Why do they hesitate?

**The Phoenician** · October 03, 2007, 04:58 AM

I stopped playing M2TW ages ago then decided to play RTW again. I downloaded the EB mod for it. After playing M2TX, Im sure people would think the combat for RTW is pretty bad but is it me or when certain units are attacking their enemies they kind of hesitate like( they try to stab..pull their hands before actually hitting someone then go for a stab again or a slash, it happens with block too). I have been playing RTW since the day it was released but i dont know why i never noticed it. Is it a bug? is there a mod or patch that fixes it? I have the 1.5 patch.

**Selifator** · October 03, 2007, 05:15 AM

Maybe it has to do with attack speed of different units. RTW has a quite unique combat engine, so maybe this is just the way it goes :hmmm:

**The Phoenician** · October 03, 2007, 06:10 AM

im not sure. I saw 1 vs 1 fight and this guy would block a hundred times and he wasnt getting hit. its wierd coz i just saw a rtw video and they seemed to fight fine.

**LuciusCato** · October 03, 2007, 06:22 AM

It makes me laugh when units go to attack, pause then get killed. Overall it does not seem to affect the outcome of the battle, in way it could be a realism plus, some men would rather defend themselves than attack all the time...

**The Phoenician** · October 03, 2007, 06:34 AM

Originally Posted by LuciusCato

It makes me laugh when units go to attack, pause then get killed. Overall it does not seem to affect the outcome of the battle, in way it could be a realism plus, some men would rather defend themselves than attack all the time...

Lol. it could be realism but it gets annoying though when you keep seeing them attacking this way as if they had not made there mind. I mean come on! I had a swordsman trying to kill someone from BEHIND and he would start to dodge and when the swordsman was about stab him he changes his mind either for a block or an attack (and hesitate again!) But still a great game though lol.

**Prince_of_Macedon** · October 03, 2007, 04:04 PM

Originally Posted by The Phoenician

I stopped playing M2TW ages ago then decided to play RTW again. I downloaded the EB mod for it. After playing M2TX, Im sure people would think the combat for RTW is pretty bad but is it me or when certain units are attacking their enemies they kind of hesitate like( they try to stab..pull their hands before actually hitting someone then go for a stab again or a slash, it happens with block too). I have been playing RTW since the day it was released but i dont know why i never noticed it. Is it a bug? is there a mod or patch that fixes it? I have the 1.5 patch.

Maybe after each thrust they get tired? Not sure, but there are all kinds of glitches/bugs in the game (i.e. corpses floating in the air).

**Domitius** · October 04, 2007, 09:30 AM

I've noticed that this often happen with cavalry, and I'm not sure, but could it have to do with the formations? If they leave one person they have to wait for him to join the attack. I think that's why they hesitate. They have improved this in Medieval2 where the persons move more freely.

**Vault Dweller** · October 05, 2007, 11:16 PM

I don't kno if it is a bug, but if it is, it's a damn realistic one. Some soldiers might prefer to block, and some might be hesitant to draw blood. I've seen stuff like it in Baldur's Gate, where it definately wasn't a bug, but meant to represent all the feints etc. in real life.

**Pius Aeneas** · October 06, 2007, 03:30 PM

The thing about RTW is that each unit acts as a single unit, meaning that even if you have about 200 men in one, they still react as one, which accounts for their weird movements. I've seen instances when a soldier is getting hit even though he's 50 meters away from the action.

**Shaun** · October 06, 2007, 04:31 PM

Originally Posted by The Phoenician

I stopped playing M2TW ages ago then decided to play RTW again. I downloaded the EB mod for it. After playing M2TX, Im sure people would think the combat for RTW is pretty bad but is it me or when certain units are attacking their enemies they kind of hesitate like( they try to stab..pull their hands before actually hitting someone then go for a stab again or a slash, it happens with block too). I have been playing RTW since the day it was released but i dont know why i never noticed it. Is it a bug? is there a mod or patch that fixes it? I have the 1.5 patch.

Well, I'm sure you too would hesitate if being sent to your death upon the spears of the Spartans. See, realism.

**Domitius** · October 07, 2007, 04:21 AM

Maybe it's realistic, but have the creators thought about this? I don't think so, but that's my personal opinion. To think of something like hesitation isn't completely stupid, but this "bug" happens to all units, which wasn't the situation in real life where the more experienced units ran directly into the enemies.

**Vault Dweller** · October 09, 2007, 01:48 AM

Not neccesarily. No matter how experienced someone was, they still wouldn't feel comfortable running into a wall of pikes or a charging line of elephants.

**Metellus** · October 09, 2007, 09:08 AM

I remember reading or hearing something from the devs, saying that whereas in RTW individual men basically just go through a set of animations near each other (swing, block, duck, etc) making it "look" like they are interacting with each other, in M2TW they are actually reacting appropriately to each other's actions (therefore no strange animations when no enemies are close to an individual man).

**Orkunion** · October 13, 2007, 02:13 AM

why not go and ask in their forum.. They ll know better than anyone else.

**Metellus** · October 15, 2007, 03:31 AM

Yeah I remember now, it was on one of the Behind the Scenes CDs in the Total War Eras box set.

**Domitius** · October 15, 2007, 05:51 AM

Behind which scene? This isn't a movie, this is a game. But I think you're right, they don't interact with the other mens actions and are therefore just syncronised as a group. It works though, and that's the main thing right?

**Metellus** · October 16, 2007, 02:32 AM

^^ The TW:Eras game compilation (Shogun > Rome) had a Behind the Scenes/Making Of DVD with interviews of the game designers where they mentioned what was going to change between Rome and Medieval 2.

As to whether it works, you do get times when the Rome men are interacting with enemies that aren't anywhere near, because they aren't in fact interacting. With Medieval 2 that should be nonexistent because the men are in fact interacting with each other (they single out their enemies, I recall the devs mentioning that as well).