Faction - Kingdom of Hungary

[vilil]

Would love to, but I can't read Hungarian. Can I find it somewhere, in English?

[snipa]

Would love to, but I can't read Hungarian. Can I find it somewhere, in English?

its not english but mainly latin! of course there are some which are created by old hungarian language!

sorry for me but i do not know where is an english version in internet!

[Romano-Dacis]

PS:when i try to find for u a good description about Ispán-Vajda in http://www.hungarian-history.hu what u offered me. I found this: http://www.hungarian-history.hu/lib/faf/toc05.htm
thanx this is a realy good place!

I'll put this in spoiler tags since it's off-topic, but you brought it up:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Actually I suggested hungarian-history.hu since it is the website with the most nationalistic Hungarian content, and therefore, I figured if there is any anti-Romanian, Hungarian-nationalist argument it is on that website . With titles like "THE DACO-ROMAN LEGEND" and "Transylvania: Balkan or Europe?" I would imagine it is the natural congrogating place for all Roeslerites. BTW, Lajos Kazar (the author of the book whose chapter you pointed to) is hardly an unbiased source, and hardly a source of any kind at all. I always found it funny that he used churches as a sign of age of habitation, as if the Romanians were allowed to build Orthodox churches.

But really, nothing more needs to be stated than one exerpt out of countless similar ones:
"after the Central Powers had lost WW I, the Vlachs/Rumanians of "Transylvania proclaimed union with the Kingdom of Rumania at Gyulafehérvár, Rumanian Alba Iulia, on Dec. 1st. 1918. As to the rights of the national minorities in the annexed territory, THE BRITISH ENCYCLOPAEDIA remarks: ,,Saxon and Magyar minorities are guaranteed absolute political freedom". That guarantee was a shameless lie from the very beginning."

Oh yes, such a shameless lie, because the Hungarians had their own political party after 1918, and have been a part of the Romanian governing coalition since 1989.

Other arguments are downright false.

"Otherwise how it is explained that the Rumanian language does not contain a single loan word from the Germanic languages..."

When in fact Romanian does have quite a few Germanic loan words, including "lautar" for singer/bard, coming from "lauter" (loud).

or how about:
"It was exactly the 1848 Hungarian legislation which wiped out serfdom in Transylvania, too, and gave decent areas of land, free of charge, to all former Wallachian serfs, while in the areas of former Wallachia and Moldavia serfdom survived until 1864"

Yeah, except Wallachia and Moldavia got rid of serfdom in 1746 and 1749 respectively. All these quotes are literally from only half a page of reading, so it's not like I'm hunting for these statements. The guy has literally no clue what he's writing about.

A far better source: http://www.istoriatransilvaniei.ro/

The word "Transylvania" appeared for the first time in the l7th century, when under Western pressure the official language of the administration became the Latin.

You're telling me the Hungarians didn't use Latin as their court language? I wonder what language "comitas" is written in, or even what most of the documents of Hungary in books like Codex Diplomaticus are written in, maybe space-Hungarian? Transylvania is a very old and proper medieval name actually. Even in Gesta Hungarorum we see quite clearly "Transilvanum regnum... latissum et opulentissimum." chapter XXIV. 'Nuff said.

[snipa]

"The Hungarians had established their rule over the region of Transylvania firmly since 1003AD, when Saint Stephen formed an ispán, or Comes as they were known in the Latin used by the nobility in the time, in the old Roman Apulium (Gyulafehérvár), thus setting up a mirror system of Comitatuses (megyék) managed by Comes (ispáns and foispáns) as was used in Hungary proper, with a few key differences. The fact that Transylvania lay on the far eastern border of the Kingdom of hungary meant that it was subject to the waves of aggresive immigrants from the east like the Cumans, and the Kypchaqs and so on. To accomodate this the Come of the region of Alba (Fehér) was appointed as the over-arching administrator of the region of Transylvania. Until 1193 the term Vajda never appears, and instead this administrator appears to have been reffered to as the ispán. From the founding of the Comes system the ispáns of Szolnok (Doboka) and of Alba allernated between one another as the administrator of Transylvania. This ceased in 1263, when the roles of the Comes of Alba and Szolnok were terminated, along with the gradual reformation of the comitatuses from royal to noble ones. From this point all the Comes of the Comitatuses of Transylvania were subject to the authority of the Vajda, who had the right to appoint them and call local assemblies in which unique Transylvanian laws were passed. These laws had to be affirmed by the King, and could not directly contradict the laws of Hungary proper. The first Vajda is recorded as being Zoltán Erdoelue a relative of King Stephen. By the 14th century the three most imortant people in Transylvanian politics were the Vajda, the Bishop of Transylvania and the Abbot of Kolozsmonostor (outskirt of present day Cluj-Napoca)."

Quoted from a post I made ages ago. Thats were I stand in the argument.

u are right Vazul!

[Csatádi]

I see you have a lot of free time.
What is the subject of this noble contest?
The title of the Transylvanian ruler in 1350?

[snipa]

i found a good description about Transylvania in english!

Royal Counties in Transylvania
http://mek.oszk.hu/03400/03407/html/70.html

some from Anonymous (Romano u always use him to prove your statments...)
http://mek.oszk.hu/03400/03407/html/59.html

only for reading:
http://mek.oszk.hu/03400/03407/html/73.html
http://mek.oszk.hu/03400/03407/html/74.html

Romano maybe u should rethinking what u read from your history book...

[Romano-Dacis]

Yes, but that was decided as being voievod/vajda. We were just arguing foundation dates for this title. The argument we're having can be summed up as "was Leustachius a voievod or an ispan?" Merely typing in "1176 Leustachius" in Google produces 6 pages of results (mostly Romanian) which say he was a voievod. The link which snipa provided does not cover what Leustachius's official title was. We know we was the comite/ispan of Dabaca earlier on.

It's only the difference of one ruler (since Leustachius reigned until 1199, when we all agree that the title of vajda/voievod was used afterwards). It's not even that important but I'm still interested. I'd at least like a Hungarian or preferably English site which mentions Leustachius and his titles.

Snipa, I don't see why you want to keep the argument about Daco-Roman continuity going. In any case, I've sent you your reply via PM. Stop posting about that subject or it will be deleted.

[Csatádi]

Bah! And what significance has the first mentioning of the title vajda/voivode?
Anyhow it is far before the mod starts.

[snipa]

I see you have a lot of free time.
What is the subject of this noble contest?
The title of the Transylvanian ruler in 1350?

Lackfi István 1344-1350 appointed by I. Nagy Lajos (Anjou)
Gönyüi Tamás 1350-1351 appointed by I. Nagy Lajos (Anjou)

i suppose u want to know what was the title of Lackfi! because he was a famous hungarian hero!

Lackfi András (? – 1359): royal representative of Erdély(vajda). His father: Kerekegyházi Lack king's advisor.
titles:
- 1344-1350 royal representative of Erdély
- 1345 battle against Tatars, Hungarian army totaly defeated Tatars led by Lackfi in Erdély
- 1345 - 1352 ispán of szeklers,
- 1350 – 52 royal representative of Napole (italy, Napole was conquered by kingdom of hungary, one of hungarian armies was led by Lackfi)
- 1353 – 54 bán of macsó,
- 1355 – 56 ispán of sopron
- 1356-1359 again royal representative in Erdély ti his die

so for your question in 1350 he had the following titles: ispán of szeklers, royal representative of Napole, royal representative of Erdély

correct?

[Csatádi]

I suppose you checked it. I'm lazy to do it.

The Lackfi family played a significant role in the history of Hungary in the 14th century so they must be in the mod.
Btw I don't remember the starting year.

[snipa]

Yes, but that was decided as being voievod/vajda. We were just arguing foundation dates for this title. The argument we're having can be summed up as "was Leustachius a voievod or an ispan?" Merely typing in "1176 Leustachius" in Google produces 6 pages of results (mostly Romanian) which say he was a voievod. The link which snipa provided does not cover what Leustachius's official title was. We know we was the comite/ispan of Dabaca earlier on.

The title voivode (voivoda in Latin) appears in documents only at the end of the 12th century; earlier sources, dating from 1177 and 1183, refer to the ispán (count) of Fehérvár. There are two subsequent references (in 1200 and 1201) to the voivode being also the count of Fehérvár; thereafter, only the title 'voivode' appears. (one of english sources: http://mek.oszk.hu/03400/03407/html/70.html)
So according to the history its not a question what was Lesták's title in 1176!

as i explained u many times if u search on internet from royal representativs of Erdély u'll find only vajda title! As u did it and u found 6 pages... But if we want to use the correct title we have to say the royal representatives of Erdély was called like Ispán to 1201 !
i do not want 2 count how many times i wrote u here!
seems to me its realy difficult for a foreign enquirer...

It's only the difference of one ruler (since Leustachius reigned until 1199, when we all agree that the title of vajda/voievod was used afterwards). It's not even that important but I'm still interested. I'd at least like a Hungarian or preferably English site which mentions Leustachius and his titles.

i help u! it was ispán of fehérvár!

Snipa, I don't see why you want to keep the argument about Daco-Roman continuity going. In any case, I've sent you your reply via PM. Stop posting about that subject or it will be deleted.

if i good remember for your post u also linked some rumanian history links... or not?
my links are realy good readings for people who want to know more from kingdom of Hungary in english...

[snipa]

Bah! And what significance has the first mentioning of the title vajda/voivode?
Anyhow it is far before the mod starts.

the first mentioning of the title vajda/voivode?

hehe is it a test?

this word voeivode was come from slav language: „vojevoda” which mean "general".
It was the same with hungarian "Gyula" title which was the 2nd rank in hungarian rank system. "Gyula" was the military leader of a hungarian tribe.

the first mention about vajda/voeivod probably from memorial of emperor of Byzance: who wrote his memorials of Settlement of the Magyars in Hungary.
He named all of hungarian military leaders like „vojevoda”.

the case probably was:
Hungarians sold many slavs slavers to Byzance, this slavers gave informations about hungarians to Byzance. They(slav slavers) named the hungarians "gyulas" (military leaders) like „vojevoda” (general) in their slavs language.

correct?

[Csatádi]

Test?
The events you mention are from the 9-10th century. The mod starts in 1345 (as finally I discovered under the grey line). So wtf?

[snipa]

Test?
The events you mention are from the 9-10th century. The mod starts in 1345 (as finally I discovered under the grey line). So wtf?

it was just a joke! i used a little part of your sentence!

[Kavhan Isbul]

btw I have no informations when and how die Simeon. Do u know something about this?

He died peacefully at an old age (60+) long time before the events in this mod. I promise, this was the last off topic from me in this thread.

[Romano-Dacis]

VLAD, your post risks provoking another off-topic argument and is also out of the timeframe of the mod. Keep the discussion within the 1345-1530 era.

A design question: should major revolts (Bobalna, Hussites, Doja's revolt etc.) be scripted into the campaign or should it be left up to the player to determine if they ever happen or not?

[snipa]

A design question: should major revolts (Bobalna, Hussites, Doja's revolt etc.) be scripted into the campaign or should it be left up to the player to determine if they ever happen or not?

Major revolts should be scripted...

[Romano-Dacis]

When are the szecklers first mentioned in written documents? Surely it must be before Simeon of Keza, no?

[il_duce_!]

No more off topic discussion, I will delete everything non related to the mod.

[Romano-Dacis]

Alright, I edited out the off-topic part. I'll send it by PM.