Federalism:What Is The Good And The Bad?

[jankren]

Im wondering what federalism actually is with simple explanation and what are the good and the bad sides of such system?

[Mansa musa]

all isms are bad

[jankren]

all isms are bad

Unfortunately I expected more intelligent responses.

[Gelgoog]

Political federalism is a political philosophy in which a group of members are bound together (Latin: foedus, covenant) with a governing representative head. The term federalism is also used to describe a system of the government in which sovereignty is constitutionally divided between a central governing authority and constituent political units (like states or provinces). Federalism is the system in which the power to govern is shared between the national & state governments, creating what is often called a federation. Proponents are often called federalists.

the idea in the US was that you have a federal government that acts as a medium between the states power. the two are supposed to balance eachother out. under the articles of confederation when they basically was no federal government, the states sqabbled amongst themselves more like soverign nations than united.

but federalism comes in many forms, do you want to know more about US flavored federalism or european type?

[wilting]

My own speculation:

Federalism can mean one of two things;

A) Centralisation of power in a mass democracy (USA, possible USE)

or

B) Decentralisation of power in a smaller democracy (Germany)

Let's say there are three basic ideals for governance:

1) That it be as close to the people as possible
2) That it be as democratic at possible
3) That it be as effective as possible

Case A)

1) Federalism brings Governance further away from the people it represents.

2) Federalism arguably improves democracy, as decision are made on 'macro' issues by fully federal institutions with a more direct access for voters rather than in a more confederate manner guided by executives and cut off from legislatures.

3) Federalism arguably centralises power allowing for more decisive action.


Case B)

1) Federalism brings Governance closer to the people it represents.

2) Federalism arguably harms democracy, as voters are further removed from macro decision making.

3) Federalism arguably decentralises power, harming decisiveness.


This earlier post by me explains in more depth (replace 'supranational' and 'international' with federal):

It is consistent with the more sceptic British attitude to Integration to be pro-expansion, as the more Member States there are the more difficult decision making becomes. However, arguably this could backfire; impotency could lead to greater demand for more centalised decision making and ultimately broaden supranational authority of the Union. This would also be likely to strengthen supranational democracy, which I would view as desirable in comparison to the current state of EU Governance, so when more and more decisions are being taken at a Supranational level are we faced with a choice between the nation-state and democracy?

It has been argued that one must ultimately choose 2 of the 3; Economic integration, Democracy and the Nation-State. Hanging onto the Nation-State would harm democracy in this context. It seems hard to imagine Economic Integration and the naturally following Supranational Governance being reversed. But this is just one argument.

Member States Legislatures appear to be in a weaker position and Executives a stronger when more and more decisions are made at a Supranational or International level, at which it is the Executive which represents the National Interest. For democracy to be presevered in this context, a much greater role must be given to Member State Legislatures, to the Supernational lesiglature, or Supranational Governance must be strictly limited. Limiting Supranational Goveranance is hard when the process is being driven by economic forces and their associated lobby groups, and giving a greater role to Member State Legislatures carries the disadavantage of not being true Supranational Democracy - the voter is more removed from Suprantional decision making by State-centric elections and representation. But this is all speculation.

I hope that helps.

[jankren]

How the treasury works in a federal country? I mean like does every state have the right to keep all of its income or the federal government demands a fixed percent of 'tribute' in a certain period of time or how?

Im talking about all this because I want my country to adopt federal system. But Im afraid it will just make it break apart faster.

[Rush Limbaugh]

Federalism is good and what we were supposed to get with the constitution. Instead we got Nationalism and this is bad.

[jankren]

Federalism is good and what we were supposed to get with the constitution. Instead we got Nationalism and this is bad.

I dont really understand. Are you saying that for example Californians should put California first before USA?

[Rush Limbaugh]

Are you saying that for example Californians should put California first before USA?

With out a doubt.

[wilting]

Federalism is good and what we were supposed to get with the constitution. Instead we got Nationalism and this is bad.

With out a doubt.

Contradiction? :hmmm:


jankren:

Treasury policy could probably vary, but it is reasonable to expect there to be both federal and state taxes. How it gets divided up again will vary, but one could probably expect to see a redistribution of wealth generated in wealthier states going into development of poorer states. See EU structural funds, California's contribution to US Treasury etc.

[jankren]

With out a doubt.

Please explain why? How is feeling of nationalism worse than 'tribalism'?

By the way, I personally think the world should adopt federal system.

[Gelgoog]

one thing i dont like about the feds is their trend to blackmail the states into obeying federal laws by saying either adopt or lose federal funding ( which no state do).

[Rush Limbaugh]

one thing i dont like about the feds is their trend to blackmail the states into obeying federal laws by saying either adopt or lose federal funding ( which no state do).

And the irony being is that they collect this money from the states in the first place. NY is always in a losing proposition here in that we pay far more than we receive. I say quit paying this ransom. Besides the states can only pay their debts in gold and silver right ?

one thing i dont like about the feds is their trend to blackmail the states into obeying federal laws by saying either adopt or lose federal funding ( which no state do).

This is the big difference between the Federalists and the anti federalists. The anti federalists were for duality and the constitution and bill of rights reflect that. Hamilton was constantly assuring the rest that this was not a National government and that it was not a consolidated government but still a Federation.

[jankren]

Considering USA is not made up of lands containing different cultures and peoples like Russia or Indonesia, I think they should become Republic of America.

[Rush Limbaugh]

Considering USA is not made up of lands containing different cultures and peoples like Russia or Indonesia, I think they should become Republic of America.

Im confused here. We are made up of many different cultures and we are the Republic of the United States

[Gelgoog]

Considering USA is not made up of lands containing different cultures and peoples like Russia or Indonesia, I think they should become Republic of America.

oh? not even talking about the extremely diverse background of your average american heritage, lets just see all the cultures around here. in my city we have a very strong basque culture, we got quite a few muslims and indians here as well. i know because i work as a butcher and serve these people all the time.
in other cities is can be anything from china town, little odessa, and plenty of other ethnic areas. if all the russians or chinese gathered into one area they could probably be their own city or region. just because we essentially have one national language ( maybe two counting spanish), doesnt mean anything. we are one of the most diverse nations out there.

[Rush Limbaugh]

We are THE MOST DIVERSE NATION in the world. In race, religion and just about anything else you care to mention.

[El Brujo]

I think what Jankren is getting at is due to the similarities between Yankee, Dixie, and other cultures on a State level, we don't need federalism anymore. States become mere provinces if you will.

I disagree with this because federalism wasn't established for cultural reasons, but rather to keep any level of government from becoming too powerful.

[jankren]

I think what Jankren is getting at is due to the similarities between Yankee, Dixie, and other cultures on a State level, we don't need federalism anymore. States become mere provinces if you will.

Yes, that is what Im trying to say.

Its like Iraq. The Kurds and the Arabs have their own cultures, languages, and ancestral lands where they have been living on for generations for thousands of years. So, they see no reason why they should share their economy for example with the peoples in other parts of the country with whom they have little connection with thus federalism may be best for them rather than having them separating completely.

I disagree with this because federalism wasn't established for cultural reasons, but rather to keep any level of government from becoming too powerful.

I can accept this explanation.

[Rush Limbaugh]

Its like Iraq. The Kurds and the Arabs have their own cultures, languages, and ancestral lands where they have been living on for generations for thousands of years. So, they see no reason why they should share their economy for example with the peoples in other parts of the country with whom they have little connection with thus federalism may be best for them rather than having them separating completely.

Believe me the people of Texas are as much different from the people in Vermont for example than anyone in Iraq is from anybody else in Iraq. That was the real cause of the civil war. Very different cultures and economies.