The Mac vs. PC thread

[NaptownKnight]

Okay, so if I were in the market for a new computer, should I go with the PC or the Macintosh? I have heard that Macs are better now for gaming, and we all know Macs handle school work and multimedia better than Windows. Plus, Vista isn't that great. With all that said, I have never owned a Mac, only Windows, and the PC seems more cost effective. What do you guys think?



Also, Macs look better than PCs .

[Doono]

PC, simply because the premium you pay on a mac in not worth it.

[Simetrical]

Macs are not better for gaming. Macs are completely hopeless for gaming, unless you only play World of Warcraft (which to be fair, some people do . . .). Only a few of the major titles are released for Mac, and that remains true to this day. The only way they're better now is that you can run Windows on the same computer, so you don't have to switch computers to play games, just reboot (or maybe use virtualization, but I've heard that's pretty slow).

Macs are definitely more expensive, in terms of hardware, because there's only one hardware vendor. If you're playing games, in which case you'll probably need to install Windows beside Mac anyway (extra $100+ there), you'll find a big performance/graphics quality difference between PCs and Macs of the same price, and not in the Macs' favor.

There's no difference in terms of schoolwork or multimedia work. Everything of any importance available for Macs works for PCs too, to the best of my knowledge, and vice versa. You'll probably be using most of the same apps (Microsoft Office, Photoshop, 3DS Max, . . .) on both. Artsy types not uncommonly use Macs, and it's fine for them, as long as they don't care much about games.

So, it looks prettier. You can take that, or you can take higher performance, lower cost, and the ability to play modern games. Your choice. (Or you can dual-boot and get the prettiness along with the ability to play games, but lose out on even more money and still get a performance hit.)

[XSlingerX]

I don't have too much experience with Macs, but in junior high we used the iMacs in the computer lab and I detested the interface.

[spartan_phalanx]

Sim hit it on the head for comparison. I personally grew up on Macs and loved them then, didn't know anything different. I bought an iMac, used it for a year and then bought a PC because I couldn't find any games/software that I wanted use for it. The Mac went in the closet and has been there since (albeit parents used it for a few months before I gave them my old PC). Macs are really overpriced and severely limited if your into gaming.

[HorseArcher]

When you spend your money on MAC, you'll be still crying over all the money you have paid for a computer that you can access the web and watch movies, while at the same time I have already upgraded my PC twice for the same amount of money you spent on your MAC that you have to live with until you dare to spend that much money again.

Here are the Pros and Cons

MAC

Pros

-Great for multimedia artists // graphical artists, music, video
-Great reliability but comes with a price
-Ease of use, but it takes time to get used to


Cons
-very expensive
-One button mouse, give me a break
-No games or at least very scarce games make it in
-Not cheap to upgrade, some of the stuff you can't
-OS is great, but if you got Vista, you got the same damn thing, with a bit less reliability but who cares (winxp still rules)


IBM compatible (PCs)

Pros

-great support for all sorts of software and games
-dirt cheap
-easy to upgrade, mix and match most hardware
-lots of accessories
-faster evolving (more upgrades, new CPU/MB/Graphics card every other month)

Cons

-Bill Gate's empire, he dominates the damn thing with his stupid Micro$oft
-Vista sucks monkeyballs (my opinion, but you can always have XP in the meantime)
-mass produced, lots of defective/cheap parts (watch out)
-not as reliable as MAC (this is arguable, it depends on the components you buy within)

[krazykarl]

The whole one button mouse thing is really annoying on a MAC.

[snuggans]

MAC

Pros

-Great for multimedia artists // graphical artists, music, video

i have seen many videos of behind-the-scenes game developers designing on Macs, why is this?

[Ummagumma]

Old Mac's used to be worth the money. Though harder to program (efficiently) for, I am reliably informed, but the RISC processors were amazingly efficient. Performing identical photoshop action sets on identical images took 3/4 of the time on a G3 500 with 256MB ram compared to an Athlon 800 with 640MB - the HDD's were of a similar spec and the RAM was the same speed.

Now all you get is a shiny OS with less compatibility for many programs and a premium cost for and similar Intel Core-based hardware as is found in a PC. I've always thought Computer Fred made it almost worth it though....

[Erwin Rommel]

PC FTW!!!!

[Simetrical]

i have seen many videos of behind-the-scenes game developers designing on Macs, why is this?

A cultural thing. Macs tend to be used among artistic types, for some reason. They aren't actually any better for it, as far as I know.

[So Much Fire]

It's better to have to have both if you can afford it (if you really have a specific need for either one). For my music work and art, I prefer using Macs over PCs. For gaming, the amount of upgrades and compatability is a huge plus. But the best thing to do is go and get hands on time at the store and find out what you like. At that point, there are some pretty powerful Macs that come with Intel processors for gaming (and from what I've seen first hand), the games I've played really had no unbearable effect on FPS if you run in on a boot camp copy of windows.

And yes, I'm a proud Mac guy (already have a XP gaming laptop and prefer the macbook pro over it)

[snuggans]

At that point, there are some pretty powerful Macs that come with Intel processors for gaming (and from what I've seen first hand), the games I've played really had no unbearable effect on FPS if you run in on a boot camp copy of windows.

to be honest, i do not think that Mac gaming suffers from Mac's hardware, but rather from the lack of developer attention, which is influenced heavily by statistics and economics.

[drak10687]

Why exactly is it though that you prefer your Mac for music work and art? Is it just the programs, or what? Just wondering, because I would think you can get most professional programs for both anyways...

[So Much Fire]

Yes I do prefer the programs available for it since I also do video editing at times. I work on projects that use music, film, and photography all in one go, and the software plus interface on the Mac just suits me better than on a PC. To be honest, it appeals to me more aesthetically (both software and actual machine) and I haven't upgraded a single component of a computer I ever owned so I felt that it was the better way for me to go. I use only the internal HD on the Mac (as compared to an internal + external on my XP laptop) so when it comes to working with my multimedia, I like having everything on one HD. It's more of a personal choice though since I've used both Mac and Windows as a child, and Mac has really grown on me.

I do need to state though that I have a laptop that runs XP and I use that for gaming mainly and really have nothing against it (have had numerous network card and driver issues)

[Ummagumma]

...I work on projects that use music, film, and photography all in one go..... I use only the internal HD on the Mac...

How big is this hard disk?? Uncompressed video files can be hundreds of gigabytes! One of the (minor) advantages of Macs was they all, as standard, had Firewire ports (at a time when you would have had to get a specific controller card for PC's) - mainly used for high speed data transfer to and from external storage..

[So Much Fire]

How big is this hard disk??

160GB, I don't usually leave large amounts of uncompressed video on it anyway, just what's relavent to the current project and past projects, the rest is archived on an external. Cost wasn't an issue when I bought it since it was bought with business money.

[Ramashan]

Has anyone here been even seeing what is going on in the Mac world? I owned a PC for about a year until it took a header into destruction where the Harddrive failed and I was screwed. I have always preferred the reliability of Macs and have owned one type or another since 1989.

I have never has a Mac get a virus and never had it crash in any way that I couldn't easily repair. Granted, most of what I do is graphic and video editing work where Macs are the computer of choice in those fields.

Recently I bought a new iMac with Leopard which comes with BootCamp. I installed WindowsXP on my Windows side of the system and have been playing Morrowind and Rome:Total War at the highest settings as well as all my other PC games and using Photoshop CS. I have not had a problem.

Now, for the cost of one system instead of two like i formally had, i get the best of both worlds. All the high end editing and graphic capabilities of my Mac for my freelance post-production work, and all the graphic power and gaming capabilities of the PC.

Also, macs are more student friendly than PC's in my opinion. I have several teacher friends who I talked into buying mac laptops and they now will never go back to PC's.

Recently I just did a job where i had to attach my external harddrive to a PC and the PC would not recognize it and I had to spend 4 hours reformatting a new hard drive and transferring all the files over. Now, my Mac could see the PC formatted hard drive easily, where as the PC would not recognize the Hard drive formatted on the mac.

Also, all my PC die hard friends are constantly dealing with virus and hardware issues because they had t upgrade their systems to get more power out of them. This was a primary reason why I avoided PC"s like the plague until I just had to get one for gaming. But that has been solved with leopard.

So, all around I believe Macs today are far more versitile than PC's. The only reason why I could see getttin a PC is if you are in corporate business and your company does everything on PC and its IT department scoffs at Macs. Or you are a programer programming software from the ground up and need. But even these applications will all run on the new Intelbased Macs.

So, the gaming issue has been solved.

The graphic design capabilities of Macs have always been superior

They are more user friendly

And although the cost is still an issue, you do get some of the best basic photo, music, and movie editing software out there at the moment.

The only downside is the upgrading issues. That doesn't mean its impossible, just that there aren't as many components specifically designed for it.

[Simetrical]

to be honest, i do not think that Mac gaming suffers from Mac's hardware, but rather from the lack of developer attention, which is influenced heavily by statistics and economics.

Exactly. The performance is just an added burden, the main point is lack of game availability. (By comparison, Linux has better performance per dollar than either Windows or Mac, but has arguably worse game support than either.)

Has anyone here been even seeing what is going on in the Mac world? I owned a PC for about a year until it took a header into destruction where the Harddrive failed and I was screwed. I have always preferred the reliability of Macs and have owned one type or another since 1989.

PCs can be just as reliable as Macs, if you get good-quality hardware. Anecdotal experience isn't impressive ― my sister's Mac laptop just died, for instance.

I have never has a Mac get a virus and never had it crash in any way that I couldn't easily repair.

Viruses are not a problem on Windows if you run appropriate firewall and antivirus software. This is, certainly, an added burden on Windows users, but it's not really a make-or-break thing.

Recently I bought a new iMac with Leopard which comes with BootCamp. I installed WindowsXP on my Windows side of the system and have been playing Morrowind and Rome:Total War at the highest settings as well as all my other PC games and using Photoshop CS. I have not had a problem.

Because Morrowind and RTW are ancient. Try playing Crysis or something, and you'll get significantly worse performance than on a PC of the same price. That's just a fact, verified by (for instance) PC Gamer US. They did standard benchmarks on a top-of-the-line Intel Mac and found it fell considerably short of a PC with the same price. (If I remembered which issue it was, I would give exact figures.)

Now, for the cost of one system instead of two like i formally had, i get the best of both worlds. All the high end editing and graphic capabilities of my Mac for my freelance post-production work, and all the graphic power and gaming capabilities of the PC.

What editing and graphics utilities are available for Mac but not PC, out of curiosity?

Also, macs are more student friendly than PC's in my opinion. I have several teacher friends who I talked into buying mac laptops and they now will never go back to PC's.

Because they look pretty. Macs have sleeker interfaces and better looks, no one denies that. The question is whether that's worth the extra money, and for gamers, the extra hassle of dual-booting.

Recently I just did a job where i had to attach my external harddrive to a PC and the PC would not recognize it and I had to spend 4 hours reformatting a new hard drive and transferring all the files over. Now, my Mac could see the PC formatted hard drive easily, where as the PC would not recognize the Hard drive formatted on the mac.

Hardly a problem if you don't use Macs to begin with.

Also, all my PC die hard friends are constantly dealing with virus and hardware issues because they had t upgrade their systems to get more power out of them.

Nobody who runs reasonable firewall and antivirus software, and hasn't done something stupid like turning off Windows Update, will see much trouble from viruses on Windows. PC users are under no obligation to upgrade their hardware, any more than Mac users are.

So, the gaming issue has been solved.

No it hasn't. You still need to install Windows, and it still costs more money for the same performance, and your performance is still capped at a far lower point than with PCs. The highest-end Macs do not compete with the highest-end PCs in playing modern games.

I continue to maintain that the only clear-cut advantages that Macs have over Windows PCs is that they're prettier, and that you don't have to bother with virus scanners. They are not less likely to suffer hardware failures, they are not less likely to crash, they are not clearly more user-friendly (only arguably so). They are slower and more expensive, they support less software (without dual-booting, which is a hassle and defeats half the point), and they support less hardware. Maybe they have better software for graphics stuff, but I have yet to see any particular programs cited to this effect. For people who like the pretty computer and interface enough, the disadvantages may not be a problem, and that's fine ― different people have different tastes. But please don't try to claim some kind of superiority.

[So Much Fire]

It really comes down to how you use the system, and that defines what the superior system is for you. I've had many more problems with my XP laptop (to the point where I've wanted to throw it out the window) and nothing that bad on my Mac, but I've been able to bail out my PC and fix it with most problems.

Btw, Final Cut Pro isn't available for the PC, and FSX isn't ancient plus dual booting really isn't much of a hassle, kind of the same thing with Windows and Unbuntu. The price of a Mac is more what's already included on the system as well, not just parts, and PCs aren't exactly cheap either unless you build them yourself.

I'm on a XP based laptop right now that came with Windows Vista Home Premium installed, it costs the same as a high end Macbook pro, and it doesn't have a video card, just a chipset family (which struggles to run basic games), a Mac vastly outperforms and came as a far superior system in my case. In all fairness, this laptop was purchased for a person who only surfs the net and checks e-mail, but the person providing the support is very anti-Mac and is stuck in a "I will only use IE and what comes standard with Windows" mindest outside of gaming.

A Macbook Pro will easily outperform a HP Pavilion DV series and will cost the same price for the same package, but will come with a upper end video card and better programs.

Because Morrowind and RTW are ancient. Try playing Crysis or something, and you'll get significantly worse performance than on a PC of the same price. That's just a fact, verified by (for instance) PC Gamer US. They did standard benchmarks on a top-of-the-line Intel Mac and found it fell considerably short of a PC with the same price. (If I remembered which issue it was, I would give exact figures.)

Of course if they compare an Alienware running Crysis to an iMac running Crysis, the Alienware will outperform the iMac..... no secret there. What systems were tested and who exactly buys a Mac expecting Alienware perforemance? It's like buying a Vaio and expecting Alienware perforemance. Alienware is a PC and Alienware is Alienware, the only fair test would be using the exact same video card, processor etc.... Remember what most stores do since the average shopper isn't 100% computer savy, the salesman will sucker someone into buying a crappy system making it sound like the best thing in the world.