Illyria and Illyrians

[misplacedgeneral]

Hello all.

I've noticed that the Illyrians are not present as a faction in EB (obviously) but that some units available to the Epirotes are Illyrian.

So after that statement of the blatantly-obvious, I ask why are they not a faction.

My guess is the limited amount of factions allowed.

Historically, they were certainly active (Phillip and Alexander each campaigned against them, though the next mention of them that I can think of, historically, would be those events leading to the Roman interventions against queen Tueta. Polybius makes it evident that the tribes were to an extent unified before hand.

[starXdiaMoo]

Are you implying by any chance that the EB team should include Illyria as a faction? I do not think this will ever happen, my friend..

[Shqiponja_Hayabusa]

Maybe not an illiryrian faction but still better units.There are three iliyrian units in Eb and they all belong to the rebels.Illyrian cav,illyrian spearmen and illyrian pirate.As much as I find these new units some how historical,not that pretty though,I think that the illyrian units in the 0.78 were more fit to represent the illyrians units in the game.

Starxdia-maybe you should have written "imlying"

[starXdiaMoo]

Maybe not an illiryrian faction but still better units.There are three iliyrian units in Eb and they all belong to the rebels.Illyrian cav,illyrian spearmen and illyrian pirate.As much as I find these new units some how historical,not that pretty though,I think that the illyrian units in the 0.78 were more fit to represent the illyrians units in the game.

Starxdia-maybe you should have written "imlying"

Sure, but what you think is not what will be added to the game, I am afraid I may want the KH to have super-technological pre-cataclysmic weapons (as I believe in the Golden Age), which has more chance of being added to the game than an Illyrian faction or more-better-stronger Illyrian units (as you may believe because of your ethnicity, dreaming you are descended from those ancient and long extinct people)

Edit: Why should I change my name to ''imlying'', by the way?

[MarcusAureliusAntoninus]

Illyrians are not a faction because they were not unified or powerful at the start date. Philip and Alexander had fought them and they were very weak at this time. There was discussion for a single Illyrian tribe for EB2...

[Ludens]

So after that statement of the blatantly-obvious, I ask why are they not a faction.

My guess is the limited amount of factions allowed.

You are correct, but IIRC they also were far less powerful (possibly because their main kingdom disintegrated) after being put down by Phillip and Alexander. Still, someone tipped them of as being a candidate faction for EB2.

[misplacedgeneral]

"You are correct, but IIRC they also were far less powerful (possibly because their main kingdom disintegrated) after being put down by Phillip and Alexander. Still, someone tipped them of as being a candidate faction for EB2."

Not at the start date, as Marcus just said, but by 230 or so, they were strong enough and unified enough to warrant Roman attention.

"Edit: Why should I change my name to ''imlying'', by the way?"

Not your name, he meant instead of "Are you implementing" to have "Are you implying"

Thank you for the prompt answer.

[starXdiaMoo]

"You are correct, but IIRC they also were far less powerful (possibly because their main kingdom disintegrated) after being put down by Phillip and Alexander. Still, someone tipped them of as being a candidate faction for EB2."

Not at the start date, as Marcus just said, but by 230 or so, they were strong enough and unified enough to warrant Roman attention.

"Edit: Why should I change my name to ''imlying'', by the way?"

Not your name, he meant instead of "Are you implementing" to have "Are you implying"

Thank you for the prompt answer.

Shoot! Thanks for the correction then!

[Ludens]

Not at the start date, as Marcus just said, but by 230 or so, they were strong enough and unified enough to warrant Roman attention.

Wasn't that because Macedon was extending its sphere of influence in the area by making strategic alliances rather than the Illyrian tribes unifying by themselves? I do know that the Illyrian theatre during the second Punic war consisted mainly of Illyrian tribes supported by Rome fighting Illyrian tribes supported by Macedon.

[misplacedgeneral]

No, that was the Greek Achaean and Aetolian leagues. The Illyrian tribes under Agron were considered to have the strongest navy and army ever possessed by an Illyrian ruler. The Makedonians actually used the Illyrians to counter the Aetolians when they besieged Medion.

[Ludens]

No, that was the Greek Achaean and Aetolian leagues. The Illyrian tribes under Agron were considered to have the strongest navy and army ever possessed by an Illyrian ruler. The Makedonians actually used the Illyrians to counter the Aetolians when they besieged Medion.

I admit I am out of my depth here, but if you ask me the Achaean and Aetolian leagues operated strictly within Greece.

Also, the fact that Macedon could get the Illyrians to do jobs for them doesn't suggest the Illyrians were that strong politically, now does it?

[Keravnos]

Illyrians were important historically and they did have a unique culture. What they lacked however was the unity and organisation needed to build a unified faction, and an empire. Teuta and Argon aside, who could have united the Illyrians, it just didn't happen. They had excellent sea raiders (that EB depicts as units), ships, some of which were found recently at the coast of Croatia, unique helmets for their men, all the basics to build an empire, but just didn't add the different elements together for that.

Thraikians were of the same fate. Many great warlike tribes, which fought for everyone around them with great success, but ultimately couldn't unite.