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Thread: Faction Thread - Serbia

  1. #101
    Matthæus's Avatar Knez Bribirski
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    Default Re: Faction Thread - Serbia

    Quote Originally Posted by Ataegina View Post
    Feudal Knights (mounted/dismounted)



    some constructive critics:

    there are some heraldic rules: when you have a coat of arms, you cant put crest on the shield (if you don't understand i will explain). put the shield only on the texture.

    PS
    "blue with fleur de lis" coat of arms are coa of Kotromanić family - they are royal family from Bosnia. that means they had a title of "ban" of "Banate of Bosnia" and later kings of "Kingdom of Bosnia". they belong to other state.

  2. #102

    Icon7 Re: Faction Thread - Serbia

    Quote Originally Posted by Ataegina View Post
    since the serbian are only totally conquered in late 16 century in my opinion i think they deserve some firearms, but lets wait for serbian for a better answer
    Serbia is totally conquered in the end of 15th century.And firearms were introduces in Serbia by Stefan Lazaravic,who ruled Serbia from 1389 till 1427 And I like your feudal knights Ataegina,nice job

  3. #103

    Default Re: Faction Thread - Serbia

    new preview

    Common sense removed due being Disruptive.

  4. #104
    Sarmatian's Avatar Biarchus
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    Default Re: Faction Thread - Serbia

    Quote Originally Posted by Ataegina View Post
    since the serbian are only totally conquered in late 16 century in my opinion i think they deserve some firearms, but lets wait for serbian for a better answer
    Serbian despotate fell in the middle of the 15th century, not 16th. But Serbia deserves some gunpowder units, considering "what if" scenario.

    Also, musketeers aren't proper for any faction since muskets weren't used until 17th century. Handgunners and later arqebusiers are more appropriate.

    Also, as tzar said, you should consider changing the CoA, as this one came into use only during Tsar Stefan Dusan rule, somewhere in the middle of the 14th century.


  5. #105

    Default Re: Faction Thread - Serbia

    well i've changed the coa on shields

    dont worry serbia ill not had any muskeeters,this was never in our minds, but yes we're going added arquebusiers, and handgunners, because we dont know how much longer serbia ill survive in campaign....

    about symbol in banners this is something we can change later,since this can be quickly changed
    Common sense removed due being Disruptive.

  6. #106

    Default Re: Faction Thread - Serbia

    Man this looks so great i cant even believe my eyes, but what the hell is with that Yellow, Red banner?
    i mean can SOME one proof that it REALLY was used by the serbian Nobles?

    Cause actually i cant stand it, in my opinion it gives me a feeling we are under byzantine rule?

    And as goes for a name for the Heavy Cavalry unit, ever thought of the name Konjacki Vitezovi, Horseman/Mounted Knights?
    And for the Infantry counter part, Vitezovi, Knights?

    To be honest, and i really dont mean anything offensive by this, This mod is so well balanced, cause as i saw in Tsardom Total War they werent actually balancing the army of Serbia, This mod in the contrary has REAL Heavy cavalry and Heavy infantry, they look like they are HEAVILY armoured and they are heavily armoured, not the fact i saw in Tsardom Total War, so as for my opinion which is minor, but though from a serb,

    Dont let any one stop your work mate, your work is on the good way, i cant wait till its done!

  7. #107
    Zephrelial's Avatar Eternal Sorrow
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    Default Re: Faction Thread - Serbia

    Quote Originally Posted by Ataegina View Post
    new preview


    It seems Serbia will be a very powerful faction Atty.. Any estimation how many units will they have excluding the artillery units such as cannons,trebuchets etc.?

    Among those units I liked the ones under the Pikemen best.
    Also I think what Vagna posted is worthy of consideration as a Serbian unit name: Konjacki Vitezovi
    Shine on you crazy diamond...

  8. #108

    Icon7 Re: Faction Thread - Serbia

    Quote Originally Posted by Vegna View Post
    Man this looks so great i cant even believe my eyes, but what the hell is with that Yellow, Red banner?
    i mean can SOME one proof that it REALLY was used by the serbian Nobles?

    Cause actually i cant stand it, in my opinion it gives me a feeling we are under byzantine rule?

    And as goes for a name for the Heavy Cavalry unit, ever thought of the name Konjacki Vitezovi, Horseman/Mounted Knights?
    And for the Infantry counter part, Vitezovi, Knights?
    Yellow red banner is one of the oldest Serbian flags and it's very similar to byzantine one,because Serbia was under the big influence of their southern neighbors.For some reall proof,you should visit Belgrade historical institute Don't you think it would be better to use word Konjanici (Horsemen) ? That sounds much better in serbian then Konjacki Vitezovi..for me

  9. #109
    Zephrelial's Avatar Eternal Sorrow
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    Default Re: Faction Thread - Serbia

    Quote Originally Posted by Vla_86 View Post
    Yellow red banner is one of the oldest Serbian flags and it's very similar to byzantine one,because Serbia was under the big influence of their southern neighbors.For some reall proof,you should visit Belgrade historical institute Don't you think it would be better to use word Konjanici (Horsemen) ? That sounds much better in serbian then Konjacki Vitezovi..for me
    But isn't Konjacki Vitezovi in Serbian?:hmmm:
    Shine on you crazy diamond...

  10. #110

    Icon7 Re: Faction Thread - Serbia

    Quote Originally Posted by Ataegina View Post
    new preview

    This looks really great,I like these crossbowmen very much,but you should remove pavese shild.There is no source,that serbian army used this kind of armour.There is a 15th century pavese shild in Belgrade military museum,but it belonged to the german mercenaries.

  11. #111

    Icon7 Re: Faction Thread - Serbia

    Quote Originally Posted by Zephrelial View Post
    But isn't Konjacki Vitezovi in Serbian?:hmmm:
    Yes,it is..But word Konjacki is very rarely used,almost none.In epic poems,stories and other historical sources,the word is Konjanici.My sugestion for Heavy cavarly unit would be Vitezovi Konjanici.And anyone who comes from Serbia,knows how much this sounds more natural and real.

  12. #112
    Zephrelial's Avatar Eternal Sorrow
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    Default Re: Faction Thread - Serbia

    Quote Originally Posted by Vla_86 View Post
    Yes,it is..But word Konjacki is very rarely used,almost none.In epic poems,stories and other historical sources,the word is Konjanici.My sugestion for Heavy cavarly unit would be Vitezovi Konjanici.And anyone who comes from Serbia,knows how much this sounds more natural and real.
    I see.Thanks for explaining.
    Shine on you crazy diamond...

  13. #113

    Default Re: Faction Thread - Serbia

    Quote Originally Posted by Vla_86 View Post
    Yellow red banner is one of the oldest Serbian flags and it's very similar to byzantine one,because Serbia was under the big influence of their southern neighbors.For some reall proof,you should visit Belgrade historical institute Don't you think it would be better to use word Konjanici (Horsemen) ? That sounds much better in serbian then Konjacki Vitezovi..for me
    Hahaha pardon me for that, but i cant help it neither for i grew up with more languages than only Serbian, other than that i can speak it fluently

    And yes on second thought Konjacki Vitezovi would sound more Medieval.
    Yer Konjacka/Konjacki is not a quite often used term but isnt it a bit sober to just name them Vitezovi?
    And yes i know its in serbian, does it matter?
    If so then the fact that the turkish soldiers Called Hashashim would make you reconsider be it in serbian or not, any how Vlastella is serbian aswell, so it actually doesnt matter whether its in serbian or english.. its all about which one sounds best and fits the unit in my opinion.

    Any way going back on topic, i found this, very strange, its quite something i wouldnt have expected to be serbian at all,
    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...eval_armor.jpg : Plate Armour?
    http://www.muzej.mod.gov.yu/zapadno%...19vek/5861.gif : Helmet
    http://www.muzej.mod.gov.yu/zapadno%...9vek/17302.gif : The back-side of an armour
    http://www.muzej.mod.gov.yu/zapadno%...da%2012966.jpg An Halberd Axe/spear


    Many people think serbia did not have heavy infantry units at her at her disposal, Only light infantry, but i do know they had many mercenaries who were infact heavily armoured, and i cannot quite believe they were only mounted?
    so let me remind you:

    In M2:TW The Byzantine army commonly uses Varangian Guard and Latinkon, and in this game Latinkon and Varangian Guard are the strongest units with out any modification, and Varangians are people from Scandinavia and her neighbouring countries, Latinkon unit was mostly made out of Normans and western europeans, so yes why wouldnt it be possible for serbia to have that aswell?
    Stefan Nenanjic was a quite rich king even though Serbia was a minor kingdom, so most likely he could have hired many mercenaries.

    As i saw above Vla_86 posted the pavise crossbow's isnt a possible theory for this mod, but you do know that the medieval serbia mostly had mercenaries at her disposal?
    I know that they did use german mercenaries for Heavy Cavalry, but that pavise shield did not get to serbia by it self now did it ?
    And for as i know by history i cant remember any germanic tribes attacking serbia, nor The Reich.
    So its not an outclosed theory.
    Last edited by Vegna; February 12, 2008 at 09:38 AM.

  14. #114

    Icon7 Re: Faction Thread - Serbia

    Quote Originally Posted by Vegna View Post

    And yes on second thought Konjacki Vitezovi would sound more Medieval.
    Yer Konjacka/Konjacki is not a quite often used term but isnt it a bit sober to just name them Vitezovi?
    And yes i know its in serbian, does it matter?
    If so then the fact that the turkish soldiers Called Hashashim would make you reconsider be it in serbian or not, any how Vlastella is serbian aswell, so it actually doesnt matter whether its in serbian or english.. its all about which one sounds best and fits the unit in my opinion.

    Any way going back on topic, i found this, very strange, its quite something i wouldnt have expected to be serbian at all,
    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...eval_armor.jpg
    http://www.muzej.mod.gov.yu/zapadno%...19vek/5861.gif


    Many people think serbia did not have heavy infantry units at her at her disposal, Only light infantry, but i do know they had many mercenaries who were infact heavily armoured, and i cannot quite believe they were only mounted?
    so let me remind you:


    As i saw above Vla_86 posted the pavise crossbow's isnt a possible theory for this mod, but you do know that the medieval serbia mostly had mercenaries at her disposal?
    I know that they did use german mercenaries for Heavy Cavalry, but that pavise shield did not get to serbia by it self now did it ?
    And for as i know by history i cant remember any germanic tribes attacking serbia, nor The Reich.
    So its not an outclosed theory.
    1)First of all,I am not sure,wheter Ataegina is gonna make the nativ names for all serbian units.And on the previous page,he was talking about it.

    2)That armour were used by Serbian knights in 15th century and the photo is taken in Belgrade Military museum.Armour is probably imported from Italy,so it isn't made in Serbia

    3)About the pavese and merceneries..I allready said,it belonged to the german merceneries(that's the museum description) So,if I am wrong,they are too.On page 2,I've posted the frescoe picture..where you can see a serbian crossbowman without pavese.Beside the german,Serbia also hired Aragonese heavy infantry as mercenaries
    P.S. You should try Latinkon against Gothic Knights...

  15. #115

    Default Re: Faction Thread - Serbia

    well actually you we can rename at least 4/5 units into serbian names and more 2 units and roster is done (beta version) also i can say its more bigger than some other factions (units avaliable)

    about details, well since we're working at same time with more than 1 faction, its easy make some mistakes, also sources aren't very clear sometimes, but this is something we can fix with time
    Common sense removed due being Disruptive.

  16. #116

    Default Re: Faction Thread - Serbia

    roster is done (for now), also i've set some names for the units more for not get lost,so ill need some names in serbia for:

    Serbian Archers(elite) : Heavy armoured archers
    Serbian Hussar
    Serbian Knights
    Serbian Lancers
    Serbian Dismounted lancers
    Balkan Nobles (fancy clothes/horsearcher)
    Tsar Knights (late unit, full armour,using gothic plate)
    Dismounted Tsar Knights (the same but dismounted)

    so names for this units in serbian are welcome !!
    Common sense removed due being Disruptive.

  17. #117

    Default Re: Faction Thread - Serbia

    Adrianople Battle VS eastern roman empire

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 







    Clear victory, next stop.....constatinople !!
    Common sense removed due being Disruptive.

  18. #118

    Default Re: Faction Thread - Serbia

    Quote Originally Posted by Vegna View Post
    And as goes for a name for the Heavy Cavalry unit, ever thought of the name Konjacki Vitezovi, Horseman/Mounted Knights?
    I dont know where did you dig up name "Konjacki Vitezovi" but it's not from serbian language (slovenian or slovakian maybe :hmmm: )
    Quote Originally Posted by Vegna View Post
    To be honest, and i really dont mean anything offensive by this, This mod is so well balanced, cause as i saw in Tsardom Total War they werent actually balancing the army of Serbia,
    Please don't judge unfinished product, and if you have anything to sagest please feel free and post it at Tsardoms sub-forum.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vegna View Post
    And yes on second thought Konjacki Vitezovi would sound more Medieval.
    Yer Konjacka/Konjacki is not a quite often used term but isnt it a bit sober to just name them Vitezovi?And yes i know its in serbian, does it matter?And yes i know its in serbian, does it matter?
    It's not about what sound more Medieval but what is accurate.


    Quote Originally Posted by Vegna View Post
    Many people think serbia did not have heavy infantry units at her at her disposal, Only light infantry, but i do know they had many mercenaries who were infact heavily armoured, and i cannot quite believe they were only mounted?
    Yes they used mercenaries, but here we are talking about serbian unit roster not mercenaries .
    The House of Wilpuri ~ Proud Patron of: The Noble Lord & Sumskilz


  19. #119

    Default Re: Faction Thread - Serbia

    honestly i dont know a king/kingdom wich have never used mercenaries in battles.....in special when war goes longer and mens at age starts lacking ....

    also please post in "real" serbian, i say this because i'm not serbian so for me,sounds all the same, and i dont want use slovak or sloven in this mod by mistake... (dont take it wrong)

    In M2:TW The Byzantine army commonly uses Varangian Guard and Latinkon, and in this game Latinkon and Varangian Guard are the strongest units with out any modification, and Varangians are people from Scandinavia and her neighbouring countries, Latinkon unit was mostly made out of Normans and western europeans, so yes why wouldnt it be possible for serbia to have that aswell?
    Hmmmm using latinkon for serbia ???
    Common sense removed due being Disruptive.

  20. #120

    Default Re: Faction Thread - Serbia

    Names you can use for Serbian Heavy Cavalry units

    • Vlastela Cavalry - Noble Cavalry - Bows and lances
    • Srpski Vitezovi - Serbian Knights - lances (late unit)
    • Carska Garda - Tzars Guard - maces and lances (because I see you will use name Tsardom of Serbia)
    • Red Zmaja - Order of the Dragon
    The House of Wilpuri ~ Proud Patron of: The Noble Lord & Sumskilz


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