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Thread: Princes, Kings and Heroes - Mod Info and FAQ

  1. #1
    wilddog's Avatar Paintedwolves run free
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    Default Princes, Kings and Heroes - Mod Info and FAQ

    This is intended as an information page where links to other posts can be added with more information as time allows. I hope you enjoy.

    Princes, Kings and Heroes is set in the period from 1280 to 1330. This was a very turbulent time in Britain being only a short time after the end of the rebellion by Simon de Montfort and the start of the reign of Edward I.

    Historical Context:
    The period is set just 3 years after the first Welsh war and covers the defeat of the last true Welsh prince and death of his troublesome brother Dafydd who was hung drawn and quartered.

    It also covers the Scottish 1st War of independence and the rise of the Bruces. This led to their attempted invasion of Ireland which ended with the death of Robert Bruce’s brother Edward.

    As the period progressed several of the English Earls revolted against Edward II and his favourites. This saw several leading families rise spectacularly and then fall just as quickly. The king’s favourites were captured and hung or beheaded. Many of the Earls were killed, either in battle, executed or imprisoned. Edward II was captured and murdered with a hot poker at Berkeley castle. Roger Mortimer took Edward’s queen, Isabella, as his mistress and reigned in all but name until he too was brought down and executed by Edward III…. which is where the mod ends.

    The Mod:
    This mod aims to bring together the major factions involved at the time in an enjoyable bit of history hokum and game play. Its concept is that you lead your family house to ever greater riches and power whilst following the medieval virtues of Feudalism, Family loyalty and the need to ensure a successful male line.

    The Family houses and factions:
    The mod is planned around the following factions 27 factions (including rebels)

    English – 16 Houses of which 15 are playable
    Scottish – 4 Houses of which 3 are playable
    Wales – 1 faction
    Ireland - 4 factions
    France – 1 faction
    and of course the rebels.

    English Houses – 16 Houses
    The House of Plantagenet – the English King – this is non playable.
    The house of Lancaster
    The House of Cornwall of Cornwall
    The House of Mortimer
    The House of de Valence
    The House of Beauchamp
    The House of Bigod
    The House of de Clare
    The House of de Lacy
    The House of de Bohun
    The House of Percy
    The House of Fitzgerald
    The House of de Burgh
    The House of Fitzalan
    The House of de Warenne
    The House of de Vere

    Scottish Houses - 4 Houses
    The House of Canmore - The Scottish King – this is non playable
    The House of Comyn
    The House of Bruce
    The House of Balliol
    ( OK, I know these are more English than Scottish in some cases but for game play I allocate them this way and their English lands have been removed/reduced).

    Wales – 1 Faction
    Gwynedd – represents Llywelyn ap Gruffudd and the house of Aberffraw
    (sorry not enough room to allow any South Wales Factions in.)

    France – 1 Faction
    (I’m not planning to go into a lot of detail on this. They’re in as a threat to the English south coast and due to the French wars that Edward I fought)..

    Ireland - 4 Factions
    O’Connor
    O’Neil
    O’Brien
    McCarthy
    (I’m not planning to go into a lot of detail on these … sorry it’s just a time thing). I’m also not going down a Gaelic naming route.

    The Map:
    The map and content is a reasonable approximation for Britain in this time period. It is not trying to be 100% accurate. I tend to follow some basic rules on map making which simply preclude that. As an example I always aim to set up any settlement at least 2 tiles from a river crossing point to avoid things like besieging towns from a bridge!
    Size of towns are being set up according to estimates and studies for that time period. London of course will be downgraded as the game can’t easily handle that size population.

    The map is a 300*300 tile size so is a reasonable size. I may release other maps for this in later versions. For information on map see the following link:
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=139401

    Resources
    There are new resources added to the campaign. Some are new models some are just tweaks to existing models.


    Interface Graphics
    A new set of loading screens is being developed to help try and promote more of a medieval feel to the mod. For views and comments see the following link:
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=139432

    Scripting
    This is where I'll build up some links to scripting items:

    Titles
    There is no plan for a hereditary mod here. Basically the faction leader holds the titles until he dies then comes the need to pay Feudal Relief if applicable for the new faction leader to inherit. For more info or to discuss see link below

    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=141875
    Last edited by wilddog; May 02, 2009 at 03:57 PM. Reason: miss spelling

  2. #2
    Konstantin I's Avatar Civis
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    Default Re: Princes, Kings and Heroes - Mod Info and FAQ

    OK! This are my questions for now:

    1. The PKH mod is 50 years long, but how much turns per year was planned out?

    2. What is the main goal? To conquer some number of provinces or may be something different?

    3. Is it possible to recreate England, Ireland, Scotland and Wales? ... like Kalmar union in Teutonic campaign? :hmmm:

  3. #3
    wilddog's Avatar Paintedwolves run free
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    Default Re: Princes, Kings and Heroes - Mod Info and FAQ

    1. The PKH mod is 50 years long, but how much turns per year was planned out?
    It's set at the moment at 4 turns per year. This was mainly due to an issue in triggering immediate historic events as that never worked with a factor less than 0.25 turns per year. However as that's no longer a problem I may extend the turns per year depending on playability or request. Of course extending turns per go essentially can make the game harder for the Human player see below!

    2. What is the main goal? To conquer some number of provinces or may be something different?
    Essentially its to expand your family possessions (ie conquer provinces). There will be faction specific goals. I haven't sorted out exact victory conditions yet and for some the real prize may still be a crown. However the essential thing is to survive. The English, Scottish and Welsh factions lose if their surviving male heir is wiped out (i.e. has not reached adulthood or none exist). Adoptions or non true members don't help you even if one of them 'temporarily' becomes your faction leader. There's obviously conditions before this rule comes into effect but trying to get lots of adoptions doesn't help you - actually its counter productive.

    3. Is it possible to recreate England, Ireland, Scotland and Wales? ... like Kalmar union in Teutonic campaign?
    I need to have a look at this to see what you mean exactly.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Princes, Kings and Heroes - Mod Info and FAQ

    I need to have a look at this to see what you mean exactly.
    I'm guessing he means whether your faction can "become" England, Wales etc. eg. if you conquer every territory associated with that faction (as in Crusader Kings or something) I'm not sure if you need extra slots for that.

    I’m also not going down a Gaelic naming route.
    Just curious, what exactly do you mean here? Fair enough they aren't the focus of the mod, but is it really so hard to get, say, the CNP Irish namelist?

    Also, are the French playable?

    Anyway, best of luck with it, you've done amazing work so far.

    Antagonist
    "is ait an mac an saol"

    "If you grow tired of how you live, then follow me, and we will show you a different way."

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  5. #5
    Konstantin I's Avatar Civis
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    Default Re: Princes, Kings and Heroes - Mod Info and FAQ

    Quote Originally Posted by wilddog View Post
    It's set at the moment at 4 turns per year. This was mainly due to an issue in triggering immediate historic events as that never worked with a factor less than 0.25 turns per year. However as that's no longer a problem I may extend the turns per year depending on playability or request. Of course extending turns per go essentially can make the game harder for the Human player see below!
    This will be a blitzkrieg If somebody wants to conquer all British isles for 200 turns

    Essentially its to expand your family possessions (ie conquer provinces). There will be faction specific goals. I haven't sorted out exact victory conditions yet and for some the real prize may still be a crown. However the essential thing is to survive. The English, Scottish and Welsh factions lose if their surviving male heir is wiped out (i.e. has not reached adulthood or none exist). Adoptions or non true members don't help you even if one of them 'temporarily' becomes your faction leader. There's obviously conditions before this rule comes into effect but trying to get lots of adoptions doesn't help you - actually its counter productive.
    I'm agreed with you, because I don't like adoptions in family trees The royal blood has been very important in the medieval times. It's possible to eliminate adoptions from the game and put generals to be recruiteble from specific buildings, like Military Academy? :hmmm:

    I need to have a look at this to see what you mean exactly.
    See Antagonist explanation

  6. #6
    wilddog's Avatar Paintedwolves run free
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    Default Re: Princes, Kings and Heroes - Mod Info and FAQ

    This will be a blitzkrieg If somebody wants to conquer all British isles for 200 turns
    I doubt you will be able to conquer anything like that in the time period.

    It's possible to eliminate adoptions from the game and put generals to be recruitable from specific buildings, like Military Academy?
    I don't think its possible to stop adoptions as such. There are fairly obvious methods though for reducing adoptions.

    I'll have to look into the ability to generate any by building general units but they won't be true family members so its not a priority for me.

    I'm guessing he means whether your faction can "become" England, Wales etc. eg. if you conquer every territory associated with that faction (as in Crusader Kings or something) I'm not sure if you need extra slots for that.
    I may look to do something for the Scottish factions. Unlikely I'll do it for the other factions.

    I’m also not going down a Gaelic naming route.
    Just curious, what exactly do you mean here? Fair enough they aren't the focus of the mod, but is it really so hard to get, say, the CNP Irish namelist?
    True, Like most things in life they're not hard its a question of time and effort. I just meant I'm not intending go down a route of changing every name, person, place etc to be its Gaelic name.

    Also, are the French playable?
    Yes

  7. #7
    Konstantin I's Avatar Civis
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    Default Re: Princes, Kings and Heroes - Mod Info and FAQ

    I don't think its possible to stop adoptions as such. There are fairly obvious methods though for reducing adoptions.

    I'll have to look into the ability to generate any by building general units but they won't be true family members so its not a priority for me.
    Another idea is adopted generals do not be family members? :hmmm:The major problem is who will be the next king? Of course this will be the king's son, but if his son is under age? What will happen? One of the adopted generals will become a prince Probably this will be the end of the royal dynasty.

    I may look to do something for the Scottish factions. Unlikely I'll do it for the other factions.
    The idea is when you playing with Scottish house and conquer all Scottish lands or unite all Scottish factions in one faction - Scotland For English and Irish factions must be the same, like Scottish factions
    This will expand the goals in to the game, because everybody wants to be King of England, King of Scotland or King of Ireland

  8. #8
    wilddog's Avatar Paintedwolves run free
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    Default Re: Princes, Kings and Heroes - Mod Info and FAQ

    Another idea is adopted generals do not be family members? The major problem is who will be the next king? Of course this will be the king's son, but if his son is under age? What will happen? One of the adopted generals will become a prince Probably this will be the end of the royal dynasty.
    Once the preset conditions have expired then if there is no true family member who has made it to being a general i.e. none exist or they are underage then yes you lose.
    You can't control the initial selection of heir so there will be times when your faction leader may have a non family member Faction "leader".
    This is already scripted. The Adopted generals thing has also been taken care of so they don't affect this. Don't worry about this.

    This will expand the goals in to the game, because everybody wants to be King of England, King of Scotland or King of Ireland
    This is mixing two concepts. Being King or being England with an implication of both. You're playing as faction houses. For Scotland the setup is fairly straight forward. However, for England its a bit more complicated so I'll have to see what I can do.
    Ireland is again different as it wasn't really feudal.
    There is likely to be a title that can be claimed but thats it.

  9. #9
    Giaus Marius's Avatar Libertus
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    Default Re: Princes, Kings and Heroes - Mod Info and FAQ

    Id like that, I really tried to hard in Tuetonic to make the kalmar unon work, only sometimes you would only get 1 or 2 cities, both of them revolting from you (that kinda ruined your day ), but that would be interesting if you could "unite" factions.

    BTW how is france going to work? will they own some of the french shoreline (on the mainland) and get the occasional army appear from the rest of france, or wat will happen there?

    I came, I saw, and then I left pretty quickly!

  10. #10
    wilddog's Avatar Paintedwolves run free
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    Default Re: Princes, Kings and Heroes - Mod Info and FAQ

    BTW how is france going to work? will they own some of the french shoreline (on the mainland) and get the occasional army appear from the rest of france, or wat will happen there?
    Yes they have starting provinces in France and they will get some armies appearing. They will be playable though they are really designed as an AI force.

  11. #11
    Giaus Marius's Avatar Libertus
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    Default Re: Princes, Kings and Heroes - Mod Info and FAQ

    Quote Originally Posted by wilddog View Post
    Yes they have starting provinces in France and they will get some armies appearing.
    Good to hear

    I came, I saw, and then I left pretty quickly!

  12. #12

    Default Re: Princes, Kings and Heroes - Mod Info and FAQ

    sounds like a perfict mod for the british isles when is the release date for the mod

  13. #13
    wilddog's Avatar Paintedwolves run free
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    Default Re: Princes, Kings and Heroes - Mod Info and FAQ

    I want the patch for Kingdoms first to see what that changes.

    Although at the moment things are a bit slower than I had hoped on the models side (I forgot about the 6 nations so that takes me away from modding over the weekend - with 3 matches yesterday there wasn't a lot done I'm afraid ).

  14. #14

    Default Re: Princes, Kings and Heroes - Mod Info and FAQ

    Hey all,

    I just got into using mods a few weeks ago (apparently i was living in an MTW:2 cave for the last few years) and the concept for this mod seems amazing. I am really impressed by the dedication Wilddog has put into it. All the power to you brother.
    I can't wait to play it!

  15. #15
    Venta Icenor Um's Avatar Civis
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    Default Re: Princes, Kings and Heroes - Mod Info and FAQ

    Very nice loking mod, any plans to set up a sort of 'Mod progress' thread?
    Those who live by the sword, Play Total War




  16. #16
    wilddog's Avatar Paintedwolves run free
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    Default Re: Princes, Kings and Heroes - Mod Info and FAQ

    Quote Originally Posted by Venta Icenor Um
    Very nice loking mod, any plans to set up a sort of 'Mod progress' thread?
    Thanks for the comment. No plans yet. I want the Kingdoms patch to come out first and I need to resolve a smoothing problem (or bypass it on some models). The latter issue is causing me some delay at the moment.

  17. #17

    Default Re: Princes, Kings and Heroes - Mod Info and FAQ

    Will you make french invaders as mongols in vanilla M2TW? It could be interesting to consider them as invaders.

    Great work_ I wait for it and have a look

  18. #18
    wilddog's Avatar Paintedwolves run free
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    Default Re: Princes, Kings and Heroes - Mod Info and FAQ

    Will you make French invaders as mongols in vanilla M2TW? It could be interesting to consider them as invaders.
    Certainly for the AI the French will get 'reinforcements' arriving and also likely they will re-emerge if defeated (I haven't scripted that yet as I am concentrating on modeling at this time).

  19. #19
    General Sareth's Avatar Laetus
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    Default Re: Princes, Kings and Heroes - Mod Info and FAQ

    Is there any chance you have a release date for this mod? And will all the units for the English factions be the same but recoulered?

  20. #20
    wilddog's Avatar Paintedwolves run free
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    Default Re: Princes, Kings and Heroes - Mod Info and FAQ

    Quote Originally Posted by General Sareth
    Is there any chance you have a release date for this mod? And will all the units for the English factions be the same but recoulered?
    I'd like to aim to release it by the end of this year. Whether its just after or just before I don't know however thats the most realistic target I can say.

    The English faction units will be the same but each will have a colour variation. If you mean will they be the same as vanilla then no although some of the basic models are similar.

    Reason why they are the same is that most unit types are relatively artificial anyway and most of the style of dress would be the same.

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