Faction - Tsardom of Bulgaria

[phoenix[illusion]]

What about gunpowder in Bulgaria? cannons, catapults?

[NikeBG]

As far as I know, they appeared in Turkish times. There was a hypothesis that Despot Dobrotitsa (of the Karvuna Principality) eventually hired some few mercenaries with primitive handguns, but that's not provable enough. Actually, even the crossbows were still an extremely new innovation here - they started appearing exactly around the middle of the century, mainly in the garrisons of more important towns and fortresses.

[phoenix[illusion]]

So no hand-gunners for Bulgaria. or just to add them in later period

[alien_t]

About gunpowder & cannons - Kavhan Isbul's oppinion (see also posts bellow) He's obviously very well informed.

Regarding catapults(Source):

Vast quantity of catapults, battering-rams and other siege equipment were made, and the army had skilled siege engineers.[18] The main centres were the capital Tarnovo, Cherven[19], Sofia (copper)[20].

[NikeBG]

Yes, as the discussion in the linked thread suggests, adding gunpowder weapons appearing in a later stage (either by event or simply by highest tier of buildings) would be the logical thing to do. However, I still can't find a good enough translation for a "handgun" (and respectively for handgunners). I guess the closest would be the vague Streltsi/Стрелци, which literally means "shooters".
Also, cannon is Orădie/Оръдие (pl. Orădia/Оръдия). And catapults and other such standart siege machinery were naturally quite in development since the earliest of times (even before the FBE (Slavic tribes "inventing new types of machines of war" during their Balkan invasion), during the FBE (since the times of Krum and the Byzantine engineers he hired) and then during the SBE (Tsar Kaloyan f.e. built a special siege tower to conquer Varna)).

[phoenix[illusion]]

Yes, as the discussion in the linked thread suggests, adding gunpowder weapons appearing in a later stage (either by event or simply by highest tier of buildings) would be the logical thing to do. However, I still can't find a good enough translation for a "handgun" (and respectively for handgunners). I guess the closest would be the vague Streltsi/Стрелци, which literally means "shooters".
Also, cannon is Orădie/Оръдие (pl. Orădia/Оръдия). And catapults and other such standart siege machinery were naturally quite in development since the earliest of times (even before the FBE (Slavic tribes "inventing new types of machines of war" during their Balkan invasion), during the FBE (since the times of Krum and the Byzantine engineers he hired) and then during the SBE (Tsar Kaloyan f.e. built a special siege tower to conquer Varna)).

Agree with that. Well than cannons and handgunners will be able to hire on the highest level of buildings.
Strelci (streltsi) would be more for bowmen in Serbian. Even in serbian, there is no translation for handgunners

[phoenix[illusion]]

What about population and religion in Tarnovo, Badin, Sredec, Plovdiv, Drastar, Varna? How many people have lived in 1345/46. in these cites and procent of every religion (Orthodox, Chatolics, Islam, Krstjani)

[NikeBG]

I have no numbers for the population, so I can only correlate them to each other - Tarnovo>Plovdiv>Varna>Drastar>Bdin>Sredec. Tarnovo and Plovdiv should be quite big, Varna would be a bit smaller, but still big enough (major port on the Black Sea would create a bigger population), while Drastar, Bdin and Sredec would probably be around the same level (smaller than Varna).
As for the religion, it's again mainly my guess-work - but, first, one question - do the Krstjani include also the Bulgarian Bogomils or only the Bosnian ones? Anyway, I'll list them as Bogomils and would include in them also the other minor heresies (Adamites etc)
- Tarnovo - ~8% Bogomils, ~7% Jews, ~4% Catholics, ~1% Muslims, ~80% Orthodox
- Plovdiv - ~5% Bogomils, ~4% Jews, ~2% Catholics, ~1% Muslims, ~88% Orthodox
- Varna - ~3% Bogomils, ~4% Jews, ~10% Catholics, ~1% Muslims, ~82% Orthodox
- Drastar - ~4% Bogomils, ~2% Jews, ~4% Catholics, ~1% Muslims, ~89% Orthodox
- Bdin - ~3% Bogomils, ~3% Jews, ~8% Catholics, ~1% Muslims, ~85% Orthodox
- Sredec - ~5% Bogomils, ~2% Jews, ~1% Catholics, ~1% Muslims, ~91% Orthodox

[alien_t]

...Tarnovo and Plovdiv should be quite big..

I searched too but didn't find any concrete numbers. Only according to Gregory Tsamblak (source in bulgarian):

Варварският цар[9](Bayezid I), възгордян от победите си и от завладяването на много народи, понеже беше слушал за Търново, за голямото му величие, за твърдостта на стените му, за красотата му и за самото му местоположение - извънредно труден за превзе*мане, защото освен стени притежаваше достатъчно и естествени крепости, а освен това - големи богатства и многобройно население с велика слава както в църковните, така и в царските дела..

Translation:

Barbarian king(Bayezid I), proud of his victories and the conquest of many nations, because he had heard about Tarnovo, about it's greatness, hardness of its walls, it's beauty and its location - extremely difficult to capture, because except walls it has also and natural fortresses, and besides that - great wealth and large population with great fame both in church and in royal matters...

BTW, I doubt somebody could say the exact number of population in the end of SBE, simply because when Turks came, they burned and destroyed almost everything - churches(and their archives), documents...etc.
Here it's one Demographic and Ethnographic Study, but it's about XV century and is pretty general. This is the most useful info from it, I think.

The total value in figures of the human losses that the nationality has suffered is not measured only in absolute figures. That value should be brought into proper correlation with the total number of the population available towards the end of. the XV century (Bulgarian population, of course). The main document that we can use for the purposes of our calculations are the accounting pay rolls (pay bills) of the Ottoman fisc concerning the tax imposed on the Christians (the so called "djizie") towards 1490. After the analysis of this document the following figures are obtained: 890 000 people in 178 000 households. Upon comparing these figures with the losses of population, established here above — 360 000 in 68 000 households — it is evident that the nationality has suffered a demographic catastrophe towards the end of the XV century.

So in the end of XIV cent should be 890 000 + 360 000= 1 250 000 people total population according to the author, although he also says(in bulgarian)

Comparison between the available population to 1490 (890 000) and disappeared in a period of 60 years of the XIV century to 1493 (360 000) does not give any statistical base for calculation of the population in the XIV century. The only reasonable conclusion is only that the losses are large [291].

[NikeBG]

Well, if we're talking about the population of the whole state, many calculations have been made with different methods and different results. Here is one thread in a Bulgarian forum (on Bulgarian) which debated about it and had the following numbers:
700AD - 800 000
800AD - 900 000
900AD - 1 400 000
1000AD - 1 300 000
1100AD - 1 300 000
1 200AD - 2 000 000
1 300AD - 2 200 000
1340AD - 2 500 000
1350AD - 2 000 000
1400AD - 1 600 000
1 500AD - 1 750 000

But I don't think such numbers would be very helpful, especially since they're guesstimates as well...


Еdit: Alien_t sent me a great research (on Bulgarian) which can be used to give some more accurate (though still aproximate) numbers for the towns, though I don't really have the time to check it more thoroughly. But from a quick read I see that Bdin, Drastar and Sredec might have actually been bigger than I thought.
Also, some preliminary numbers based on a quick glance from the research (which is about the XV century, i.e. after the great depopulation of the Black Death and the Ottoman invasion):
- Tarnovo - 15-20 000
- Plovdiv - 20-25 000
- Bdin - 10-15 000
- Sredec - 10-15 000
- Drastar - 7-8 000
- Varna - 7-8 000

[phoenix[illusion]]

lovely information. tnx mates!

[NikeBG]

Ok, after checking together with Alien_t the research a bit more thoroughly, I've updated my previous post with the town's estimated populations. It seems that Plovdiv was possibly even bigger than Tarnovo, though it's also possible that Tarnovo itself might be more than I've given it.

[phoenix[illusion]]

and now for the end of bulgarian faction, can you post me list of buildings that were in each city/castle of bulgaia (archery range, barrack, blacksmith, harbor etc.)
and which town was city, which castle?

[VINC.XXIII]

I have read that the Ban Kulin him-self had been a bogumil during the 13century, and forced to come back in the christian Church.

[NikeBG]

Well, like with all the other settlements, most of them historically had blacksmiths, barracks etc. and it's only the gameplay limitations that should define their starting distribution. As for the ports - Drastar and Varna. Especially Varna, since that's the main Venetian port (and generally the main Bulgarian harbor) in the area, around that time (1346-1347) was established a Venetian consulate in Varna etc (that's why I've also given it an increased ammount of Catholics). Most Genoese ports (Varna, Vichina, Likostomo, Mavrokastro, Kilia etc, though the biggest Genoese port in the Black Sea was in Kaffa in the Crimean Peninsula) are also in its region. Drastar had a port on the Danube (though not as big as Varna's and Vichina's) and some of the other Black Sea ports (Nesebar, Sozopol, Anchialo etc) are also in its province.
As for the castle/town division - Tarnovo was both (i.e. heavily fortified, but also with large population), but as a capital should be a town. Plovdiv was mostly a town, Varna was also mostly a sea-town (though it can be made a castle for balance-purposes). Bdin, Sredec and Drastar can be made in castles. So, perhaps 2 towns (Tarnovo and Plovdiv) and 4 castles (Varna, Bdin, Sredec, Drastar)? Or 3 towns (Tarnovo, Plovdiv and Varna) and 3 castles (Bdin, Sredec, Drastar)?

[The Noble Lord]

It would be great if (at least) Bulgarian faction gets developed ans sees the light of the day, considering the fact that mod will never be completed!

[Matthæus]

It would be great if (at least) Bulgarian faction gets developed ans sees the light of the day, considering the fact that mod will never be completed!

well there is a rumor that tsardoms actually might be completed .

[Kara Kolyo]

Niice! we on the Balkans are quite fond of rumors and they usually prove right

[slavic_crusader]

i dont think tarnovo should be a town. But perhaps we can do a smilar thing in that russian mod- i forgot the name. like the city then the fortress behind it. Hope u generally get one im saying. And i also u guys can do this too

[Kavhan Isbul]

In reality, all of these were towns, of course.

Turnovo was likely the largest town in Bulgaria in terms of population in the mid 14th century, so I guess it would make sense that it is a city.

While I do not know much about other industries, it appears that both Turnovo and Sofia were arms manufacturing centers. Sofia makes a lot of sense, as there were some iron deposits to the South, such as Samokov, where Saxon miners settled.

There was a thread on economy where an innovative system of having control over resources was going to be introduced, but I am not sure that is still in the works. If it is, this will tie in well together, making Sofia a place where the BUlgarian faction will have access to heavier armored units, which may not be available elsewhere.