Making Space

[Henry X]

Alright, let's give credit to hylander (couldn't see his whole name while typing) credit for his little "revision" of unit names. The thread got me thinking (what a chore after three weeks out of school), what units could we remove, or simplify?

Example: Make the peasant archer and the archer militia into one unit called (Insert drum roll) archers.
Example: Screw the musketeers! They were at the end of this time.
Example: How many troops are essentially spearmen, but look the same?

[delra]

Very nice. I totally agree this is the direction we should be headed.

Especially that peasants are useless anyway, muskets destroy all the fun from heaving guard archers and spears don't have to be cute but effective.

But there are other guys in other threads who want to name each unit in their native language for realism or something. :-/

[Henry X]

Well then they may mod the game as they wish.

EDIT: After reading something about some people modding the Manhunt 2 game for the PC, it got me wondering: would it be possible to hack the game to change the number of units allowed?

[Echad]

How does renaming units would screw the merging of the same peasant archers and militia archers?

[DrunkNIrishMan]

If you renamed each unit in their native tongue, then there would have to be a different 'Archer' for each faction as opposed to one for all factions.

[delra]

If you hack the game to allow for more units and start distributing this over the net, CA is going to sue you rather than employ you...

[Henry X]

If you hack the game to allow for more units and start distributing this over the net, CA is going to sue you rather than employ you...

Rockstar hasn't sued the people who hacked Manhunt 2.


Wait, they have! Oh ******! I better run

Since there is a smiley on the end, I'm safe from offending people. Then again, we could send a polite email to CA for permission.

[Henry X]

If you put units that are basically the same, but different names, it takes up space in the EDU.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe a unit in the EDU may
1)Have only one model
2)One name
3)An infinite amount of skins

[delra]

Add siege equipment to the pile. Nobody cares how ballista folks look like...

[Henry X]

If you released a hacked version of the game but gave credit to CA, then why would they sue you? You gave them credit for the original build.

[delra]

You break the license, you break the law... And what if they spend more time in court than creating a normal AI for ETW so when we mod SS to it, we get a decent game eventually?

[Henry X]

Isn't that what they do anyway?

Point taken for the license. I guess Rockstar is too busy with GTA 4 to sue people. Anyway, the only thing I can hack is my own computer. And that's to get rid of the occasional virus.

Back to topic though people, any suggestions on what units could be "edited"?

[Schweizergarde]

Just because Rockstar choose not to sue doesn't mean other companies won't/can't. Legal precedent doesn't work in absence of legal action.

[KozaK101]

chivalric knights, armoured swords men, east chivalic knights and muire(just a half unit size 2 HP unit of chiv knoights) are all the same
dismounted noble,english and portugese knights are all the same...
portugese arqubuseurs(boy hav i spelt that rong) are the same..
greek and russian militia cavalry are unneccessary
and the blasted mounted crossbowmen could be removed(i just dont see y western armies should get a unit that gets rid of the lighter muslim and russian armies advantage, horse archers...as mounted crossbows always seem to win)
u could get rid of militia pavise or normal pavise and make them unique to city or castle not both..id keep militia pavise and let pavise factions hav them recruitable in cities as opposed to the castle kind...peasent/militia and plain crossbow men could be mixed...u cud scrap some of byzantines missile cav id say the tier 1 guys...the crappy lookin ones...
portugese knights...u dont really need em..they are just a cheaper not as gd version of feudal knights
highlanders and highland rabble could be mixed...after all would u not love ur tier 1 inf to inspire fear and wave axes?
u could remove peasents and balistas as alrdy pointed out
personnally u dont need ireland(im irish ill say what i want) they are too strong...id rather hav some of thier uits used in scottish or english armies or mercs...especiallly ulster sword men...some one may be able to guess y

er wen i set off writing i didnt no id rite so much sry

i say scrap the iberian javelin men but keep almughavers and the other unique ones...and i second the motion to kill mounted french archers!!!and all western horse archers!!! except rieters and jinetes ofc...

[Landwalker]

portugese arqubuseurs(boy hav i spelt that rong) are the same..

Actually, Portuguese Arquebusiers are one of the best gunpowder units in the game, and are much better all around (especially in melee) than regular arquebusiers.

greek and russian militia cavalry are unneccessary

These are actually vital to maintaining the cultural feel of the factions. Both cultures are very distinct from the generic "Europeans" (and from each other), and need to be represented as such in the game as much as possible. They are also notably better than Merchant Militia Cavalry, and the whole point is that the Greek and Russian factions can recruit them without having to built a merchant's guild.

u could get rid of militia pavise or normal pavise

Except that they're completely different. Pavise Crossbowmen are flat-out better. Which is why they aren't militia.

u cud scrap some of byzantines missile cav id say the tier 1 guys...the crappy lookin ones...

The fact that they look like crap is one that needs to be fixed with reskinning, not with elimination. The Byzantines employed huge numbers of mercenaries, and to just write them out of the roster would be stupid.

highlanders and highland rabble could be mixed...after all would u not love ur tier 1 inf to inspire fear and wave axes?

And shoot fire from their eyes, too, right? First-tier infantry isn't supposed to be outstanding, and shouldn't be merged with higher-tier infantry or higher-tier attributes/abilities.

er wen i set off writing i didnt no id rite so much sry

I don't think I would be so generous as to call what you just did "writing"...

i say scrap the iberian javelin men

Right, because the one thing we need to do is eliminate all meaningful differences between factions, so that they ultimately end up just being the same thing. The Iberian-Christian factions have javelineers for a reason--historically, because they were employed to such an extent as to make them a significant component of an Iberian army, and in terms of gameplay, because the Iberian factions don't get much in the way of spear units. Javelins are what they receive instead, and this is intended to make them play very differently from the other European factions (which it achieves).

Cheers.

[KozaK101]

be nice...i just mean u dont exactly continue using tier one byzantines when u get vraidotoroi and byzantine cav
militia cav isnt exactly used much either when u have the choice to make byz lancers, kataphractoi etc. and boyar sons and druzhina but i must admit that u hav a good point and i guess the greek militia cav are unique...
y should the portugese get thier own special arquebusiers? i realise that they are better but not that much from my experiences but still they could make due with regulars
u could change the militia ones stats...much more italien CITY states friendly

scotland was a land of soldiers..well every healthey man was expected to be able to fight and the high land culture was full of internal feuds so using a slight;y better unit to represent the populace would be good...after all were did wallace get his army? im not saying they should be able to shoot lightening out thier rears now...
and oh yes i forgot im typing...

and i didint say scap lustinians now...

but everything else was ok yes?

[numerosdecimus]

portugese arqubuseurs(boy hav i spelt that rong) are the same..

They're somewhat superior to the standard arquebusiers, because of historical reasons.

and the blasted mounted crossbowmen could be removed(i just dont see y western armies should get a unit that gets rid of the lighter muslim and russian armies advantage, horse archers...as mounted crossbows always seem to win)

That's because that unit existed.

portugese knights...u dont really need em..they are just a cheaper not as gd version of feudal knights

Portuguese knights actually have more shock armour comparing with feudal knights but less when in comparison with chilvaric knights, but have a better charge attack and base attack, they're knights units with that provide a different aproach.

highlanders and highland rabble could be mixed...after all would u not love ur tier 1 inf to inspire fear and wave axes?
u could remove peasents and balistas as alrdy pointed out

We would be killing unit diversity.

i say scrap the iberian javelin men but keep almughavers and the other unique ones...and i second the motion to kill mounted french archers!!!and all western horse archers!!! except rieters and jinetes ofc...

The iberian javelin is an extremely important military characteristic of the medieval iberian christian factions, to remove it is to kill regional unit diversity and historical accuracy.

[The Sundance Kid]

Isn't that what they do anyway?

Point taken for the license. I guess Rockstar is too busy with GTA 4 to sue people. Anyway, the only thing I can hack is my own computer. And that's to get rid of the occasional virus.

Back to topic though people, any suggestions on what units could be "edited"?

Take out 'Javelinmen' -- No one uses them and they're damn near useless anyway. I doubt any medieval army employed people purely for throwing spears.

I also dislike the accuracy of French Mounted Archer thingies, but hey...

[Schweizergarde]

Take out 'Javelinmen' -- No one uses them and they're damn near useless anyway. I doubt any medieval army employed people purely for throwing spears.

I also dislike the accuracy of French Mounted Archer thingies, but hey...

Agreed; not only is Mounted Longbow not really possible/effective (possible exception with Japanese Longbows, which were shorter on one side), but with RealCombat's range value of mounted longbow at 140, they are beat at range by every other archer units on the same tier (need tier 4 city for FMA if I remember right).

[Henry X]

We're trying to figure out what units can be taken out while keeping each faction unique.