Hail brave warriors,
Has anyone heard of Mutianu? He's a Romanian famous for:
1) writing the Rome Total War Book of Theories. Inside his book of theories are chapters/pages on:
-- how to beat Cataphracts with Equites
-- why Town Watch are superior to Urban Cohorts
-- various tactical formations including the Smiling Face Formation
-- breaking down the noob box with the Hammer of Thor formation
-- the use of Incendiary Pigs (and why every general should have them)
-- the Pigs-in-a-Blanket Tactic
-- the essence of Rope-a-Dope
-- Gaul under [Mutianu's] Leadership
-- the proper use of Peasantry
-- Mutianu's Top 10 Battles (and the lessons he learned from them)
-- and more
2) modeling in Europe
-- he recently came back from Italy where he was supposedly inspired to add another chapter to his book of theories
3) fghting off a cheetah with a mirror while he was modeling in Africa.
4) using bottom of the barrel units for his R:TW armies
Here is a replay of Mutianu (aka [ROM]xxx_Mutianu_xxx]). He just played this warm-up game today, but he was actually on the phone with his agent so he was a little distracted.
Mutianu's Army (SPQR)
- 2 Incendiary Pigs (plus general)
- 6 Town Watch
- 6 Equites
- 2 Roman Archers
Mutianu apologizes for not being able to play a proper game, but his modeling career is dominating his time. When you're watching the video, keep an eye out for several things:
1) the Smiling Face Formation
2) the speed of Town Watch (Mutianu prefers them over Urban Cohorts)
3) the Rope-a-Dope Retreat (he has a few pages devoted to this maneuver in his book of theories)
4) here's something that you can't see, but at the beginning of the match, Mutianu supposedly told his opponent "thanks for the elephants."
In any case, here's the video replay:
Mutianu will be in Romania for a few days. He said he'll be revising his Rome: Total War Theories while he's home.
(Mutianu's Hammer of Thor formation)
Last edited by Prince_of_Macedon; December 02, 2007 at 10:31 PM.
Reason: needed a better title
wow at first hell the elephant got it under wraps...........but hey wtf they are berserking nd those pesky townwatch are stil alive holy crap great vid man!!! +rep
Well, I suppose this replay explains a lot, actually. I'd compare Mutiany with Henry V, and this battle with battle of Agincourt...and by that, I mean that his opponent is a BLOODY INCOMPETENT MORON! The enemy has an army that relies solely on maneuverability, and he sends pikemen?!?! And then he even can't keep them together? The enemy has tons of archers and firepigs, and he sends elephants?! He wastes money on bunch of low-level archers even though the third of the enemy's army is made of cavalry!?!? No wonder Mutianu said 'thanks for the elephants', he might as well have said 'thanks' for the entire setup I'm not trying to sound disrespectful or anything, the guy is obviously good, but come on! Now I really regret I don't play online, even though I'm about as fast as a snail with paralysis - even so, I'd still be able to make an army that's worth something against this smiling face.
And besides, I'd really like to see this replay in .rpy format...AND his famous Theory Book, again.
Well, I suppose this replay explains a lot, actually. I'd compare Mutiany with Henry V, and this battle with battle of Agincourt...and by that, I mean that his opponent is a BLOODY INCOMPETENT MORON! The enemy has an army that relies solely on maneuverability, and he sends pikemen?!?! And then he even can't keep them together?
Maybe you missed it, but the all-powerful Equites made sure his phalanx couldn't stay together to support his elephant attack.
The enemy has tons of archers and firepigs, and he sends elephants?!
"Tons of Archers?" Mutianu only had 2 Roman Archers. The enemy had twice as many archers (4 of them to be exact), but Mutianu made sure they were kept out of action. The Seleucid even made the proper tactical decision to charge the Archers with his Elephants.
Furthermore, Incendiary Pigs are much harder to use online than during a Campaign. As you can see, Mutianu even fouled up their usage (although he's typically good with them).
He wastes money on bunch of low-level archers even though the third of the enemy's army is made of cavalry!?!?
You're using hindsight. The enemy couldn't see the type of army that Mutianu was making.
Also, phalanx + archer + elephants are superior to any heavy or light cavalry that relies on melee-attack. Not to mention that the bulk of Mutianu's force was comprised of Town Watch. Sure, Mutianu knows how to use them, but do you?
If you don't believe me, I'll let you use Mutianu's army. And I'll personally use the same crappy army fielded by the Seleucid player. I'd love to see how you manage Mutianu's army.
And besides, I'd really like to see this replay in .rpy format...AND his famous Theory Book, again.
After your less-than-diplomatic words, that's definitely not going to happen. Mutianu has done you enough favors by treating you to one of his replays. He introduces innovation, and how does everyone repay him? By doubting his very existence. It's no wonder Mutianu is protective of his book of theories. People are just going to steal his ideas, and not give him the credit he deserves.
Last edited by Prince_of_Macedon; November 29, 2007 at 08:37 AM.
That was the most awesome and well commanded battle I have ever seen!
"So there I am, in Sri Lanka, formerly Ceylon, at about 3 o'clock in the morning, looking for one thousand brown M&Ms to fill a brandy glass, or Ozzy wouldn't go on stage that night. So, Jeff Beck pops his head 'round the door, and mentions there's a little sweets shop on the edge of town. So - we go. And - it's closed. So there's me, and Keith Moon, and David Crosby, breaking into that little sweets shop, eh. Well, instead of a guard dog, they've got this bloody great big Bengal tiger. I managed to take out the tiger with a can of mace, but the shopowner and his son... that's a different story altogether. I had to beat them to death with their own shoes. Nasty business, really. But, sure enough, I got the M&Ms, and Ozzy went on stage and did a great show."
Yes the player was good but not as legendary as we have been led to believe and to be fair his opponant was not very good at all
Yes some of the ideas are interesting and in some circumstances may be useful , but all of that is lost in the cloud of bull that has been created
My point exactly
I focused on the Town Watch because I wanted people to see how he used them. You've already been exposed to how he uses Equites having read previous posts regarding the matter. Besides, he doesn't do anything special with Equites unless he's fighting against Cataphracts or other heavy cavalry. Therefore, I didn't think anybody would be interested in what he did with Equites against the Seleucid phalanx + archers.
Oh? And how exactly did he use t.watch, in your oppinion? All I saw was them keeping the elephants busy while the archers were trying to scare them with fire. That's hardly revolutionary. In fact, I don't understand why did he wait the eles to engage, he could've placed his archers in front of the battle line, scaring the eles sooner (as I did in one of these replays I suply).
You shouldn't make assumptions about the course of a battle if you only watched a fraction of what was happening. If you're in doubt, just ask me what happened.
And again, I asked for .rpy so I wouldn't brag you about every detail. Do you really think I cannot produce somethinh as "awesome" (in my oppinion, decent at best) myself?
His Pikemen were scattered for a reason. As I said, his Equites caused that breakdown in formation. There's a reason that Mutianu does the things he does.
*Sigh* And I suppose you want to convince us with this last sentence that he invented flanking? Besides, even though this seleucid set-up was far from perfect, I'd very much like to see how Mutianu would disrupt square/ring formation.
So you're comparing Mutianu to Hannibal? I'm cool with that.
No. I was questioning his originality based on the fact that Hannibal (and other people) used same or similar tactics centuries before. I repeat, Mutianu is an exceptional strategist, obviously, but he's not some kind of Mars incarnated as you are trying to depict him.
Playing against the AI is not the same thing as playing against a human.
Well, as long as I don't use pause, I don't see much difference, if you compare AI and guys like this opponent of Mutianu's. Of course that AI isn't a match for better players (like Mutianu), but that's not what I meant. I wanted to prove that Mutianu did nothing special in this battle, and if you look at the replays, you'll see that I basically managed to do so, beacuse the AI did almost the same things snook did.
I've got it!!!!!
I have finally found the weakness of these tactic!!!
POST YOUR ARMY TO THE CORNERS NEAR THE RED BARS TO AVOID BEING OUTFLANK
Other than that I can't think of anything else cept of course spartans in a pentagon formation w/ cretan archers (noob box)
Silver shields in square with regular archers would also do (see replay). And it's not neccessary to use exploits like red-bar-flank-protection, your own cavalry (or, in this case, elephants) are more than capable of doing so (again, see replay)
that army really isn't that bad with the amount of ups on the units, the town watch has 2 exp 3 sword 3 shield so will not be running any time soon.
This is actually quite ingenious on Mutianu's behalf (in fact, the only thing I really give him credit for): namely, recognizing the fact that upgraded low-level units can, under circumstances, be more effective (or at least more cost effective) than high-level unupgraded ones, and recognizing that this works with equites in particular more than well. Respect for that.
Since when does losing a game make someone a "moron?"
It's not the fact that he lost, it's how he lost. Losing Carrhae on vhard makes you human. Losing like this makes you a moron. And speaking of Carrhae...has Mutianu ever managed to beat that (on vhard)? Now that would be something.
Why does it upset you that people admire good players? Don't we all aspire to becoming better players? If you're on this forum, I'm assuming you play the game too.
Admiration is one thing, divinizing/idolizing/worshipping something completely different.
I shall now leave this discussion and this website as to be honest we are never going to convince each other
I would like to say it has been fun, I would like to say that but let's be honest it hasn't
Honestly, I'm on the edge of doing exactly the same
Replays (mentioned in the text):
-Me playing with Mutianu's setup against AI using pause on medium difficulty(heroic victory): http://www.megaupload.com/?d=9WS6RP5G
-Me playing with Mutianu's setup against AI without using pause on medium difficulty (this is suppose to be the closest thing to a online match with a moderately incompetent player like snook; again, a heroic): http://www.megaupload.com/?d=FUKFORAC
-Me playing with Mutianu's setup against AI without using pause on very hard difficulty (a clear): http://www.megaupload.com/?d=3ZONSS30
-Me playing with snook's Seleucid set-up against Mutianu's setup: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=DLQG4U4M
I changed slightly the exp and equipment of Mutianu's army, 'cause I didn't know what exactly was he using, but it shouldn't make much of a difference. If you someone would be kind to give me exact exp/uprades set-up, I'd be more then happy to re-test it. These are all 10k battles.
Oh, and sorry for megaupload links, I completely forgot that this forum accepts only .zip, not .rar (idiot )
Well, that does make a difference. I assumed that he knew what he was facing.
Mutianu doesn't always use the same army. Furthermore, players cannot see each other's armies until they've actually started the battle (on Multiplayer). The only thing you can see is the amount of troops they're buying and how much money they've spent. That's it.
Of course I missed it, because the rep focused on town-watch vs. elephants melee.
I focused on the Town Watch because I wanted people to see how he used them. You've already been exposed to how he uses Equites having read previous posts regarding the matter. Besides, he doesn't do anything special with Equites unless he's fighting against Cataphracts or other heavy cavalry. Therefore, I didn't think anybody would be interested in what he did with Equites against the Seleucid phalanx + archers.
You shouldn't make assumptions about the course of a battle if you only watched a fraction of what was happening. If you're in doubt, just ask me what happened.
Why the hell do you think that I asked for .rpy file?
I have no idea, but you're not getting anything with that kind of dialogue.
When it zoomed-out again, all I could see was his pikemen scattered. However, I have seen him sendind one pikemen unit against town watch and another against equites after the elephants went berserk. Now that's something I'd expect from AI (and that only in occasional idiocy attacks), but from human player? Nah...
His Pikemen were scattered for a reason. As I said, his Equites caused that breakdown in formation. There's a reason that Mutianu does the things he does.
The Seleucid's lone Pikeman unit didn't go there alone initially - as you noted, there were 2 Armoured Elephants there. He probably didn't expect his Elephants to run amok having beaten down the pigs and archers previously. Sometimes, things happen on the battlefield that you're unable to control.
Second, ever heard about that Carthaginian guy...I think Hannibal was his name, or something...it happens he invented (or better said, developed and used extensively) the "horseshoe" tactic which, incidetally, is exactly what Mutianu did with his cavalry.
So you're comparing Mutianu to Hannibal? I'm cool with that.
I intend to test it against AI this very evening.
Playing against the AI is not the same thing as playing against a human.
To you, I have nothing more to say; if you want to idolize and worship this guy, go right ahead, but forgive me if I don't join you.
Why does it upset you that people admire good players? Don't we all aspire to becoming better players? If you're on this forum, I'm assuming you play the game too.
Last edited by Prince_of_Macedon; November 29, 2007 at 10:36 AM.
Hail brave warriors,
Has anyone heard of Mutianu? He's a Romanian famous for:
1) writing the Rome Total War Book of Theories. Inside his book of theories are chapters/pages on:
-- how to beat Cataphracts with Equites
-- why Town Watch are superior to Urban Cohorts
-- various tactical formations including the Smiling Face Formation
-- the use of Incendiary Pigs (and why every general should have them)
-- etc, etc, etc
2) modeling in Europe
-- he recently came back from Italy where he was supposedly inspired to add another chapter to his book of theories
3) fghting off a cheetah with a mirror while he was modeling in Africa.
4) using bottom of the barrel units for his R:TW armies
Here is a replay of Mutianu (aka [ROM]xxx_Mutianu_xxx]). He just played this warm-up game today, but he was actually on the phone with his agent so he was a little distracted.
Mutianu's Army (SPQR)
- 2 Incendiary Pigs (plus general)
- 6 Town Watch
- 6 Equites
- 2 Roman Archers
Mutianu apologizes for not being able to play a proper game, but his modeling career is dominating his time. When you're watching the video, keep an eye out for several things:
1) the Smiling Face Formation
2) the speed of Town Watch (Mutianu prefers them over Urban Cohorts)
3) the Rope-a-Dope Retreat (he has a few pages devoted to this maneuver in his book of theories)
4) here's something that you can't see, but at the beginning of the match, Mutianu supposedly told his opponent "thanks for the elephants."
In any case, here's the video replay:
Mutianu will be in Romania for a few days. He said he'll be revising his Rome: Total War Theories while he's home.
Hehe if you think thats impressive you are missing a few points:
snook384 is a complete idiot
that army really isn't that bad with the amount of ups on the units, the town watch has 2 exp 3 sword 3 shield so will not be running any time soon.
Also try this out: take 2 elephants for the enemy for yourself take 6 two watch 2 exp 3 sword 3 shield and two roman archers and 2 pigs. that is what the eles went lone warriors on and you will be suprised what happens. or just 6 town watch and 2 archers if he keked up the pigs. when i did this the enemy routed with only killing 1 man of mine.
next the remaining town watch faced the 4 pikes(had no ups from what i could see in vid. now as the eles had a bit of a go at the town watch before they were routed. try re enacting this vs the cpu, take 3 town watch with same ups as above and just 4 equites with 1 exp 3 sword 3 shield and just engage with the town watch then equites from behind and they will rout.
so meh i think its just prince going online and pretending to be this chappy btw no one that legendary plays 10k either - only prince :hmmm:
Hehe if you think thats impressive you are missing a few points:
snook384 is a complete idiot
As I said, Mutianu popped in a for a random game. I said in the very first post that Mutianu was sorry that he didn't have time for a proper game.
Also try this out: take 2 elephants for the enemy for yourself take 6 two watch 2 exp 3 sword 3 shield and two roman archers and 2 pigs. that is what the eles went lone warriors on and you will be suprised what happens. or just 6 town watch and 2 archers if he keked up the pigs. when i did this the enemy routed with only killing 1 man of mine.
You can't really isolate that aspect of the battle. Mutianu created the matchups he wanted to through maneuver and judgement.
so meh i think its just prince going online and pretending to be this chappy btw no one that legendary plays 10k either - only prince :hmmm:
Mutianu actually plays at 12.5k+. But I asked him to play a 10k so that I could try to emulate him myself.
Besides, that couldn't be me. We've actually played against each other before.
Last edited by Prince_of_Macedon; November 29, 2007 at 12:29 PM.
Mutianu: Profile of a Player Slayer
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Originally Posted by WaynehMarls
I'm not trying to sound disrespectful or anything, the guy is obviously good, but come on! Now I really regret I don't play online, even though I'm about as fast as a snail with paralysis - even so, I'd still be able to make an army that's worth something against this smiling face.
)
