Sumelocenna, Vicus_Venedae, Vicus_Tissagetae, Tulisurgium, Mattium, Burgaz_Sueones, Vicus_Careotae)
- Control eastern europe celts (settlement: Carrodunum, Eburonum, Leucaristus, Singidunum, Aquincum)
- incorperate Bastarnae (settlement: Vibantavarium)

Long Campaign(germans are everywhere)
- Control germania and Baltic sea (settlement: Hafnia, Vicus_Aestii, Vicus_Fenni, Rugium, Phabiranum, Teutoburgum, Sumelocenna, Vicus_Venedae, Vicus_Tissagetae, Tulisurgium, Mattium, Burgaz_Sueones, Vicus_Careotae)
- Control all Gauls (settlement: Samarobriva, Atuatuca, Cenabum, Darioritum, Vesontio, Vesontio, Avaricum, Lemonum, Iuvavum, Veldideno, Vienna, Gergovia, Burdigala, Massilia, Tolosa, Mediolanium, Patavium, Paetovio, Segesta)
- Control eastern europe celts (settlement: Carrodunum, Eburonum, Leucaristus, Singidunum, Aquincum)
- Control Britannia (settlement: Isurium, Emain_Macha, Camulodunum, Atauna)
- incorperate Bastarnae (settlement: Vibantavarium)
- Outlast Gauls
- Outlast Indy Gauls
- Outlast Thrace
- Outlast Spain
- Capture Rome

Spain

Although they not an ordinary barbarian, they historically lack of ambition and love to be defender of their economic and cultural power house than being outward expansionist. But look like we can't have peaceful condition for them to eliminated their historical threat would be rational choice.

Short Campaign(Throne of the Patriot, Debt that the invader must be paid)
- Control all Iberia (Settlement: Tyde, Numantia, Oxtraca, Carthago_Nova, Gadir, Saguntum, Baikor, Iruna, Arsa, Pallantia, Emporion
- Control West Mediterranean native land (Settlement: Caralis, Aleria, Bocchoris, Segesta)
- Capture Rome
- Capture Carthage

Long Campaign(Replace Rome for their glory, We are number one in West Mediterranean)
- Control all Iberia (Settlement: Tyde, Numantia, Oxtraca, Carthago_Nova, Gadir, Saguntum, Baikor, Iruna, Arsa, Pallantia, Emporion
- Control West Mediterranean native land (Settlement: Caralis, Aleria, Bocchoris, Segesta)
- Control all Gauls (settlement: Samarobriva, Atuatuca, Cenabum, Darioritum, Vesontio, Vesontio, Avaricum, Lemonum, Iuvavum, Veldideno, Vienna, Gergovia, Burdigala, Massilia, Tolosa, Mediolanium, Patavium, Paetovio, Segesta)
- Outlast Rome
- Outlast Carthage


Scythia

Steppe dweller have one advantage, very few that eye for their vast land. So Their short term victory condition would be hard to set since during these era they spent most of their time to tend their herd in steppe than being outward conqueror made them lack of mortal enemies and Rome still to far to be significant for them.

Short Campaign(Rise the Horde)
- Control Western Steppe (settlement: Campus_Siracae, Campus_Alanni, Campus_Roxolani, Vicus_Neuri, Tanais, Olbia, Vicus_Budinai, Campus_Iazyges, Campus_Legae, Campus_Aorsi, Campus_Iirkai)
- Control Eastern Steppe (settlement: Campus_Massagetae, Khiva, Maracanda, Nisa, Gushan, Kashgar, Chighu, Campus_Amyrgicum, Campus_Sakae, Kangha)
- Control Crimea (settlement: Panticapaeum, Neapolis_Scythica, Chersonesos)
- Capture at least 30 provinces(6 settlements more)

Long Campaign(Unleashed the Horde)
- Control Western Steppe (settlement: Campus_Siracae, Campus_Alanni, Campus_Roxolani, Vicus_Neuri, Tanais, Olbia, Vicus_Budinai, Campus_Iazyges, Campus_Legae, Campus_Aorsi, Campus_Iirkai)
- Control Eastern Steppe (settlement: Campus_Massagetae, Khiva, Maracanda, Nisa, Gushan, Kashgar, Chighu, Campus_Amyrgicum, Campus_Sakae, Kangha)
- Control Crimea (settlement: Panticapaeum, Neapolis_Scythica, Chersonesos)
- Outlast Parthia
- Outlast Thrace
- Outlast Germans
- Outlast Armenia


Saba

Political Hermit in the Desert. Although they are hermit their their political goal were very easy to set. First, the Arabia, second, Red Sea and East Africa, and third, Fertile Crescent.

Short Campaign(Monopoly of Red Sea Trade)
- Control all Arabia (settlement: Petra, Bostra, Carna, Mariaba, Tamna, Sabata, Gerra, Omana, Ubar)
- Control Eastern Africa (settlement: Cyrene, Alexandria, Siwa, Memphis, Thebes, Paraetonium, Pselchis, Campus_Blemmye, Meroe, Hibis, Opone)
- Capture at least 25 provinces(5 settlements more)

Long Campaign(New Semetic Empire of Fertile Cresent)
- Control all Arabia (settlement: Petra, Bostra, Carna, Mariaba, Tamna, Sabata, Gerra, Omana, Ubar)
- Control Eastern Africa (settlement: Cyrene, Alexandria, Siwa, Memphis, Thebes, Paraetonium, Pselchis, Campus_Blemmye, Meroe, Hibis, Opone)
- Control Lavant (settlement: Hatra, Antioch, Palmyra, Sidon, Damascus, Jerusalem)
- Control Mesopotamia (settlement: Seleucia, Susa, Charax)
- Capture at least 40 provinces(11 settlements more)

Thrace

Another not so ordinary barbarian, they had long term tie with Hellenic world and history of settle into Anatolia. Although lack of significant role, not hard to set their goal here.

Short Campaign(Greater Thrace)
- Control Thrace (settlement: Buridava, Tomi, Seutopolis, Sardica, Byzantium, Amphipolis, Naissus, Vibantavarium, Sarmizegetusa)
- Control Illyria (settlement: Aemona, Apollonia)
- Control all Anatolia (settlement: Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Trapezus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus)
- Control Cis-Carparthian land (settlement: Eburonum, Leucaristus, Singidunum, Aquincum, Paetovio)

Long Campaign(Hostile Hellenic take over)
- Control Thrace (settlement: Buridava, Tomi, Seutopolis, Sardica, Byzantium, Amphipolis, Naissus, Vibantavarium, Sarmizegetusa)
- Control Illyria (settlement: Aemona, Apollonia)
- Control all Anatolia (settlement: Sinope, Mazaka, Sesamus, Nicomedia, Ancyra, Tarsus, Sardis, Halicarnasus, Trapezus, Ipsus, Side, Amasia, Pergamum, Cyzicus, Ephesus)
- Control Greek mainland and near by island of Rhodes and Crete (settlement: Ambracia, Pella, Larissa, Sparta, Athens, Patras, Corinth, Thebes-greek, Thermon, Rhodes, Kydonia)
- Control Cis-Carparthian land (settlement: Eburonum, Leucaristus, Singidunum, Aquincum, Paetovio)
- incorperate Bastarnae (settlement: Vibantavarium)
- Capture at least 40 provinces(2 settlements more)